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Is aspergers existence proven scientifically?

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gaffa91
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11 May 2012, 11:22 am

Sweetleaf wrote:
that grocery store must be pretty close :?

Offtopic, but yes, it was a pretty close. About 300 meters from my home.



pokerface
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11 May 2012, 11:22 am

gaffa91 wrote:
pokerface wrote:
The existance of aspergers has been proven by scans. Certain parts of the brain of people with aspergers are a bit different.

More information about these scans, please. Do you have any link about those studies?


I have seen a news item on British television that showed how several people with aspergers where diagnosed by means of a scan. It is a relatively new development but it's certainly out there. The scan showed different anomalies of the brain as far as I can remember.



Last edited by pokerface on 11 May 2012, 11:26 am, edited 1 time in total.

gaffa91
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11 May 2012, 11:25 am

pokerface wrote:
I have seen a news item on British television that showed how several people with aspergers where diagnosed by means of a scan. It is a relatively new development but it's certainly out there. The scan showed different anamolies of the brain as far as I can remember.

OK, I believe you, you have no reason to lie. Thanks for the answer, I never said that asperger's has to be a "fake disease". I just wanted to know does it exist.



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11 May 2012, 11:26 am

With these scans is a it a specific brain difference.....or they've just found various differences that seem more common in people with AS? I mean just my personal theory but I'm thinking maybe the symptoms don't always have the exact same cause. So though such scans could be useful I would hate to see someone have to match up to some single very specific difference in order to get a diagnoses and thus help with their symptoms.

I mean if someone has the symptoms and are struggling with them.....would it be very rational to just send them on their way as 'normal' and expect them to just get over it on account of a doctor not finding what they wanted on a brain scan? just have to throw that possibility out there as well.


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11 May 2012, 11:32 am

gaffa91 wrote:
pokerface wrote:
I have seen a news item on British television that showed how several people with aspergers where diagnosed by means of a scan. It is a relatively new development but it's certainly out there. The scan showed different anamolies of the brain as far as I can remember.

OK, I believe you, you have no reason to lie. Thanks for the answer, I never said that asperger's has to be a "fake disease". I just wanted to know does it exist.


Than why are you on this forum if you have doubts about the existence of aspergers. What are you doing here?
You are aware of the fact that this is a forum for people with aspergers aren't you!

By the way, I think that brainscans can be a more objective, accurate and solid method to diagnose aspergers than all of these silly tests that are currently used.



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11 May 2012, 11:34 am

pokerface wrote:
gaffa91 wrote:
pokerface wrote:
I have seen a news item on British television that showed how several people with aspergers where diagnosed by means of a scan. It is a relatively new development but it's certainly out there. The scan showed different anamolies of the brain as far as I can remember.

OK, I believe you, you have no reason to lie. Thanks for the answer, I never said that asperger's has to be a "fake disease". I just wanted to know does it exist.


Than why are you on this forum if you have doubts about the existence of aspergers. What are you doing here?
You are aware of the fact that this is a forum for people with aspergers aren't you!

By the way, I think that brainscans can be a more objective, accurate and solid method to diagnose aspergers than all of these silly tests that are currently used.



Well to be fair I don't think having no doubt about the existence of aspergers is a requirement to be here. Some people do question their diagnoses as well as the validity of the diagnoses itself.


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gaffa91
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11 May 2012, 11:42 am

Well really I don't want to have aspergers because it usually means lower income, lower quality of life, greater risk of depression and suicide and the list goes on. Actually I usually can't stand aspergers and have to deal with it. I just WANT it wouldn't exist. It's so god damn unfair and this syndrome is rare too, why I have to have this syndrome, it's just unfair!



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11 May 2012, 12:04 pm

gaffa91 wrote:
Well really I don't want to have aspergers because it usually means lower income, lower quality of life, greater risk of depression and suicide and the list goes on. Actually I usually can't stand aspergers and have to deal with it. I just WANT it wouldn't exist. It's so god damn unfair and this syndrome is rare too, why I have to have this syndrome, it's just unfair!


Don't worry, after the DSM 5 comes out you won't have Aspergers anymore. You'll be able to get a high paying job, your quality of life will improve, depression and suicide will be a thing of the past.



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11 May 2012, 12:10 pm

I've wondered if everybody with what we call aspergers all have the same physical cause. I'm inclined to believe that they don't, that there are different physical causes for disorders with very similar or identical expression.



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11 May 2012, 12:17 pm

Rascal77s wrote:
gaffa91 wrote:
Well really I don't want to have aspergers because it usually means lower income, lower quality of life, greater risk of depression and suicide and the list goes on. Actually I usually can't stand aspergers and have to deal with it. I just WANT it wouldn't exist. It's so god damn unfair and this syndrome is rare too, why I have to have this syndrome, it's just unfair!


Don't worry, after the DSM 5 comes out you won't have Aspergers anymore. You'll be able to get a high paying job, your quality of life will improve, depression and suicide will be a thing of the past.


On the contrary!
The term asperger syndrom will disappear in the near future only to be replaced by the term high funcioning autism, which can mean just about anything when it comes to autism.

I don't think that that will improve our chances in life.



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11 May 2012, 12:29 pm

It's the same for OCD, Tourette's, depression, bipolar disorder, etc.

The condition is first recognized by behavior, which is then, after some study, formulated into diagnostic criteria.

Then, as technology advances various scans and physical tests are done to study the group that meets those behavioral criteria. When some correlation to a physical state is found the condition is given a name (I.e. fragile X, Rett's syndrome).

If no test finds a correlation to something physical that does not mean that the condition "doesn't exist." It only means either that current technology is inadequate or the physical diffence is physically subtle and possibly also very complex (i.e. structure of white matter tracts).



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11 May 2012, 12:33 pm

Apple_in_my_Eye wrote:
It's the same for OCD, Tourette's, depression, bipolar disorder, etc.

The condition is first recognized by behavior, which is then, after some study, formulated into diagnostic criteria.

Then, as technology advances various scans and physical tests are done to study the group that meets those behavioral criteria. When some correlation to a physical state is found the condition is given a name (I.e. fragile X, Rett's syndrome).

If no test finds a correlation to something physical that does not mean that the condition "doesn't exist." It only means either that current technology is inadequate or the physical diffence is physically subtle and possibly also very complex (i.e. structure of white matter tracts).



Very true!



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11 May 2012, 12:45 pm

Quote:
Abstract

Background: Autistic Spectrum Disorder (ASD), including Asperger syndrome and autism, is a highly genetic neurodevelopmental disorder. There is a consensus that ASD has a biological basis, and it has been proposed that it is a “connectivity” disorder. Diffusion Tensor Magnetic Resonance Imaging (DT-MRI) allows measurement of the microstructural integrity of white matter (a proxy measure of “connectivity”). However, nobody has investigated the microstructural integrity of whole brain white matter in people with Asperger syndrome. Methods: We measured the fractional anisotropy (FA), mean diffusivity (MD) and radial diffusivity (RD) of white matter, using DT-MRI, in 13 adults with Asperger syndrome and 13 controls. The groups did not differ significantly in overall intelligence and age. FA, MD and RD were assessed using whole brain voxel-based techniques. Results: Adults with Asperger syndrome had a significantly lower FA than controls in 13 clusters. These were largely bilateral and included white matter in the internal capsule, frontal, temporal, parietal and occipital lobes, cingulum and corpus callosum. Conclusions: Adults with Asperger syndrome have widespread significant differences from controls in white matter microstructural integrity.


http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/aur.146/abstract



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11 May 2012, 1:12 pm

OP, search PubMed or Google Scholar for "autism" or "asperger's" to find studies on structural and functional differences in the brains of people with ASD.



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11 May 2012, 2:46 pm

10 August 2010

"New brain scan to diagnose autism"

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-10929032

Detected ASDs "with 90% accuracy" but Frith not so upbeat.

I wish they'd get on with it. :evil:



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11 May 2012, 2:59 pm

gaffa91 wrote:
Otherwise there is absolutely no sense diagnosing aspergers if there is no 100% prove about it.


But there is proof of it. Thousands of individuals have been observed that display behavioral patterns that match the diagnostic criteria for Asperger's. The exact cause of the disorder doesn't need to be known for it to be real.

Ellingtonia answered your question adequately back on page 1. The cause of a disorder does not need to be known before the disorder can be considered real.

gaffa91 wrote:
You didn't really answer a question: is there even such a thing as asperger's, or is it just a diagnosis based on certain traits, not a brain difference?


Umm... personality traits are brain differences, and brain differences are personality traits. Simple as that.