No, We are Not Normal

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As I said before, it's a null word.



1) Either there is no normal-- a point on which I agree-- or there is a normal. If there is a normal, and we're it, we're apparently the only normality in a world of wacky, which would make us not normal anyway.

The point is not to accept ourselves as normal. Not only would that be crap, but it would be a self-destructive delusion.

2) Dude, we're about as united as the Democratic party. Which is probably as it should be. I think that, united, we would be a force to reckon with, but I am not entirely sure that would be such a spiffy thing. We've got a lot of hate and resentment that we, as a community, really need to just get the expletive over.

We are not normal. This is not a bad thing, because nobody is normal. There is something "wrong" with us. This is both a good and bad thing. But there is no reason not to be proud. The fact that I have lasted almost 34 years in the NT world, much of it without any help from anybody, is something I am impressed with. The fact that I did it without snapping and beating some fool to death with a clawhammer is just amazing. I don't know if that is an aspie thing or not-- I seem to deal with a lot of fools.

Quit worrying about normal. Worry about being exceptional.

I don't think I have ever seen a normal person.

Me neither.

Just lots of really boring ones.

That's one of the reason I enjoy it here so much; not many of those around here...

Ehm, who has?

ADHD and AS are social constructs (look it up in Wikipedia) made by psychiatrists. They've become big fads in Europe and America, put on problem children with poor breeding, by psychiatrists.

To me there is no such thing as normal, because no one is perfect.

Especially not people with AS.

This is an interesting discussion and it is clear that people have a wide array of opinions of this.

1. If you want to damn me, fine, that is your right.
2. If normal is defined as "naturally occurring" then fine, you are normal. But most definitions of the word normal involve "conforming to a type, standard, or regular pattern(1)" or "the normal state or condition(2)." One definition is even "free from mental disorder.(3)" It seems by the standard english language definitions those of us with Asperger's simply are not normal. We are human, they is no doubt about that. Saying "not normal" is entirely differently from saying "not human."

EDIT: Regular people may have issues, yes, and we have some of the same kinds of issues they have. But we have a whole range of issues that they don't. And perhaps we don't have some issues they they do. There is a more standard way for people to operate and we don't operate that way.

3. I could care less how you live your life. Live your life as you want, and say what you want. But don't expect me to magically adopt new ideological opinions because I have been diagnosed with AS.

(1)Merriam-Webster's Dictionary
(2)Oxford Compact Dictionary
(3)Merriam-Webster's Dictionary

"Normal" is an identity statement, not a judgement of value.

Just got out of a face to face whith a "normal" person I know from decades, and I feel thorougly devastated. Emptied, my bubble in shambles. I always say yes, I will see you, out of some hope in some little help. It’s never that way, I should know but I am too weak to say no, to give up this little hope. The only people who understand what living in the bubble is like are those living in the bubble themselves. Period.

We appear to be rowing around each other in circles. Agreement seems not to be on the horizon.

EDIT: Then again, this is to be expected. It would be unfortunate if it were otherwise.

Last edited by jimservo on 20 Dec 2006, 3:42 pm, edited 2 times in total.

I'm sorry you had a crappy experience today. I wish I could give you a hug. Here's a virtual hug. It's the best I can do. {{{{{{{{{{{{{{{hug}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

My recipe for crappy days: petting my dog, singing a happy song, dancing and being silly, making faces at the person being a jerk, taking a walk, talking to a friend, reading a good book, drinking some tea, taking a bubblebath by candle light, etc. But the very best thing to do is to remember not to take it personal. We are all very special people, created by God to be just the way we are. The world would not be the same without us.

It is neither. It is a word and has definitions. Would it be correct to say that people with AS are "average?" Of course not, that would be ridiculous. It is not harmful to be honest about what a word actual means. Why does "abnormal" mean bad? Who stated that this was so? Ironically those who are claiming the title of normal upon themselves as a positive arbitrary make the title abnormal as a negative (this is not to sully their positive intentions). It's abnormal to be born without arms but there isn't anything wrong with that. Words are more then identity statements.

Everyone on earth has some mental disorder or other to at least a minor degree.

Its called neurodiversity.

My question is why is my disorder unacceptable but yours is? Why must I change when yours is accepted?

The majority is not right or wrong the majority simply is. It cannot prove or disprove anything other than the fact that it exists.

Being a member of a minority doesnt make your views any less important or necessarily mean you should change yourself to conform.

The majority is a shifting organism where a minority view spreads and becomes the new majority to assume a view is incorrect or should be givin up in favor of majority agreement does everyone a disservice.

Fraya, I think I will let you have the last word on this, at least over me. Four pages of arguments over one issue is somewhat stressful. I am tempted to response but I know that means I will be committing myself to further responses.

I just need a break from this serious stuff.

First of all, You've got the concept of Neurdiversity way wrong.



In other words, Neurodiversity is a PR campaign to make it so that people don't treat us like freaks. It has nothing to do with NTs having "mental disorders," as you say. Yes, there are subtle variations in how everyone is wired, even among NTs, but to make it a disorder it actually has to cause a problem.



Everyone has to change themselves to conform. Everyone. Look at the variety of cultures and social practices all over the globe. These people had to each learn their social customs and whatnot, they weren't inborn. They just learned it better than we did.

Why should you change? Well...

Assuming that the most pessimistic figure I have heard is correct and represents the total world population and not just new births and/or just a certain segment of the population, 1 in 166 people are on the autistic spectrum. I've never been completely clear on what that figure exactly means, but for the sake of argument let's just generalize to the highest number possible.

With that figure, 99.4% of the population is not on the autistic spectrum. Are you suggesting that this vast majority should alter everything about the way that they do things so that it is comfortable for you? We're not talking about providing a wheelchair-accessible bathroom and braille on signs here, Fraya, we're talking about altering the entire civilization to accomodate six tenths of one percent.

Are you suggesting that we outlaw body language? I can't read body language very well, and that can be a real problem in dealing with people. So do we have to wipe it out from the culture entirely? Or must everyone else learn to accomodate us?

Well, we can't really do either. There's no way to eradicate something from a culture like that, especially when most of the people who use body language do so without thinking about it. Can you imagine some NT actually saying to himself, "Well, my wife says she's fine, even though her body language is clearly indicating that she's going to fly off the handle if I don't do something right now. However, we're trying to remove this form of communication from the culture, so I'd better just ignore that and wait until she explodes. It'll be worth it, though, because my grandson, or great-grandson, will live in a world where that kind of warning system doesn't exist. It will be much better when his wife just suddenly snaps and he has no idea why."

Eeeeyeaaah, I don't see it either.

Have you seen the movie Harrison Bergeron (or read the story it's loosely based on)? It's set in a world where everyone is equal-- or else. If you are a professional tennis player, and you're really good, you're given a trick racket so that you don't have an advantage over the other players. That way, nobody gets left out and nobody feels bad. Of course, if you're too SMART, they slap this band on your head to make you less intelligent, and if that doesn't work, they lobotomize you.

And as far as training everyone else to deal with us--- well, that's just stupid. Seriously. We'd have to tack on an extra year or two to public schooling, probably in the second grade, to make sure that everyone knows how to adjust their behavior so that some people don't have to. And it can't just be us... each child would have to be trained in every language spoken, plus every dialect of sign language, plus instructions on how to assist people with other kinds of disabilities.