would you be able to tell danial tammet has autism?

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wtfid2
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26 Dec 2012, 6:44 am

not-all savants are impaired. Tammet is impaired..he has autism.


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nessa238
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26 Dec 2012, 6:50 am

wtfid2 wrote:
not-all savants are impaired. Tammet is impaired..he has autism.


if you say so :roll:



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26 Dec 2012, 7:21 am

nessa238 wrote:
I like having my own views on things. As Asperger's is such in imprecise thing ie not scientific or not proved scientifically yet, it's impossible for any one person to be more 'correct' than another. So my opinion is as valid as anyone else's. I would say I think a genetic cause is the most likely one.


On the contrary, autism as a spectrum has been extensively documented, including documentation of common morbidities such as epilepsy. Your opinion does not carry the same weight as existing empirical evidence. It is well within your rights to believe in things that aren't true, but the fact that you believe them doesn't somehow make them equal to information that contradicts your views.

Also, drawing from a sample of two people is not remotely conclusive.



wtfid2
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26 Dec 2012, 7:28 am

what dyou mean if i say so? It is a fact that not all savants are impaired.
Tammet is impaired with his epilepsy and aspergers.


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Last edited by wtfid2 on 26 Dec 2012, 7:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

nessa238
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26 Dec 2012, 7:31 am

Verdandi wrote:
nessa238 wrote:
I like having my own views on things. As Asperger's is such in imprecise thing ie not scientific or not proved scientifically yet, it's impossible for any one person to be more 'correct' than another. So my opinion is as valid as anyone else's. I would say I think a genetic cause is the most likely one.


On the contrary, autism as a spectrum has been extensively documented, including documentation of common morbidities such as epilepsy. Your opinion does not carry the same weight as existing empirical evidence. It is well within your rights to believe in things that aren't true, but the fact that you believe them doesn't somehow make them equal to information that contradicts your views.

Also, drawing from a sample of two people is not remotely conclusive.


Yes, I anticipated this type of reply from yourself

What I meant was that there is still no definitive test for autism or Aspergers so how are we to know that any of the people used in this empirical evidence were on the autistic spectrum?

Documenting something is not the same as proving it

It's all hypothesis and observation, not scientific like medicine.

Also, when Hans Asperger and Kanner made their original observations about the children they were studying, these were children with schizophrenia

And yet you never see people with ASD allying themselves with people with schizophrenia, even though this is the group of people who were being studied when Autism and Asperger's Syndrome were discovered

Doesn't this strike you as odd? Why don't people generally want to be associated with the very group of people from whom their own condition was discovered?

Autism is a sub-set of schizophrenia basically



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26 Dec 2012, 7:35 am

wtfid2 wrote:
what dyou mean if i say so? It is a fact that not all savants are impaired..get yourself a dang education and dont roll your eyes at me and then complain to the mods that you dont want to interact with me.
the nerve.
Tammet is impaired with his epilepsy and aspergers.


I was agreeing with you as it's easier than having a row



wtfid2
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26 Dec 2012, 7:38 am

nessa238 wrote:
wtfid2 wrote:
what dyou mean if i say so? It is a fact that not all savants are impaired..get yourself a dang education and dont roll your eyes at me and then complain to the mods that you dont want to interact with me.
the nerve.
Tammet is impaired with his epilepsy and aspergers.


I was agreeing with you as it's easier than having a row
is a row an argument?


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nessa238
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26 Dec 2012, 7:45 am

wtfid2 wrote:
nessa238 wrote:
wtfid2 wrote:
what dyou mean if i say so? It is a fact that not all savants are impaired..get yourself a dang education and dont roll your eyes at me and then complain to the mods that you dont want to interact with me.
the nerve.
Tammet is impaired with his epilepsy and aspergers.


I was agreeing with you as it's easier than having a row
is a row an argument?


Yes and I'm keen to avoid one



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26 Dec 2012, 9:06 am

He seems to have used his savant syndrome to compensate for his autistic traits, to a great degree. I would be willing to bet that he used some of the same strategies I do--except that with a much bigger memory to depend on, they're more effective for him. For example, keeping a list of useful things to say, so you don't have to make up your own sentences on the spot. Or looking at facial expressions, copying them to use when you need them. Things like that.

Yeah, he's impaired, but he's also quite talented in ways that don't have to do with savant syndrome; he is good at writing and good at putting concepts together, which probably make him a competent student. There's nothing that stops autistic people (or disabled people in general) from having strong talents.


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26 Dec 2012, 10:59 am

nessa238 wrote:
I like having my own views on things. As Asperger's is such in imprecise thing ie not scientific or not proved scientifically yet, it's impossible for any one person to be more 'correct' than another. So my opinion is as valid as anyone else's. I would say I think a genetic cause is the most likely one.

I have met two people with epilepsy. One, a friend, had to have a large brain tumour removed when younger and this entailed severing his optic nerve which made him blind. It also affected him neurologically/cognitively ie it slowed down his thinking and focusing abilities and I think this is why we got on ie our thinking processes were slowed down hence he didn't have the usual impatience most NTs have with me. He also had epilepsy but it's not clear to me whether this was caused by the tumour or if he had a propensity towards developing it beforehand as he told me that as a child he used to bang his head a lot, which indicates some kind of brain disturbance or other.

Another person who had epilepsy was attending the same autism meetings to try and get services sorted out in my town and was saying she was autistic although hadn't been diagnosed. She was already involved with MENCAP and other learning disability groups and it was clear she had a learning disability. She did nothing to help me set up the group and was incredibly ignorant as regards even bothering to reply to my emails and as she had set up her own 'train employers to be less prejudiced against people with learning disabilities' business which had no work, it became clear she only saw the autism support group I was setting up as a possible route to work for her business. I realised she was not on the autistic spectrum at all and as NT as they come.
I had a short row with her on Facebook in which she was incredibly NT and it added to my theory that 99.9% of people with a LD are indeed very NT. She was also writing her life story which was incredibly long and boring as f-k. I felt that due to her LD she had been indulged to think she was far more intelligent and insightful than she was in reality and she really really irritated me.
Nevertheless, during the few meetings with the council she did attend I stood up for her to get people to listen when she wanted to speak as her slowness meant she wasn't being given the airspace to talk.

So, two people with epilepsy, neither with an ASD but one was sort of on my wavelength due to his slower cognitive function and the other I could have happily punched she was so annoying and self-serving!

I'm never in awe of these savant/celebrity Asperger etc types from the word go - they have to prove their credentials to me. I have looked into 'The Daniel Tammet Phenomenon' and lost interest quickly as I just didn't take to him.

I can envisage a lot of people with an ASD eagerly listening to him in rapt wonder though and that is why people like him will always be able to make a living. Not out of people like me though.


That's cool. I'm not in awe of him or any other famous person for any reason. Tammet hasn't made a dime from me.

He seems quite Aspie to me, and I guess it really doesn't matter to me whether it's the epilepsy or true Asperger's. People are who they are. I don't care what their credentials are. He's an interesting character for a few minutes on TV, but to tell you the truth, I don't think I could stand being around him for long since he seems to me to only be interested in talking about himself and his own interests.

A very aspie trait truth be told, and that alone was the strongest evidence for me. He's got the characteristics. What caused them I really don't care.


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26 Dec 2012, 11:23 am

MrXxx wrote:
nessa238 wrote:
I like having my own views on things. As Asperger's is such in imprecise thing ie not scientific or not proved scientifically yet, it's impossible for any one person to be more 'correct' than another. So my opinion is as valid as anyone else's. I would say I think a genetic cause is the most likely one.

I have met two people with epilepsy. One, a friend, had to have a large brain tumour removed when younger and this entailed severing his optic nerve which made him blind. It also affected him neurologically/cognitively ie it slowed down his thinking and focusing abilities and I think this is why we got on ie our thinking processes were slowed down hence he didn't have the usual impatience most NTs have with me. He also had epilepsy but it's not clear to me whether this was caused by the tumour or if he had a propensity towards developing it beforehand as he told me that as a child he used to bang his head a lot, which indicates some kind of brain disturbance or other.

Another person who had epilepsy was attending the same autism meetings to try and get services sorted out in my town and was saying she was autistic although hadn't been diagnosed. She was already involved with MENCAP and other learning disability groups and it was clear she had a learning disability. She did nothing to help me set up the group and was incredibly ignorant as regards even bothering to reply to my emails and as she had set up her own 'train employers to be less prejudiced against people with learning disabilities' business which had no work, it became clear she only saw the autism support group I was setting up as a possible route to work for her business. I realised she was not on the autistic spectrum at all and as NT as they come.
I had a short row with her on Facebook in which she was incredibly NT and it added to my theory that 99.9% of people with a LD are indeed very NT. She was also writing her life story which was incredibly long and boring as f-k. I felt that due to her LD she had been indulged to think she was far more intelligent and insightful than she was in reality and she really really irritated me.
Nevertheless, during the few meetings with the council she did attend I stood up for her to get people to listen when she wanted to speak as her slowness meant she wasn't being given the airspace to talk.

So, two people with epilepsy, neither with an ASD but one was sort of on my wavelength due to his slower cognitive function and the other I could have happily punched she was so annoying and self-serving!

I'm never in awe of these savant/celebrity Asperger etc types from the word go - they have to prove their credentials to me. I have looked into 'The Daniel Tammet Phenomenon' and lost interest quickly as I just didn't take to him.

I can envisage a lot of people with an ASD eagerly listening to him in rapt wonder though and that is why people like him will always be able to make a living. Not out of people like me though.


That's cool. I'm not in awe of him or any other famous person for any reason. Tammet hasn't made a dime from me.

He seems quite Aspie to me, and I guess it really doesn't matter to me whether it's the epilepsy or true Asperger's. People are who they are. I don't care what their credentials are. He's an interesting character for a few minutes on TV, but to tell you the truth, I don't think I could stand being around him for long since he seems to me to only be interested in talking about himself and his own interests.

A very aspie trait truth be told, and that alone was the strongest evidence for me. He's got the characteristics. What caused them I really don't care.


Fair point

I think I have skipped through his book and also heard some of it serialised on the radio and I remember a part where he talks about his frustration at dropping a piece of cutlery on the floor and it making him scream. I thought this was bizarre considering his skill in the other areas and while dropping cutlery would make me annoyed, I wouldn't scream outwardly and it made me feel sorry for his partner, having to live with such immaturity, which Daniel Tammet appeared to be trying to justify as just a facet of his autism. No, he was being a childish brat!



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26 Dec 2012, 11:28 am

nessa238 wrote:
I remember a part where he talks about his frustration at dropping a piece of cutlery on the floor and it making him scream. I thought this was bizarre considering his skill in the other areas and while dropping cutlery would make me annoyed, I wouldn't scream outwardly and it made me feel sorry for his partner, having to live with such immaturity, which Daniel Tammet appeared to be trying to justify as just a facet of his autism. No, he was being a childish brat!


The only time I've ever screamed because of that is because I tried to catch it. 8O

OUCH! :lol:


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26 Dec 2012, 11:29 am

MrXxx wrote:
nessa238 wrote:
I remember a part where he talks about his frustration at dropping a piece of cutlery on the floor and it making him scream. I thought this was bizarre considering his skill in the other areas and while dropping cutlery would make me annoyed, I wouldn't scream outwardly and it made me feel sorry for his partner, having to live with such immaturity, which Daniel Tammet appeared to be trying to justify as just a facet of his autism. No, he was being a childish brat!


The only time I've ever screamed because of that is because I tried to catch it. 8O

OUCH! :lol:


Lol - yes that would be an entirely appropriate reason to scream!" 8O



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26 Dec 2012, 11:58 am

I've screamed/self-injured over seemingly "minor" things before.

It's called having a low tolerance for frustration.


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26 Dec 2012, 12:11 pm

XFilesGeek wrote:
I've screamed/self-injured over seemingly "minor" things before.

It's called having a low tolerance for frustration.


I know what you mean

I over-react to things

So perhaps he over-reacts to more minor things than average for the very fact of all the adaptation to the NT world he's had to do/done from choice ie it's ultimately not doing him a lot of good in terms of his mental well being.

Which indicates to me that it's causing a lot of stress to build up that is released in the relative safety of his own home rather than on the David Letterman Show (where it might affect book sales adversely! )

I think there is a strong correlation between achieving success/fame via having an ASD and not being able to cope sufficiently with all the pressure this causes.



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26 Dec 2012, 12:23 pm

Agreed.

I'm on medication to control stuff like this.

I think dealing with the pressures of fame would push me over the edge.


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