So I posted in the infamous AS partners forum for NT's...

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I've tried to my friend. You would be better off watching paint dry. I believe it was Perplexed said that "The world doesn't revolve around you" or something like that. Well, I got news for that lady. The world doesn't revolve around her and her feelings either.

OP - I've now seen how old you are and I'm gonna cut you a little slack, but I'm also gonna give you some advice.

ASD tendencies aside, young people often come at things from theory rather than practice. They think about the way things ought to be rather than the way they are. It simple isn't appropriate to lecture people on AS/NT when you don't have the depth or breadth of experience that they do. I've been with my AS husband longer than you've been alive, so in a way I've been living with autism longer than you have. Sure, I'm not coming from the inside of it, but I've experienced it, suffered it and learned from it. And there are other people on the AS Partners forum who've been married for twice as long as you've been alive. I know you'll find that perspective difficult to integrate, but that's also a feature of both youth and ASD.

Until and unless you have the lived experience of being in such a relationship, you just don't have that much to offer to members of that forum. Coming in with a lecturing tone smacks of arrogance and is precisely the kind of behaviour that most of us live with on a daily basis and retreat to the ASPartners site to escape from. So for many it's disturbing that it followed us there.

You say that you wanted to learn, but you didn't question, you lectured. That's not what learners do. Yes, there are people on that forum who probably haven't done the reading they should, but there will be many who are much better researched and read on ASD than you on matter such as cognitive and affective empathy, etc. I think, deep down, part of you wanted to stir the hornets nest and you wanted the community feedback that you're getting from this thread right now. If that weren't the case you wouldn't have titled this thread "So I posted in the infamous..."

I do think it's a shame that there isn't a dedicated forum for AS and NT people to interact with and explain perspectives to each other. I have suggested that we have a section on ASPartners for such exchanges, but other members didn't want to do that and that is their right and I defer to that decision. I didn't like the stickied thread idea here - not for intent but simply for user experience elements and asked for a sub-forum instead. If that were the case and dialogue could be respectful I think that would be a good idea. But even if that did happen - questioning and listening not lecturing would be the way that it would have to work on both sides.

I expect that anyone interested in rational and civil discussion would have been driven away by the same thing that drove you away. However I hope that instead of dwelling on their hatred, they can one day get out of their bad situations and learn again to treat all people as individuals and see their bad relationship as an event with a singular other person.

Peace.
Maz

One of the worst things I have read on that horrid site more than once is how some "therapist" explained Asperger's/Autism to them - meaning as I take it Than some "therapist" told them that their ASD partner will never be capable of having any feelings for them or for anyone except themselves. It is disturbing to learn that it is commonly believed even in parts of the mental health field that we are essentially close akin to sociopaths - people who think only of themselves and incapable of ever thinking otherwise. How can it be that even amongst so-called mental health professionals there is such profound disinformation?

We all have *different* experiences and always will. I'm not sure that age is relevant. No matter how much experience anyone has, it will not be *your* experience.



A dedicated sub-forum is a good idea. I will go and post a request on the meta-forum. It was the first thread i read here so I wasn't considering the user experience elements. I only mentioned it in the context of its content.
Thanks
Maz

Because they are human too. Prone to mistakes and misinformation like everyone else. It is rather unfortunate that they are prone to these mistakes when they are in that position of authority (of the subject). All that can be done is try and educate them in a non-confrontational way (otherwise the immediate reaction is going to be to fight harder to continue down the same path). Kudos to the person who linked that TEDx talk this week.

Oh, I think the OP learned quite a bit.

An unfortunate moment in NT/ASD relations.

Potato, I think you may have jumped in the deep end only to see how big a splash you make.
I'm no fan of ASP; reading their posts makes me reflect on the worst of myself and I avoid it.
But going there in such a challenging manner upsets people who are already on edge and can only end badly.

Sorry elkclan, you might think you know about autism because you live with someone who has it. You don't. You need to live it. Most of us have no issue with NTs, but we do hate being "mansplained" by arrogant NTs. Try a little bit of humility.

I appreciate you attempting to engage in dialogue. Unfortunately, I don't think hateful individuals like perplexedcat (who tells people coming for tips on how to relate to their partner who "may" have autism to ditch them) and bstn3 would ever be interested.

That site is infested with cross burners. It IS a hate site. I appreciate that your privileged position makes it difficult for you to tell that, and of course being NT means your ability to emphasise with autistic people is disabled, but the tone is not "support" at all, it is fear mongering and misinformation spreading by individuals who are plainly hateful, regardless of any victim-blaming they may use to justify their hatred. If you continue to post there, you are complicit with the Grand Dragons.

I didnt want to quote all of that.

Ack!

I suspect that is not going to help things right now.

I don't negotiate with terrorists!

The best way we can help elkclan and the like is by telling them just how bad perplexedcat and bstn3 are. Those two are utterly toxic, and anyone who really wants either dialogue or support has to cut themselves off from them.

I ended up in tears after reading ASP.
I was abused by my boyfriend while a teenager. He was NT, should I start a forum blaming NT on everything with fellow people who were abused by NT ?

I'm not saying autistic people can't be abuser. At its core abuse is a twisted sense of what is right and wrong.
ASD does not make anyone an abuser any more than being NT.

I understand the need to vent and get together as a way to cope from abuse. But using a vulnerable population as a scapegoat is a big NO-NO. All you will achieve is spread misinformation about ASD and harm a lot of people in the process.

As a note, if we (as a society) could stop blaming abuse on whatever mental disorder is marginalized. Not only do I see more often than not people excusing abusive behavior by claiming "he was probably cr*zy", but mentally people are more likely to be the victim of abuse.

Extract from here: http://promoteacceptance.samhsa.gov/pub ... ?printid=1

Nope - doesn't help.

Haterz gonna hate no matter what side they come from.

And I didn't say I understood what it's like to have an autistic spectrum disorder, but I sure as hell know what it's like to live with it. Once again, Walrus - for as long as you have been alive.

I appreciate elkclan coming here and speaking to us reasonably calmly and logically. I'm sure that when anyone gets past their hatred / hurt feelings and then reads what some people are writing in that forum, it will be painfully obvious how toxic they are. You cannot force it to happen.

I would not be surprised if a lot of the people here have lived with it as well. There appears to be significant genetic links for ASD. My father is obviously aspergers. Whether or not he is aware of that, I don't know.
Maz

Do you remember when I went on? I actually asked questions to gain a better understanding of things. How well did that work for me?

I've learned quite a bit too.

[quote=Elkclan"]ASD tendencies aside, young people often come at things from theory rather than practice.[/quote]

1. How do you figure this as so? What is your empirical evidence and statistical sample space? Have you met young people from different walks of life and from different cultures? Why can't both young and old people be both wise and ignorant in different areas of life? If one is ignorant and knows he is ignorant such as myself, how does one become wise? What makes a person wise?

2. It seems to me from my point of view and I could be wrong but you're making a certain assumption that I feel compelled to question you on.

a. It is always negative to come at things from theory than practice.

I will agree with the maxim of Francis Bacon when he said "To command Nature, one must obey it." My questions are this. Without looking at ideas of how things ought to be how would we grow as humanity? If we looked at what is only without question how would we avoid stagnation? Without looking at how things ought to be how would we have the Civil Rights movement and Martin Luther King Jr's speech? You seem to imply that looking at things as they are is better then looking at things and how they ought to be unless I'm misunderstanding you. Based upon human history in which change is a constant and if I'm understanding you correctly, my question to you is why? Why is it always noble to look at things at how they are in practice instead of how they ought to be? What is your fundamental logical reasoning?