Complaints that you make people "uncomfortable"

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I've experienced this in spades - during those times when I was forced to be part of a group, like in a workplace or a group tour back in my school days. But I've never seen it discussed like this!

The primary types of intelligence is different between NT and ASD, and they often don't mix well.
We represent individual intelligence as primary. NT represents system intelligence as primary.
The NT operates as a component of a collective, or group dynamic, where they share and exchange software for what I call the hive mind.

The logic that determines the rejection of us is part of the hive mind software and group dynamic. It's function is much like that of an immune system. If it can't assimilate you, then it rejects you.

Yeah, but the predicament for us is, it's a vicious circle since childhood. The more we get bullied, harassed, persecuted, etc, the more we avoid and distance ourselves from the group dynamics, because we feel disenfranchised and that the whole exercise is futile. It's like basic psychology, there is no reward mechanism for pushing for our increased social involvement, only punishment. As a result we tend to languish more and grow up as "in the dark" and struggling to catch up, I know I certainly did during the '90s. The fact that many of us WANT to assimilate doesn't matter to them, we don't get credit for it (or very seldom do, people would have to be very enlightened). Of course, the corollary to all this is the argument for early intervention (of behavioural therapy).

The hierarchy doesn't care if you WANT to assimilate, it demands that you must. If you can't "play the game" you are either knowingly subversive and thus an active threat, or you are weak and thus unproductive. Both groups must be discarded. If your reward mechanism does not function it is defective and defective is weak and must be discarded. If you are bullied, harassed, and persecuted you are not in compliance. If you can't comply you are subversive or weak and must be discarded.

Ok, enough of my borg tone. Translation: basically society doesn't give a s**t about your problems. You're expected to comply and that's it. If you can't solve your problems it's not society's fault, it's your own. Why do they not care, why do they not help, etc.? It's a power game, they have power and you don't so they don't have to do anything therefore they won't. Our society is one giant organic machine and it operates itself as such, each individual is merely a minor part of the machine as a whole and is thus irrelevant on it's own. It's a raw deal, but again, what can we do? It has the power to do what it wants and we, as individuals, don't have the power to change it.

No, I don't believe squarely in the "social-Darwinist" thing. I've been a victim of it numberless times.

The concept of half-glass full/empty has nothing, whatsoever, to do with social-Darwinism from my standpoint. It's merely a simplified way of saying one could be optimistic/pessimistic about two or more entities/ideas/deeds/ etc. which are, on the surface, identical.

I'm not an adherent to "group identity." I'm a LONE Wolfman who howls at the moon (literally) even when people see me do it. I just feel that pure iconoclasm--pure adherence to a non-comformist ethos, can be counterproductive.

No thank god no one has complained that I make people uncomfortable yet. I know for a fact I make people uncomfortable because of my awkwardness, but I don't really get people telling me I'm creating problems.
I don't talk enough for people to say I'm harassing them so there is no proof. that's why I avoid girls my age in real life #1. out of respect and #2. I already know I'm awkward and make people uncomfortable so approaching girls would not be wise as they could call for sexual harassment.

Surely awkward behavior is a long way from sexual harassment?

These problems that you people are bringing up about working in a hierarchical job site sounds to me like an issue of working with too many people. I have always worked for small companies and they are mostly Meritocracies. I have found my work ethic and 'creative' methods very much appreciated. Seems to me that Aspies should maybe try to work in small groups, where results are noticed, and so is bulls@%^t. Let's face it, we are not shameless self-promoters like a lot of NTs are, so we are at a decided disadvantage.

No no no no no! It's not at all about people needing to manipulate you or using "you make me feel uncomfortable" as a lie to justify why they are bullying you.

YOU MAKE THEM FEEL UNCOMFORTABLE!! !! ! I'm shouting because I am frustrated. All this, well, it's not me it must be them reasoning will not help you fit in any better.

I'm sorry, but it's true.

As has been noted, it would be better if they communicated properly and explained why, but unfortunately people don't know how to communicate properly and that leads to all sorts of problems.

Sometimes that bullying is a self-defense mechanism, I'll sort them out before they get at me, sort of thing. It's not right, but people do silly hyper things when they are scared.

I don't know what else to say. I'm sure I've made people feel uncomfortable. I can be a bit intense and serious and I think people would like me better if I lightened up a bit, but it's not the way I am, so I find it difficult, so I understand your frustrations.

But odd little things can make people feel uncomfortable and it's hard to put your finger on sometimes. Life is tough.

I can't speak for others, but in my case you are right.
People and me, we often make each other feel uncomfortable. It's a fact we have to deal with.

I respect your opinion, but my feeling is that it's best not to tolerate bullying at all, if it's possible. It's valid to suggest we should try to understand the aggressor, but equally, I think it has to cut both ways, and when somebody goes off like that, they're not really giving resolution much of a chance.


I don't see it as you having made me uncomfortable. I felt slightly uncomfortable when I read your post for the first time, but surely we're both responsible for my discomfort? If you could express yourself in a less black-and-white way and / or I could loosen up a bit and accept that not everything I read is likely to be ultra-diplomatic, I'd not have felt uncomfortable. Am I wrong to advocate such a 2-way approach to harmony?


Sure, people can be touchy for seemingly strange reasons, and it's useful to avoid dismissing an over-reaction out of hand, and to reflect on what might have gone wrong instead of focussing purely on the outburst as a sociopathic thing. On reflection, I guess you became annoyed at reading so much stuff here that seemed to invalidate all NT complaints about Aspie behaviour? I for one wouldn't seek to do that, and I think that sometimes it's best to make allowances when NTs express their grievances in aggressive ways, as long as they're only doing it in a moment of weakness. But sadly, homogenous groups have been known to be rather systematically oppressive, and I do think that Aspies can get trodden down if they try too hard to fit in.

You're making an absolute judgment of what's true and what isn't, in a black and white sort of way, when in reality things have a lot more subtlety and variation. And when people write about their experiences on a forum, we're just trying to put into a few words what happened and how we perceived it, thinking back over a lifetime and trying to generalize it into a concept. You weren't there when the other person had those experiences, and even if you had been you wouldn't have experienced it from their point of view, only your own. Maybe other people have different experiences than yours. Shouting no no no is being really dismissive.

Some people don't like it when I don't make eye contact with them when I'm having a conversation with them.

This affects me most during job interviews.

After I was diagnosed with AS in October 2013 and told a few people, those same people would say "Look at me!", whereas they didn't say that before the diagnosis; people I volunteer with.

Yeah, I have major eye contact problems myself. It's an intense rush trying to process it all, and very uncomfortable. I can make eye contact but probably 2/3's of the time my foot starts reflexively tapping. The majority see it as lack of confidence, which is not the case at all, it's just over stimulating. Again, it doesn't matter what it is to me, I'll get "othered" for being outside the norm. This is unchangeable. I've worked on different coping mechanisms over the years, and none work, my foot just taps like I'm uncontrollably nervous. So I have two options: 1. be criticized for having no eye contact and "low self esteem" or 2. be criticized for wildly tapping my foot and being "nervous". I've settled on option 1 because if I'm getting criticized either way I might as well choose the option that's easier, which is me not having to cope with the eye contact. Again, I have no control over how others perceive me, it's a catch-22 when faced against society's norms, so I've accepted that and just do what feels comfortable and don't feel bad about it.

I always talk with confidence though, I don't have significant speech delay or a flat tone like a number of high functioners. I'd like to claim that's a positive, but when juxtaposed to my lack of eye contact it throws people off guard and they have no idea how to respond. This makes them "uncomfortable" because they don't know how to respond to those two mixed signals.

Your logic is missing or flawed.
What you state implies external intent where the mechanism is completely internal.
This is easily prove-able by experiment.
Aggression (external intent) is easily observed and qualified.

Some women have dirty thoughts and project them onto men that happen to interact with them. Such women could easily interpret awkward men as making sexual advances. Some might do it for the sake of bullying. I have had that happen to me. Such an idea didn't even cross my mind but some women think all men are attracted to them. Although I know many women are not like that, I keep a distance from women just in case.