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I can appreciate that. I try to be as comforting as the next guy. And do you think **I** am not upset(At MYSELF) and depressed when I hear of people here that have fantastic math abilities, never gave up any of their AS quirks that I have given up, and now see they really did have a purpose, NEVER left worthwhile obsessions, have great marriages, have lots of friends, can remember a book in a single sitting, etc....?

BEFORE I WAS EIGHT I decided to look for the BAD in something/someone to try to, in my mind, bring their life down enough that I don't go bonkers. I will never tell them, or anyone else, but I certainly do that.

HECK, I know a guy that fancies himself a linguist. English is not his first language, but he tried to trip ME up in english with some obscure words. It WAS impressive for a foreign language speaker, even though he never tripped me up. He claimed to know like 6 languages, and every native speaker of a language he knew said he spoke like a native. He's married, has a kid, gets friends quickly, etc... Even with HIM, I look at how his memory ISN'T any better than mine, about how he doesn't care about pronounciation, etc....

That is a subtle example, but still. My point is that it is a coping strategy, and I never involve others in it. I never wish them ill will. I ALSO try to see if I can emulate SOME of their success. SOMETIMES I succeed! Sometimes I do really well. Sometimes we get to be friends, and build each other up! Heck, sometimes I find out that THEY were jealous of ME the whole time!

BTW He WAS impressed with me knowing so much, being so fast at what I did, and that I was the only one he couldn't trip up! And guess what HE did? He promised me that he would emulate MY success! MY(UNVOICED) response? BRING IT ON!! !! ! As he tries to acquire my abilities, I'll just get better still. I won't even try to acheive some of what he has, but I WILL acheive other things.

Frankly, I don't think ANYONE ever hit their potential. There have been several times that things I found insurmountable became CHILDS PLAY! One thing is sure though..... Complaining and insulting is NOT the way to do better.

So about the threads that LITERALLY make AS people look superhuman? You know the ones? The ones that say you guys can EASILY multiply 34567*45678, remember a couple thousand digits, etc... and it is LITERALLY a walk in the park? KEEP THEM COMING! BILL might not like them! OTHERS may hate them! ***ME***? Well, I look at them as a CHALLENGE! NEW talents to try to acheive.

If bill tried to think the same way, he might actually be cool!

Steve

I just got home from the shrink he has officially given me the diagnosis of aspergers syndrome and BPD. So for all you aspies who dont have a talent or genius IQ i am now officially with you.

My abilities are a mixed bag.

I have an Associate's, Bachelor's and Master's in English, plus a degree in Occupational Sciences in Legal Office Systems/Paralegal.
I have a job I enjoy at the library and one I do well in.
I have a wide range of interests and a good memory for facts.

However:

I don't have a driver's license
I am not married or seeing anybody and it is unlikely it will ever happen. I will be a crazy cat lady. That's okay.
I could never hope to match my mother's skills in cooking.

I did well academically, but am a failure with ordinary life, except for my job. Sometimes, I think I need those "life skills" classes mentally disabled people have to take, even though I don't have any mental impairment.

I figure I have five years to get my act together. I want to get a driver's license, get a full time job and go to London for the 2012 Olympics. That will be my reward if all the other goals are met. I already made a step in the right direction by sending in my manuscript of the story of my cat, Samantha. I am still awaiting word on it. It would be nice if I could get published and share the story of my special cat.

I could relate to several things in your post about not having job stability,general confussion and not being able to find your "nitch" in life.I am 43 and still waiting to "grow up"

I was DXed AS this past spring and am still "processing" the info.

Do you think your BPD DX is related to having unDXed AS through out life,or other life "traumas"?I was DXed with "borderline" BPD,when I was going through CD treatment in 1990(before AS was in manuel)The psych said some of my actions were similiar to BPD,but some did not fit at all.They tried to convince me that I was a victem of sexual abuse and had blocked it but I felt they were way off base and trying to make my actions fit their preconceived notions........."people who do the things you do have been sexually abused,therefor you must have been sexually abused"....how scientific.


I do think being adopted did have some psychological effects that are unrelated to my AS.Have you had similiar life experience or trauma?That "made you" BPD?How do you think it related to AS?

well i was bullied a lot through school and was generally made to feel useless inadequate and unwanted both by family and school. i never suffered any form of sexual abuse as a child , although as a teenager i made some downright stupid choices that resulted in abuse during my 20s. Not everyone who has been diagnosed with BPD has to have been sexually abused as a child , BPD seems to be somewhat akin to post traumatic stress disorder . I think what the psychiatist said is a possibility , that my AS caused me to be a vulnerable child who got teased , bullied and then completly ostracised for many years and that the BPD was caused by the stress of dealing with that over many years , the useless hopeless feelings of inadequacy , the no matter how hard your work at something , either academically or socially , sooner or later it all crumbles and your left with nothing but a feeling of humiliation . In the end i gave up trying for the most part , mainly to avoid the humiliation of failure that was always guareenteed because the minute someone wants to tease me they have a good selection of vulnerabilities to exploit and belive me other children were never slow at finding them and exploiting them till there hearts content.

bb natty

billiscool,

I think you got it right, by the numbers there are 2,000,000 in the US, most are just normal joes.

Of the 10,598 current members, less than 1,000 seem active posters, and it does attract those most isolated by high and low function. Being those are the things that cause us problems, we do dwell on it, and in this mess we are proud of what gifts we might have. There is no culture, no typical aspie, not even one matching pair.

The range of opinion is all over the place. There are social aspies, some with executive function, and other non-aspie skills. Some are great at math but wear slipon shoes. I do not trust the Psyco-Babble story, but I do find I have more in common with this group than with any other. There is something, some make me laugh, others I learn from, and on some I draw a blank.

Like anywhere else you have to pick and chose what fits you. I have a High/Low mix, and this worldwide pool is the only place I can relate. I would say I am mostly a normal human, with some failings, some strong skills, just enough to put the world on edge when dealing with me. I am attached to my skills, because they overcome my faults in some ways.

AS is the reason that most here are functioning below what would be expected do to background and education. We could be making twice as much if we could figure out a few things.

The greatest value I see is for parents who have just discovered they are raising an aspie, here they can talk to some and it does ease their fears. I alway thought I was just odd, wierd, and the only one, finding thousands made my day.

As for the parents, they relate best to the ordinary Joes, your kid might have a few extra needs growing up, but they will become ordinary people in time. For others, ME, there is no hope, I did it my way for sixty years, and I like it. All I can do is tell what worked for me, and what did not.

Your grades seem to point to a balenced life, level. You are the most common form of aspie, and how you get through life is a most useful story for all. You are the 2,000,000 we do not see, and the ones the parents hope their child will be like.

So hang out and play!

How do you figure?



BALANCED LIFE? Grades don't even indicate such things, but frankly I wouldn't want a child that complained about such things like that!

So bill feels he doesn't have any special abilities! HEY, MY abilities have mainly sprung from my interests and weren't exactly free, etc... You think I just WOKE UP knowing electronics, computers, etc???? NOPE! It just came easier to me than most. SO, I guess I could say JOIN THE CLUB!! !

BTW as for hanging out and playing? If he could do THAT, why would he be HERE????

Steve

Jeez, we aren't social butterflies so we at least need to find things we are good at and be better at them than other people. It is much better to have people seek you out because you are an interesting person than suffer social paralysis. You kind of are what you do, at least when you are in the age when you are looking for a mate. Ever think about finding a date on an archealogical dig? We have this great capacity for interests and yet we don't use them to our advantage!

This isn't addressed to you particularly as you are accomplished, but no one should be ashamed of their accomplishments and seek to further them. That's just using your talents to your best advantage.

Being different can be good as long as it is differently interesting!

I like most of this culture, but I hate the sufferings and the "poor mes", I think it is time to overpass iall this and to raise our heads, we are aspies, and, thus, great!! !

I think my posts here in general show how I feel. My point was basically that it is NICE if you feel someone has done better than you. Someone ALWAYS does better than you! It's a GIVEN! You should just try harder. You shouldn't have ill will against someone because they happen to be doing well.

And I KNOW perhaps EVERYONE here, maybe even BILL, does something better than I do. BIG DEAL! I have to be happy with my lot. I just pick my battles, and try to do better.

It is like the people here that earlier mentioned how some lambasted them for using sesquipedalian words! WHY? Those that don't understand should look them up. Those that do are fine. HECK! In my job, I take JOY in learning things.

As for finding a mate? Well, I guess I won't be the first to have such problems. C'est la vie.

Steve

I would suspect that those of us with the time (and desire) to post heavily
have some serious issues which put us into that position. If I was leading
a normal life, there is no way that I could post to the degree that I do. So,
most 'average joe's' aren't going to be hanging out on forums all day, whether
AS or not.

Ok, here goes a long winded explanation... I think I've explained this before in another thread, but here it goes again.
To start with, there IS a genetic component to being on the spectrum. An aspie will produce aspie children. In fact, there are fully developed Aspergian families, and of coarse there are mixed families, in some cases Aspergians are even parents and caretakers of NT kids. However, a NT parent can file a divorce from an Aspergian partner and use his/her diagnosis against them to take their kids away.
It's a spectrum disorder, but more autistic doesn't mean low functioning neccessarily. Alot of it lies within the environment we're growing up in. We're being taught NT social conventions and social constructs, such as religion, or pc, we're taught under NT methods, we go through NT schools, we live in a world geared towards NTs, and ultimately many of us spend our lives trying to learn to emulate NT behavior. Essentially this is kinda turning the individual aspies part NT.
However, once one moves all the social "norms" taught us, we can arrive at absolute truths (atleast in SOME aspects). Yes, there is an absolute moral code, I can explain why too.
Evolution aims for a species to learn to survive and seek happiness. However, misery loves company. In other words, it's action and reaction. If a person does something evil to someone then it should be no surprise when that person retaliates. So, if 1 person isn't happy, others won't be happy. And it's like a chain reaction. So evolution does depend on people rising above many of our base animal instincts and actually having compassion.
Because what has happened is that we as a species have technologically advanced way to fast for our evolutionary cycle to keep up with, so here we are living in a world too modern for the gene pool of mankind (In other words people got ahead of themselves). And I do think our environment in terms of being more laid back, and our conscious wishes as a species, to develope a more compassionate world, has contributed to the way evolution is going. Western society has consciously thrived for the dream of a world where people could get along, but have fought against it sub-consciously. So has eastern society, albiet in slightly different ways.

My personal theory is that we're evolving to the world we've created, meaning autism is merely evolution catching up to technology. But even if one were to say we're not evolving, autism isn't really a disability, it's a difference. See, when the brain gives up the social functions of NTs, it has a trade off in the intellectual department. With some, growing up in an environment that has led them to emulate NT behavior so strongly, the intellectual gift has been burried. With others, maybe theyr not as Aspergian, as there are different levels of autism.
If my theory of evolution prooves correct, and we some day inherit the world, we will not have many of the NT "norms" to alter our growth, and the way that we behave.
Autism culture is more of an anti-cultural culture. We are diverse, but we also have alot in common. It's more that people choose to focus on differences than similarities.

I post on this site and on my cat site for an hour in the morning and an hour at night. In between, I work, read and take care of things I need to take care of around the house.

I fully believe, that, just because I'm not doing certain things now, I do have the capability to do them. What prevents me from driving is the high accident rate in my hometown. There are many discourteous, crazy and just plain bad drivers here. I don't want to risk getting in an accident with one of them.

Our brains are diminished in some areas and enhanced in others so it is foolish not to use the enhancements. I think I was probably more autistic as a child than many of you here because I was oblivious to other people. I didn't notice their reactions and since I have an auditory processing problem, I didn't pay much attention to what they said. They didn't hurt me because I really didn't care. And I was busy pursuing my own interests which made me happy. I went into the tougher years of middle school and high school with intact self-esteem.

Even when I became aware of other people's groups and social life, it still didn't hurt me because I didn't care. I had no idea about why I was different, but my attitude was that I'm glad I'm different because everyone else was so boring. It never mattered to me that I didn't belong. I don't think I projected that I felt inferior to anyone. I believed I was ahead of them in my development!

To this day, I don't care if I'm accepted in social groups. I understand them now and can appear to be like other people when I need to be, but underneath that, I'm happy with who I am. I don't have the poor self-esteem and fear which burden so many aspies because of my natural lack of connectedness to people. Only people whom I've let become close to me can hurt my feelings.

I've been able to pursue my interests without much fear of failure. I suffered some failures in the workplace and was deeply confused by it. That did sting and made me quite unhappy. My solution to that was to become more independent by self-employment, which I believe is the perfect way for an aspie to make a living. Being able to control your environment is very important for aspie.

I post these things because I want you all to know that your lives don't have to be so miserable, that it is the poor self-esteem and fear which cause the feelings of failure. Currently, this is one of my special interests and I don't know how long it will last, but I do feel a sense of connectedness to my fellow aspies and auties and hope that you will try and expurge some of the negative feelings about yourselves so you can be happy. We are so self-critical that we are our worst enemies.

Since I've known about my AS for a very long time, I've had time to think about it even though I seldom wrote about it during that time. I was around during the initial AS self-awareness which happened on some old mailing lists hosted on a Canadian listserv, beginning with a guy named Jim Sinclair on Autism-L. I think that was about 15 years ago and there were a group of parents - and at that time my son was 3 or 4 - who had light bulbs going off about their own lives. It was really an exciting time. Then things started going downhill and the lists became a battleground between the parents seeking "recovery" and aspies standing up for our rights. There wasn't any cure talk back then, only "recovery" through Lovaas ABA.

I became tired of all the fighting and when the Oklahoma City bombing occurred, there was a big debate over why should we care. That frankly disgusted me because I did care. It assulated my sense of right and wrong. I couldn't deal with a group of people who didn't want to care about acts of NT violence. So I walked away from it for many years and got busy doing other things.

Busy doing things has been the key to my sanity because I didn't really have to worry about meeting people and worried more about people encroaching upon my life. I think the busier you are doing things, the happier you'll be and you'll naturally meet more people, increasing your chances of finding a mate because of your interests.

So, I'm encouraging everyone to work on the low self-esttem and fear issues and get busy doing interesting things in order to meet a special person and have a life. I don't think it is possible to find that focusing only on the bad things that have happened in the past.

I wouldn't say that average intelligence on this forum is much higher than normal. I mean if you read a few threads you will see a healthy mix of intelligent posts, completely ignorant posts and anything in between.

Problem is, your personal theory isn't borne out by research. The differences in autistic perception and cognition persist identically across both social and non-social situations. We're not missing some "social module" and enhanced in some "intellectual module", we have an entirely different way of perceiving/thinking that is not social-specific whatsoever.

The sorts of theories that hinge on a "core social deficit" among autistic people are taking superficial aspects of the outward manifestations of a different perceptual system in certain situations, and making them sound like they're more internal and fundamental than they are. The more they actually test those theories, the less those theories pan out. And the more they test for what the real differences are, they're differences that cut across social and non-social situations equally. And certainly those differences confer skills (and perhaps those skills are a central feature of autistic thought), but they are not "intellectual skills as opposed to social skills" or anything else that superficial or simplistic.