Sleeping in the restaurants

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06 May 2007, 3:23 pm

Er... it doesn't make sense. It's not really about discriminating against people. These people have a business to run. If I went to my local and fell asleep there, the staff would ring my parents up to take me home. I would be extremely embarrassed. If you need somewhere to sleep, get a cheap hotel room or something. They do not want any customers sleeping there - at all. Full stop.

Roman
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06 May 2007, 3:24 pm

Aspie1 wrote:

Restaurants are food service places, not motels. If someone is asleep in a restaurant, employees worry that he might be on drugs or hurt.

So suppose their worry is true. How does asking him to wake up would make him less on drugs or less hurt?

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06 May 2007, 3:26 pm

TruenoBlues wrote:

If you are asleep, the restaurant is losing money because the table cannot be used.

What if half of their tables is empty anyway? Well I know that may be customers will come in in a couple of hours. Well then may be they should kick me out then.

TruenoBlues wrote:

If you are awake, there is the possibility that you could order something.

What if it is clear that I won't. Like I study there for few hours straight and don't order anything besides what I ordered when I came in. If I am awake this won't bother them a bit.

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06 May 2007, 3:28 pm

Tequila wrote:

Er... it doesn't make sense. It's not really about discriminating against people. These people have a business to run.

So how does my sleeping interfere with them running their business?

TruenoBlues
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06 May 2007, 3:29 pm

Roman wrote:

shadexiii wrote:

If you are consciously setting your books aside, clearing a spot for your head, then taking a nap, then yes, it is a problem. Everyone else already mentioned the assortment of other causes of people sleeping in a restaurant, and the staff can't go on a case by case basis. And it is a bit off-putting.

On the other hand, if you are in there, studying, purchased at the least a cup of coffee, it is the middle of the night, and you happen to doze off in the middle of studying, that would be quite different. If they wake you up and ask you to leave, an explanation should be sufficient, especially if you are face down in a graduate level physics text book.

If it is clear you are trying to sleep, people will get upset. Same treatment for anyone else that attempts to sleep in a restaurant. It is a place of business, specifically the business of selling food and drink. They don't have to be accommodating to anything past that.

In other words, they are still using their judgement to see whether you are trying to sleep or whether you are sleeping by accident. So they aren't totally formal, are they? So why can't they also use their judgement to see that I am not homeless.

It isn't an issue of homeless or not. You can't sleep in restaurants. Call me a dirty capitalist, but the right of the business supersedes your right to sleep.

Quote:

So suppose their worry is true. How does asking him to wake up would make him less on drugs or less hurt?

It doesn't matter. It's not the restaurant's problem, nor should it be.

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06 May 2007, 3:36 pm

So let me see if I get what you're asking right, Roman.

"Why doesn't the world treat me differently than everyone else? Everyone else is wrong, why can't they see that?"

Because you are no more special than anyone else. If you don't like how the restaurant responded, so be it. They didn't break the law. They did not discriminate. Your pathetic "Sleeping people are people too" attempt gets you nowhere. Sleeping is an action. Being homeless is a condition. There's a difference.

If your only goal here is to get a positive response that you are in the right, well, tough. you could question others a million times, that won't change the response you get. It also won't change your refusal to admit when you are in the wrong. People have explained why you would be in the wrong to sleep in a restaurant. At first, they did so nicely. Get over yourself.

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06 May 2007, 3:39 pm

TruenoBlues wrote:

Roman wrote:

shadexiii wrote:

It isn't an issue of homeless or not. You can't sleep in restaurants. Call me a dirty capitalist, but the right of the business supersedes your right to sleep.

But I don't see how can it interfere with business or personally affect them.

TruenoBlues wrote:

Quote:

So suppose their worry is true. How does asking him to wake up would make him less on drugs or less hurt?

It doesn't matter. It's not the restaurant's problem, nor should it be.

If it's not their problem, then they shouldn't care if I sleep or not on the first place since their job is to get money by selling food, which has nothing to do with checking out if people are on drugs or hurt.

My original question was why do they care if it isn't their problem. Then the answer I got was that they worry I am on drugs and hurt, and then the new question was a logical followup for that answer: if their motivation is that worry then how does them waking me up helps them with making sure I am alright. Now if hte answer is that it isn't their problem, then we are just back to the original question: if it isn't their problem, why wake me up on the first place.

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06 May 2007, 3:42 pm

It is their problem. You are in their establishment doing something they do not want. It is not public property. They are not acting in a way that is illegal. If you have a problem with how the establishment conducts itself, then don't go there.

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06 May 2007, 3:45 pm

shadexiii wrote:

So let me see if I get what you're asking right, Roman.

"Why doesn't the world treat me differently than everyone else? Everyone else is wrong, why can't they see that?"

I weren't saying that they should treat ME differently then everyone else. I was saying that EVERYONE should be allowed to sleep in restaurants EXCEPT for homeless people

shadexiii wrote:

Your pathetic "Sleeping people are people too" attempt gets you nowhere. Sleeping is an action. Being homeless is a condition. There's a difference.

Okay may be it is not discrimination but rather "intrusion of privacy". Because if my action doesn't affect anyone else, it is my privite life. After all if I am awake they don't go making sure that I make good progress while studying and use the right studying strategy.

I think discrimination is a special case of intrusion of privacy. The reason it is wrong to discriminate against, say, color, is that your color doesn't affect anyone else. The same way, the fact that you are sleeping doesn't affect anyone else, either.

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06 May 2007, 3:45 pm

shadexiii wrote:

Roman, just read this. NO ONE is going to agree with you on this. Sorry, but that's the way it is. And it's not that they care about the person who is asleep, it's YOU CAN"T SLEEP THERE!! ! The world doen't revolve around you. Sorry. Shouldn't you be studying right now?

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06 May 2007, 3:48 pm

Roman wrote:

I weren't saying that they should treat ME differently then everyone else. I was saying that EVERYONE should be allowed to sleep in restaurants EXCEPT for homeless people

Ah, so they should discriminate. Not going to happen.

Roman wrote:

shadexiii wrote:

Your pathetic "Sleeping people are people too" attempt gets you nowhere. Sleeping is an action. Being homeless is a condition. There's a difference.

Wrong again. You aren't in private, you are on their property. They aren't intruding upon your privacy, you sacrificed absolute privacy by entering the restaurant. Nice try.

Roman wrote:

I think discrimination is a special case of intrusion of privacy. The reason it is wrong to discriminate against, say, color, is that your color doesn't affect anyone else. The same way, the fact that you are sleeping doesn't affect anyone else, either.

Strike three. Color, again, is an attribute. Sleeping is a behavior. It is wrong to discriminate against someone for how they are. It is not discrimination to act differently towards someone based upon what they are doing. Unless you are narcoleptic, your excuses aren't going to fly.

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06 May 2007, 3:55 pm

Roman wrote:

shadexiii wrote:

So let me see if I get what you're asking right, Roman.

"Why doesn't the world treat me differently than everyone else? Everyone else is wrong, why can't they see that?"

I weren't saying that they should treat ME differently then everyone else. I was saying that EVERYONE should be allowed to sleep in restaurants EXCEPT for homeless people

shadexiii wrote:

Your pathetic "Sleeping people are people too" attempt gets you nowhere. Sleeping is an action. Being homeless is a condition. There's a difference.

OK, you mention privacy, and I am a political science major, so here is my thoughts on that matter. You are in a privately owned establishment. Because it's privately owned doesn't mean you have privacy. You are paying to sit and EAT, not sleep. If you want to do both, I suggest Motel 6.

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06 May 2007, 4:02 pm

TruenoBlues wrote:

You are paying to sit and EAT, not sleep.

Okay, this would make sense if the rules were the following:

1)If you pay $X then you are only allowed to eat but you can NOT sleep
2)If you pay $Y then you can sleep as well

In this case, it makes perfect sense why they wouldn't allow people who pay $X to sleep: by doing that they would force them to pay $Y which would allow restaurant to gain money.

However, this is not the case. What IS the case is that you will have to find a hotel to sleep. So they are helping HOTEL to gain money by not allowing sleeping. So, unless they personally work in a hotel I don't see what they would gain from it.

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06 May 2007, 4:02 pm

It's private property. It's their place, so you do as they ask or they throw you out. That overrides any and all of your demands. Even if there was no-one else in the restaurant and there was a lovely, warm and secluded place for you to sleep does not make it right. Eat, drink and leave. Find a hotel room if you want to sleep.

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06 May 2007, 4:05 pm

Roman wrote:

TruenoBlues wrote:

You are paying to sit and EAT, not sleep.

Okay, this would make sense if the rules were the following:

1)If you pay $X then you are only allowed to eat but you can NOT sleep
2)If you pay $Y then you can sleep as well

That isn't how it works. It is clear that this bothers you. Well, guess what... things won't change just because you don't agree. The restaurant is charging you for food. There was never an offer of a place to sleep. That's why it is called a restaurant, and not a hotel, or a bed and breakfast, or anything else along those lines.

I'm done responding. It is clear that you won't accept that you are wrong in this, and will come up with any number of nonsense arguments to try and prove otherwise. It won't happen, but have fun.

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06 May 2007, 4:06 pm

Hey, Roman, Shouldn't you be studying instead of trying to fight a lost cause?

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