Non-existent support for (high functioning) Autistic adults?
Eliza_Day wrote:
firemonkey wrote:
My needs have tended to be overlooked because my interactions with (mental) health professionals are predominately verbally based. That's an area of strength for me. They've very rarely seen me in predominately non-verbal/practical situations where I can really struggle.
Same. I’m articulate and well spoken which has always counted against me. I don’t stim when I’m around people I don’t know either, and I’m able to sit still and remain calm and polite in assessments. They don’t see me before the assessment when I’m having a panic attack or afterwards when I have a melt/shut down.
I don’t have any kind of support, never have had. My Mum has always done what she can for me.
I am in a very similar situation. My verbal ability, analytical intelligence, and eloquence and my ability to do adls make it impossible for providers to understand how much I struggle and need support. When I try to explain to people that the typical things that they think people need help with, like adls and speech communication, are not the ONLY things that make someone severe and unable to function, it's like pulling teeth to get them to understand. They have zero concept of the needs that some of us have and how severely we suffer because they are not met. And they don't care. I have been shouting on my soapbox for nearly a decade and nothing changes. They just keep pumping more money and resources into the same old stuff they have always pumped money and resources into. It's all about children and things like behavioral therapy and helping people with adls and those who are aging out of the system and can't live independently. There is a blatant refusal to even acknowledge that people like us have needs that can cause us to have devastating consequences.
_________________
"I'm bad and that's good. I'll never be good and that's not bad. There's no one I'd rather be than me."
Wreck It Ralph
Dillogic wrote:
The core deficits of autism are of those, they can't be fixed deals. As someone that's quite stubborn at fixing or adapting to medical thingies, there's no amount of will, medication, talking and/or acronym therapy that can fix say, the social deficits one may have to any appreciable amount. It's transcribed into your genome. Those that do better in that social domain, are almost always just better off in that specific area and can be considered higher-functioning in such. The innate ability to cope helps when it comes to the emotional domain that the symptoms cause.
I understand what you are saying, but I'm not sure that I entirely agree. I think the jury is still out on that point.
I've heard prof Tony Attwood, who seems to be regarded as an eminent authority on Autism, say that the severity of symptoms of Autism can lessen when an individual is well supported, in whatever form support that may take. Be it family, friends, or professional mental health workers. I know he's said that one young individual has gone back to him after being previously diagnosed, but on his second visit his condition had improved so much that he no longer had sufficient symptoms to meet the diagnostic criteria. But I'm sure that is an extreme example and probably very exceptional.
I don't have very close relationships with my family or friends at the moment, and no therapeutic support, so currently my main social arena is my work place. I know from my own experience that when I've felt more accepted and secure in any particular work place, as opposed to feeling that I don't fit in and not feeling accepted, then this has a huge knock on effect in all other areas of my life.
It makes perfect sense to me in terms of my Autism symptoms or difficulties improving or worsening according to how much my emotional / belonging / acceptance needs are being met, or not being met, as the case may be. These needs are like 3rd level on Maslow's Hierarchy Of Needs, just above food / water, and shelter, and it's so true. It's very hard to exist without this level of needs being met. When a person feels more shut out and isolated it's inevitable that everything is going to be worse. Making a deliberate choice to be alone is quite different.
I think this is an area where things like support definitely can help. This is why I'm interested in this topic. I'm not saying that these things can cure Autism, but I do believe that they can help. Just as much as the lack of support can make things a lot worse and a lot more difficult all round.
I understand that the correlations and links between support and improvement of Autism symptoms involve many different factors and that it is complicated, because there can be a lot of variables underlying such correlations. For example there are probably going to be improvements in self esteem and general mood as a result of support and it may be that this is what can help reduce the severity of symptoms. It may be increased opportunity to practice social skills that can help. It could be any number of things that could help cause improvements.
In all honesty I've not yet looked into exactly what research has been done on this, and what the findings have been so far, but it seems to me to be a promising topic of research with a lot of potential to help.
Shadweller wrote:
Dillogic wrote:
The core deficits of autism are of those, they can't be fixed deals. As someone that's quite stubborn at fixing or adapting to medical thingies, there's no amount of will, medication, talking and/or acronym therapy that can fix say, the social deficits one may have to any appreciable amount. It's transcribed into your genome. Those that do better in that social domain, are almost always just better off in that specific area and can be considered higher-functioning in such. The innate ability to cope helps when it comes to the emotional domain that the symptoms cause.
I understand what you are saying, but I'm not sure that I entirely agree. I think the jury is still out on that point.
I've heard prof Tony Attwood, who seems to be regarded as an eminent authority on Autism, say that the severity of symptoms of Autism can lessen when an individual is well supported, in whatever form support that may take. Be it family, friends, or professional mental health workers. I know he's said that one young individual has gone back to him after being previously diagnosed, but on his second visit his condition had improved so much that he no longer had sufficient symptoms to meet the diagnostic criteria. But I'm sure that is an extreme example and probably very exceptional.
I don't have very close relationships with my family or friends at the moment, and no therapeutic support, so currently my main social arena is my work place. I know from my own experience that when I've felt more accepted and secure in any particular work place, as opposed to feeling that I don't fit in and not feeling accepted, then this has a huge knock on effect in all other areas of my life.
It makes perfect sense to me in terms of my Autism symptoms or difficulties improving or worsening according to how much my emotional / belonging / acceptance needs are being met, or not being met, as the case may be. These needs are like 3rd level on Maslow's Hierarchy Of Needs, just above food / water, and shelter, and it's so true. It's very hard to exist without this level of needs being met. When a person feels more shut out and isolated it's inevitable that everything is going to be worse. Making a deliberate choice to be alone is quite different.
I think this is an area where things like support definitely can help. This is why I'm interested in this topic. I'm not saying that these things can cure Autism, but I do believe that they can help. Just as much as the lack of support can make things a lot worse and a lot more difficult all round.
I understand that the correlations and links between support and improvement of Autism symptoms involve many different factors and that it is complicated, because there can be a lot of variables underlying such correlations. For example there are probably going to be improvements in self esteem and general mood as a result of support and it may be that this is what can help reduce the severity of symptoms. It may be increased opportunity to practice social skills that can help. It could be any number of things that could help cause improvements.
In all honesty I've not yet looked into exactly what research has been done on this, and what the findings have been so far, but it seems to me to be a promising topic of research with a lot of potential to help.
The reason that happens is because all Autistic symptoms and traits are made worse with stress. The better a person's support system is, the less stress that person will experience. I know some Autistic people who barely show any symptoms at all because they have such extensive support systems that everything is tailored to meet every need they have. But the less support you have, the more stress you will experience and the severity of your Autistic traits are 100% influenced by your levels of stress and your ability to cope or not cope with them. If you were to take away the support systems that these people have, their Autistic traits would become very noticeable and much more severe.
_________________
"I'm bad and that's good. I'll never be good and that's not bad. There's no one I'd rather be than me."
Wreck It Ralph
skibum wrote:
The reason that happens is because all Autistic symptoms and traits are made worse with stress. The better a person's support system is, the less stress that person will experience. I know some Autistic people who barely show any symptoms at all because they have such extensive support systems that everything is tailored to meet every need they have. But the less support you have, the more stress you will experience and the severity of your Autistic traits are 100% influenced by your levels of stress and your ability to cope or not cope with them. If you were to take away the support systems that these people have, their Autistic traits would become very noticeable and much more severe.
That was so perfectly and succinctly expressed, thank you. That was the point I was struggling to get to and to make.
I've been through the exact things you describe. It explains why life was easier for me in school when I had the support of family and friends, but has become steadily harder since then. With many ups and downs along the way.
I have such strong tendencies to push people away / not let them in, that it's going to be difficult for me to establish good support systems. It's not for lack of offers though. It's some kind of defence mechanism I have, which I don't yet understand, to push people away.
Shadweller wrote:
skibum wrote:
The reason that happens is because all Autistic symptoms and traits are made worse with stress. The better a person's support system is, the less stress that person will experience. I know some Autistic people who barely show any symptoms at all because they have such extensive support systems that everything is tailored to meet every need they have. But the less support you have, the more stress you will experience and the severity of your Autistic traits are 100% influenced by your levels of stress and your ability to cope or not cope with them. If you were to take away the support systems that these people have, their Autistic traits would become very noticeable and much more severe.
That was so perfectly and succinctly expressed, thank you. That was the point I was struggling to get to and to make.
I've been through the exact things you describe. It explains why life was easier for me in school when I had the support of family and friends, but has become steadily harder since then. With many ups and downs along the way.
I have such strong tendencies to push people away / not let them in, that it's going to be difficult for me to establish good support systems. It's not for lack of offers though. It's some kind of defence mechanism I have, which I don't yet understand, to push people away.
There are things about me as an Autistic person that are impossible for me to change. But people don't accept those things because they can't understand them. So they reject me and treat me badly because of that. There is nothing I can do about it because if I try to teach them, they refuse to understand and they insist that I have to change. But that makes them very threatening to me so I cannot be close to them. Does that sound like what might be happening with you?
_________________
"I'm bad and that's good. I'll never be good and that's not bad. There's no one I'd rather be than me."
Wreck It Ralph
skibum wrote:
I am so glad I can help. The reason that you push people away even though you need and want them is definitely a defense mechanism. People are very overwhelming and even threatening to you in ways that you don't even realize. It took me a long time to understand that dynamic in my own life. We need people and we want them and we want to be close to them. But because there are things about us that are extremely difficult for them to understand, they unknowingly can treat us in ways that are very threatening, scary, and dismissive. And sometimes it is very difficult for us to understand exactly what is happening so we can't really explain it. And even if we try to explain it, they do not understand and they don't accept that they are doing that because it makes them feel bad. So that creates an impossible situation. I struggle with relationships because people don't accept me as I authentically am. They socially abuse and bully me even if they do not intend to or realize that they are doing that. They reject everything about me that they do not understand. So that makes it impossible for me to have relationships with them.
There are things about me as an Autistic person that are impossible for me to change. But people don't accept those things because they can't understand them. So they reject me and treat me badly because of that. There is nothing I can do about it because if I try to teach them, they refuse to understand and they insist that I have to change. But that makes them very threatening to me so I cannot be close to them. Does that sound like what might be happening with you?
There are things about me as an Autistic person that are impossible for me to change. But people don't accept those things because they can't understand them. So they reject me and treat me badly because of that. There is nothing I can do about it because if I try to teach them, they refuse to understand and they insist that I have to change. But that makes them very threatening to me so I cannot be close to them. Does that sound like what might be happening with you?
Yes I think that is a large part of it. Something similar is going on with me.
If people accept or like me for the masked and the most socially acceptable version of myself that I can manage to be, then I feel like a fake and a fraud to some extent, if they haven't seen the totally unmasked Autistic me. I wonder when would it be appropriate to reveal that version of myself, only to potentially see people run for the hills if I did.
The positive reinforcement (acceptance and approval from other people) I receive for masking successfully makes it practically impossible to drop my mask when that can mean facing rejection, disapproval, mockery and ridicule.
Furthermore, I have found that certain classes of medications or drugs enable me to wear that socially acceptable mask. It is as easy as taking a pill, and then a good deal of the social side of things seems to come relatively easily. I will still make social errors, and it takes me some time to learn to adapt to and adjust to new people, and to find things to talk about with them etc. But the whole learning process does not feel so disastrously, desperately, and hopelessly awkward. Radiating a calm confidence goes down a lot better with other people than radiating a raft of oddities and anxieties. The whole masking thing for me is further complicated because I am self medicating in order to be able to facilitate this. It's like I have 2 secrets to hide for the price of 1.
With some people if they share some of the same interests as me then it makes things a hell of a lot easier, especially if they like the same sort of music, films etc as me as these are one aspect of my special interests. So if someone is going to be interested in hearing me talk about my enthusiasms rather than being bored to death then clearly that could be life changing.
I did actually meet someone through work a couple of years ago who did share my interests and was an open minded and non judgemental person. At that time I had no idea who I was and could not risk letting her in. I felt that I would only end up hurting her once she got to know the real me, and I wouldn't have wanted to put her through that. I have since managed to take a more positive view of myself, as I have been working on myself in order to be able to do this. But alas that ship has long since sailed now. Who knows when another one will cross my path, or else I will have to find some way of making this happen.
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