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2ukenkerl
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17 Oct 2007, 8:43 pm

Geek,

So estrogen doesn't cross the barrier? That means that MEN have testosterone and estrogen in the brain, and women have far less of either. They would only have the little bit of testosterone the ovaries generate, and the small amount of estrogen made from that. That flies in the face of so much research I have read.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aromatase

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Aromatase is an enzyme of the cytochrome P450 superfamily (EC 1.14.14.1), whose function is to aromatize androgens (that is, to selectively increase their aromaticity), producing estrogens. As such, it is an important factor in sexual development.


So are you saying women are BORN with as strong a libido as some have?

Besides, there are a LOT of similarities in the endocrine system of males and females. Most of the hormones are the same. Apparently the testosterone and estrogen is the same. They even react to them in the same way. if not for the sex organs, the hormones may even be identical.



Danielismyname
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17 Oct 2007, 8:53 pm

Same on both hands.



riverotter
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18 Oct 2007, 8:17 am

Upon cursory examination my (female) ring fingers are quite a bit longer. However, is there a certain method for measuring from the knuckle joint or...just lay the hand out flat and look? Please advise.



0_equals_true
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18 Oct 2007, 9:08 am

riverotter wrote:
Upon cursory examination my (female) ring fingers are quite a bit longer. However, is there a certain method for measuring from the knuckle joint or...just lay the hand out flat and look? Please advise.


wiki wrote:
The digit ratio is the ratio of the lengths of different digits, fingers or toes, typically as measured from the bottom crease where the finger joins the hand to the tip of the finger.


This is confusing because aren't those creases a bit like reading palms? There are environmental factors involved surely. Who’s to say where that is relative to the actual bone? What is the hand and what is the finger? If I look at my two middle fingers they have double crease at the bottom and my two outer fingers have a single crease. But if I look very carefully there is a partial crease below it. All you have to do is cross your fingers (index over middle finger) and it is more pronounced. Pushing you index up with the rest of you fingers flat I get a series of creases some of which are permanently etched in the surface. Sure they may be consider too low and not pronounced enough but that is more to do with the properties of the skin and flesh. What if I had really fat fingers, who knows where the crease would be then?

But going by the guide I would say I have longer ring fingers.



Danielismyname
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18 Oct 2007, 9:54 am

My index fingers are actually longer than my ring fingers when I do it that way; ha, I've got "girly" hands.



geek
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18 Oct 2007, 7:12 pm

2ukenkerl wrote:
Geek,
So estrogen doesn't cross the barrier? That means that MEN have testosterone and estrogen in the brain, and women have far less of either. They would only have the little bit of testosterone the ovaries generate, and the small amount of estrogen made from that. That flies in the face of so much research I have read.

I'm not claiming either perspective as gospel. The great majority of the research has been done on animals, particularly rodents, and there is a lot of debate about how closely brain development in rodents parallels that in primates. Alpha fetoprotein is very important to the developing female mouse brain, without it blocking estrogen during the prenatal period, the female mouse will mount other females, and exhibit other sorts of male behavior. Primates don't seem to work quite the same way, although SHBG may play a similar role in blocking estrogen to the developing female brain. Or it may not. My point was that there's a lot we don't know, and while I am familiar with a number of studies which back your perspective on the subject, I am also aware of a number of them which point in the exact opposite direction.

Quote:
So are you saying women are BORN with as strong a libido as some have?

Would you mind explaining what you mean? I seem to have missed a logical turn somewhere.
Quote:
Besides, there are a LOT of similarities in the endocrine system of males and females. Most of the hormones are the same. Apparently the testosterone and estrogen is the same. They even react to them in the same way. if not for the sex organs, the hormones may even be identical.

Yeah. The uncertainties center around prenatal brain development, which may be a special case.

There is also some new research which suggests that genetics may play a major role distinct from hormones, as rodents who are neutered very early in the prenatal period, then exposed to identical hormone levels during development, still have significant behavioral differences based on sex.

Anyway, stay tuned for new developments, we probably won't have much of this stuff conclusively ironed out for another few decades.



LostInSpace
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18 Oct 2007, 10:51 pm

My ring finger is quite a bit longer than my index finger. I'm pretty good at math also, which is especially unusual given I have NLD.



marshall
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19 Oct 2007, 2:39 am

Mine are too close to call. Which one is longer depends on how I measure. However I notice that the tip of my right index finger is wider than the tip of my left index finger but the tip of my left ring finger is wider than the tip of my right ring finger. I also have long tapered finger tips but short stubby fat toes. Does this mean anything?



Ana54
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24 Oct 2007, 7:16 pm

My index finger is also noticeably longer than my ring finger. There is a much bigger difference between my index and ring fingers than between my index and middle fingers! I think it's ugly, lol. I wish my fingers were more the same length.



Averick
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25 Oct 2007, 2:00 am

This thread has been done before.. I went to a psychologist once who looked at my index to ring ratio and noticed the difference. I believe this is a step for diagnosis in some parts.

BTW my ring finger is longer. It means more androgen during the womb. Also, i've read that this might affect you differently if you are male. Bigger genitalia consequently. ;)