Is Asperger's often confused with a personality disorder?

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Imagine that I like to go to the beach and don't like to go to the mountain. This is a subjective preference. However, I can't (by my free will) change my taste to become a person who likes the mountain and dislikes the beach.

Some literally cannot stop with their obsessive thinking though. So it is objective in that they got to pursue their interest or obsession no matter what - even when they want to sleep, for example. With kids it's more obvious than with adult, but I also heard from teenagers and a young adult being in the same position/saying so.



Could be both: If a person is unable or experiences difficulties to perceive the full picture, then they are automatically drawn to details. It's easier to figure out for children usually, because they answer more spontaneously. I was were when a boy pointed to several tiny details on a 10 cm x 7 cm photo (switches, damaged lights, hydrant, dirt...) but didn't know what was on the picture. That was interesting.

Worth considering: "Personality disorder" is a human concept. It doesn't mean there's actually a thing out there that "personality disorder" labels. It's just how some people think about certain other people's behaviors and what's behind them. Being disagnosed with a personality disorder means that a person has traits that match what some folks have conceived of as being a personality disorder.

I personally think the idea of a "personality disorder" is non-sensical. That doesn't mean that the particular personality disorders aren't in some sense real. But "personality disorder" is a non-descriptive label.

Yes. Perhaps "unusual personality type" was a better expression.

After all, acording to the APA definition of Personality Disorder ("an enduring pattern of inner experience and behavior that deviates markedly from the expectations of the culture of the individual who exhibits it"), being a feminist in Saudi Arabia can be considered a PD.

Well, what I'm saying is not just about the word "disorder". Even the idea that these "personality disorders" are personality issues, that's not a given. It's just label for a set of traits, just like Asperger's Syndrome.

It's not a given that people with "personality disorders" don't have innate differences. And it's not something chosen.

Perhaps first we have to define what "personality" exactly means. After all, our "objective capacities" and our "subjective preferences" are so strongly connected* that in practice is difficult to trace a frontier betwen what is "personality" and what could be "developmental disorders" or something like that.

* usually the people who are good/bad in some thing (maths, sports, social interaction, computers, etc.) also like/dislike that thing (the exceptions, like the extroverted autists are... exceptions), and probably is useless to enter in egg-chicken questions.

Actually, although there is still much uncertainty, psychiatrists are supposed to be working with more meaningful aspects (of personality) than whether one likes or dislikes things like maths or science...

What is much more significant than whether someone likes maths, is their reaction to the imposition of something (such as having to do maths) that they do not like.

From a clinical point of view, if Sally and Jeff both respond to things they dislike, by getting on with it, using "self-talk" and reasoning that mitigates negative feelings and prevents negative observable behaviors, they are more alike in personality than Tom and Kelly, where Tom and Kelly both respond to things they do not like by withdrawing, sulking and using "self talk" that convinces them they are entitled and justified in refusing to cooperate, even if Tom and Jeff both like maths and hate science, while Kelly and Sally both love science and hate maths.

BPD and Autism have very, very weak similarities that can be EASILY seperated if you listen to the patient and actually observe them, and observe your OWN feelings.

You should meet some people with Borderline, they have traits that *CLEARLY* seperate them from autistics. A *VERY NOTICEABLE AND STRONG ONE* is splitting, they get some people to looove them and some people to hate them, can autistics do this? Doing something like that requires a strong subconscious understanding of non-verbal signals and face expressions and adjusting your tone, speech pattern, and words to fit that specific situation. This is an area that an average autistic will do very poorly on, considering one of the diagnostic tools for Autism is performing poorly on a "facial emotion recognition test" (which usually persists despite the patient's age)

Also, the "unstable self image" is on very superfically true for Autism. If you look deeper, BPD are masters of blending in and manipulating others emotions, because of this they often complain of "not knowing who they really are", or if you ask them what are they truely like, they may be unable to answer. My wife has BPD, and it is interesting to see her go to a wedding and she adjusts her language, non-verbal movements, her tone, and her intonation based on what group we are talking to! Considering Autism REQUIRES a deficient in communication, I fail to see how this can be confused with autism. One of my problems, and something I think is a benefit, is that I am the same no matter what group I am talking to.

I find people with BPD very annoying. They are very similar to Hysterionics, they go on and on, I can subjectively see how they adjust their manners in an attempt to make me hate them or like them. I find it annoying because I just want to get to the point, get the objective that I am there for done.

Finally, do not confuse Obsessive Compulsive disorder(OCD), which is an Axis ONE diagnosis (with depression/schizophrenia/etc) with Obsessive Compuslive Personality Disorder(OCPD), which of course is a personality disorder. OCPD are the "neat freaks", or "anal retentive", OCD are the people stuck in a room because they are counting tiles/washing their hands/turning the light off a certain number of times. I actually was diagnosed as OCD, which was very stupid of my psychiatrist at the time. I had no compulsions driving me to self injure, if he had actually LISTENED to me he would understand how silly the diagnose was.

No, we don't. An exact definition of "personality" isn't needed to say that the label "personality disorder" isn't descriptive... the separate words don't tell us what the phrase means.

That's not to discount your what you say on it's own. But I'm responding to them as a response to what I've posted that you are replying to.

Styphon, there's a lot of variation in BPD, and the things you claim are true of BPD are not universally true. They are true of some with BPD, not all.

I feel I have many of the traits of borderline personality dsorder and especially histriotic personality disorder. But I believe that my feelings of deppression, emptyness and desire to run conversations are cause because I cant relate with people. And i want to have freinds so bad. I always used to try to be the life of the party. I think I tried so ahrd to do those things and to dress "cool" (both symptoms of histriotic PD) is because I desire to have people who love me. Mean while I cant because I live in my own world. That's atleast how I feel that autism runs with my personality disorder.


The wiki for serial killers, says that most serial killers suffer from antisocial personality disorder. Then on the same page it says that most serial kilelrs have done poorly when tested on their ability to read social cues. Isnt that the main symptom of Asperger's? Mabye im saying that there is no antisocial disorder. Thats its all forms of autism and that one day these "personality disorders" will be kicked to the curb.

Last edited by JHenry2848 on 31 Mar 2010, 11:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I was misdiagnosed with Borderline Personality Disorder because I was diagnosed while in an abusive relationship... so things like worrying about the time were mistaken for the whole watching the clock to see how long someone was gone thing... instead of realizing I was watching the clock because things were supposed to happen at certain times (things like dinner at a certain time, or having to be in the activities area at a certain time-they thought I was watching the clock and waiting for the nurse to come back... or something like that, I don't really get it).

They said I had irrational mood swings, because I melted down when it was time to go home and I couldn't get ahold of anyone at all to come get me for an hour and they wouldn't let me wait inside where there was a phone available to try to get ahold of my ride.

This was during a 3 day stay at a hospital that they diagnosed me though... the next therapist I had laughed quite a bit over the diagnosis after "testing the waters" by doing some things that would normally set someone with BPD off and getting absolutely no reaction. But he said during just a 3 day stay and with how many med changes they did with me during that time (5 med changes in 3 days... was really stupid), that he wasn't surprised that maybe I appeared BPD to them at the time, especially since they were kind of "on the fly" diagnosing me based on my situation at the time rather than... how I actually am, lol.

Bolded below are the ones I lacked, but I was diagnosed all the same... and some of them, I suppose like, frantically calling for someone to come get me, could have been mistaken for frantic efforts to avoid abandonment... but really, I just didn't want to wait on the sidewalk and hope they showed up with no way to contact them to even let them know I was waiting. I wanted to make sure my ride was coming before waiting outside in the rain.

As for #2, it could have been mistaken because they asked me about what was going on-I was in an emotionally abusive relationship in which I was constantly being told I was worthless... so go figure. Now, I don't feel that way one bit, and at the time, I didn't even say that I myself felt that way, I just told them what was going on and what had been said very matter of factly.

#3-I can't figure out career choices, or have very long term goals no matter what I try, because my interests shift a lot. I focus more on day to day, and really can't even begin to think of anything past tomorrow-even tomorrow is iffy, lol.

#6 and #8-meltdowns basically. When something wasn't the way it was supposed to happen, I got upset and angry at anyone who argued it with me or gave me excuses rather than just telling me why, or that it was even going to happen.

#9... not really sure exactly what that means, but I was very anxious in there for the majority of the time, and was worried a lot. I guess questioning the meds they were giving me all of the time, especially since they were changing them on me, wasn't a good idea, lol. I didn't think they were drugging me or plotting or anything, but I did question how they could see any results at all if I'm being given different things all of the time, and if the meds didn't even have long enough to really get into my system to show improvement.

It seems the diagnosis *could* fit, for sure... if they chose to view what I stated and did in that way. Me freaking out about not being able to contact anyone to come get me? It could have been seen as panic because I had absolutely no clue what to do and the people who were supposed to be there were not... but they saw it as #6 and #8 on the criteria list.

They really need to be careful and truly listen to someone when they are talking, rather than reading into everything that happens, and they need to ask questions when something bothers you, rather than writing it off as irrational behavior and extreme mood swings.

Its possible for a genuinely autistic person to genuinely also have the traits of BPD.

I know several autistic people who have been diagnosed with it.

For instance one woman... she will do the thing where people are all bad or all good. It's not because she has the ability to read social signals. She decides on the basis of basically whether they are conforming to her wishes or not. She will bully people and insist they are bullying her. She will try to manipulate but she isn't good at it. So it will look like... Telling me one set of lies and another person another set of lies and just not even be capable of realizing we talk to each other and compare notes. She will do really serious risk taking stuff and lie about it later. But again it's autistic lies. One of the very autistic style lies she came up with was that she didn't do something several people saw her doing, but that a man had her same shoes and he did it so they saw the shoes and thought it was her. Which is the sort of thing only someone autistic with terrible face recognition would ever try to say. She has one really idealized self that she tries to project to others, but will completely freak and deny things if you tell her what she is really like. (But she recognizes those traits so fast and flips out about them in a way where it's obvious she knows deep down that she is like that.) She has this hole inside her that she tries to fill up by getting people to do things for her, but the people get really wiped out by it all because she is basically a bottomless pit of emotional neediness. She will completely wear you out but when you turn to leave she will flip out and demand more of you. One time when a friend of hers was taking some needed time off, I approached her about some things that had gone wrong and she blamed them all on that friend. One time a friend was in the hospital and she got pissed at them for abandoning her.

She was very much autistic and very much was what psychiatry calls BPD. Both were unmistakable.

A nonautistic person with those traits will go about doing things in a very nonautistic way. But I can assure you that there are plenty of autistic people capable of responding to those same feelings of emptiness and fear of abandonment in very autistic ways. If they try to manipulate it's stunningly ineffective but it's still there. And being autistic doesn't mean you can't be lonely and unbearably clingy, or that you can't try to become someone else.

The misdiagnosis of autism as BPD is totally different though. It happens mostly to autistic women who self injure and make use of personas to cope socially. There are professionals who think any woman who self injured has BPD. Plus many autistic people have been abused and that also can generate some of the traits that get called BPD. Most adult psychiatrists aren't looking for autism so they will try to force fit a person's traits to something else.

Who i'd like to hear from is someone who is actually diagnosed as Antisocialpersonality disorder. And then have them explain to me what makes it different from Asperger's.

In my mind, Aspergers is a neurological cause for antisocial PD. Because I dont really see a large difference between to the two.

And then, the same would go for whatever other PD is caused by autism. I read somewhere that women mostlly have Borderline PD. Mabye BPD is the cause of a women with asperger's and Antisocial PD is how men react to having aspergers. Autism show's stro nglly in one's personality mabye the Personality disorders are simplly effects of autism, and or other mental disorders.

Well i have both. autism and borderline personality disorder

yep, I think this happens a whole lot, probably because of the meltdowns and self-harming. But I agree, they need to wake up because the other stuff is miles apart.