30 May 2011, 8:51 pm
30 May 2011, 9:39 pm
30 May 2011, 9:48 pm
AbleBaker wrote:
The irony of course is that when we talk about the things that interest us, other people think that they are of no value. 
Related to this, are any of you really sensitive to being mocked?
People seem to know what topics to bring up that get me going and they pull it out like a magic trick to their friends. I usually find out later that it was all a big joke to everyone else. I haven't been good at figuring out when this is happening in the moment, but I have started questioning peoples motives more now.
30 May 2011, 9:59 pm
30 May 2011, 9:59 pm
30 May 2011, 10:10 pm
30 May 2011, 10:15 pm
meeemoi wrote:
obichris wrote:
This thread has really been educational and I hope to start testing some things out at work this week.
are you going to try to test anything in particular?
I'm working on trying not to respond (verbal and not verbal) with my automatic instinctual reactions.
Was gonna try to add things to what I have already built, but was a bit curious what would happen if i just took away bad habits.
I dare you to ..... say "Isn't this_______weather we are having?" to any one tomorrow.
and then run, run as fast as your legs will take you. lol
No, but seriously, I wonder what would happen will you freeze ?
I can be in small talk situations, but I have only a limited way that I know how to interact, based on the dynamics:
1) One-on-one uninteresting small talk creates a painful fight or flight reaction similar to nails on a chalkboard. I can endure, but the best way I know how to cope is to switch to an interest and go into a monologue. *sigh* Not much for coping right?
2) One-on-one interested topic. I dominate conversation but I have been working on allowing the other party to talk.
3) Group uninterested small talk. I just fade away and watch the group interact. Sometimes I feel like studying the way they interacted or Im forced to stay in the situation. Other times I slip away.
4) Group interested topic. I become a lecturer/ get on my soapbox. For some reason, I'm unable to allow others to talk much. I think because I know in a group situation I have a hard time jumping back in once the others start talking.
I plan to try the "really?" and "is that right?" phrases. I would also like to jump between shallow topics more, but I'm not sure how I'm going to do that. I guess I can start by trying to cut myself off on my topics before I get going to deep? Either way, I'm going to have to limit it to a short amount of time, any more and I will probably get my head spinning.
30 May 2011, 10:53 pm
30 May 2011, 10:59 pm
obichris wrote:
meeemoi wrote:
obichris wrote:
This thread has really been educational and I hope to start testing some things out at work this week.
are you going to try to test anything in particular?
I'm working on trying not to respond (verbal and not verbal) with my automatic instinctual reactions.
Was gonna try to add things to what I have already built, but was a bit curious what would happen if i just took away bad habits.
I dare you to ..... say "Isn't this_______weather we are having?" to any one tomorrow.
and then run, run as fast as your legs will take you. lol
No, but seriously, I wonder what would happen will you freeze ?
I can be in small talk situations, but I have only a limited way that I know how to interact, based on the dynamics:
1) One-on-one uninteresting small talk creates a painful fight or flight reaction similar to nails on a chalkboard. I can endure, but the best way I know how to cope is to switch to an interest and go into a monologue. *sigh* Not much for coping right?
2) One-on-one interested topic. I dominate conversation but I have been working on allowing the other party to talk.
3) Group uninterested small talk. I just fade away and watch the group interact. Sometimes I feel like studying the way they interacted or Im forced to stay in the situation. Other times I slip away.
4) Group interested topic. I become a lecturer/ get on my soapbox. For some reason, I'm unable to allow others to talk much. I think because I know in a group situation I have a hard time jumping back in once the others start talking.
I plan to try the "really?" and "is that right?" phrases. I would also like to jump between shallow topics more, but I'm not sure how I'm going to do that. I guess I can start by trying to cut myself off on my topics before I get going to deep? Either way, I'm going to have to limit it to a short amount of time, any more and I will probably get my head spinning.
interesting, i ask questions (learnt how to ask questions without sounding like an interviewer) and let them talk. I never thought about a monologue. hmmm I wonder what would happen if you asked questions and I tried a monologue maybe theres a middle ground that is acceptable?
As for the monologue,
It just comes to you naturally ?
Is it about you?
Is it about a special interest?
How do you get the small talk to go on the topic of your monologue?
Are they happy with the convo ? Or do they all of a sudden have somewhere to go ? and the next time you meet them you do the same thing ?
is this a good in the long term
sorry about all the questions just curious. I ask them, you can monologue the answers. were both happy !
31 May 2011, 12:06 am
meeemoi wrote:
obichris wrote:
meeemoi wrote:
obichris wrote:
This thread has really been educational and I hope to start testing some things out at work this week.
are you going to try to test anything in particular?
I'm working on trying not to respond (verbal and not verbal) with my automatic instinctual reactions.
Was gonna try to add things to what I have already built, but was a bit curious what would happen if i just took away bad habits.
I dare you to ..... say "Isn't this_______weather we are having?" to any one tomorrow.
and then run, run as fast as your legs will take you. lol
No, but seriously, I wonder what would happen will you freeze ?
I can be in small talk situations, but I have only a limited way that I know how to interact, based on the dynamics:
1) One-on-one uninteresting small talk creates a painful fight or flight reaction similar to nails on a chalkboard. I can endure, but the best way I know how to cope is to switch to an interest and go into a monologue. *sigh* Not much for coping right?
2) One-on-one interested topic. I dominate conversation but I have been working on allowing the other party to talk.
3) Group uninterested small talk. I just fade away and watch the group interact. Sometimes I feel like studying the way they interacted or Im forced to stay in the situation. Other times I slip away.
4) Group interested topic. I become a lecturer/ get on my soapbox. For some reason, I'm unable to allow others to talk much. I think because I know in a group situation I have a hard time jumping back in once the others start talking.
I plan to try the "really?" and "is that right?" phrases. I would also like to jump between shallow topics more, but I'm not sure how I'm going to do that. I guess I can start by trying to cut myself off on my topics before I get going to deep? Either way, I'm going to have to limit it to a short amount of time, any more and I will probably get my head spinning.
interesting, i ask questions (learnt how to ask questions without sounding like an interviewer) and let them talk. I never thought about a monologue. hmmm I wonder what would happen if you asked questions and I tried a monologue maybe theres a middle ground that is acceptable?
As for the monologue,
It just comes to you naturally ?
Is it about you?
Is it about a special interest?
How do you get the small talk to go on the topic of your monologue?
Are they happy with the convo ? Or do they all of a sudden have somewhere to go ? and the next time you meet them you do the same thing ?
is this a good in the long term
sorry about all the questions just curious. I ask them, you can monologue the answers. were both happy !
Monologues are almost always about a special interest or current hyperfocus. From feedback, I don't think the transition to these topics are as graceful as I think. Usually they either end the conversation or when I've said what I want to I will end it. Rarely does it go anywhere else. I'm not sure what they think about the interaction as a whole.
Also, I have no problem with "awkward" silence. If I have nothing to say and can't leave the situation, I am fine not saying anything at all. Rarely is it that easy though.
02 Jun 2011, 7:37 pm
02 Jun 2011, 10:53 pm
03 Jun 2011, 12:35 pm
03 Jun 2011, 1:05 pm
03 Jun 2011, 1:49 pm
03 Jun 2011, 3:08 pm
Quote:
I'm NT, and this post hits on a very key point.
For NTs, socialization and being considered social is important. Silence can be interpreted by NTs as anti-social or judgement on the part of the other person or dislike. Often, we talk just to judge where we stand with others or to increase our standing. It's sort of a game.
The content is often irrelevant. It's seeing the reaction of the other person and seeing what effects we can create. We build emotional capital with one another because we believe we can use this capital later to do things like:
a. Obtain sex,
b. Make new friends,
c. Get assistance,
d. Learn new things.
So small talk is not purposeless; it's only that small talk may seem purposeless to some people on the spectrum who may think differently about social things. From what I've read (and forgive me if this does not apply to you), many people on the spectrum enjoy games. The key to being more comfortable and more adept at small talk may be to regard it as a game. You get points for:
1. Evoking a smile,
2. Making someone laugh,
3. Acknowledging another person's communication (There are different types of acknowledgement: one let's the person know you got what they said and he or she can say more; the other let's the person know you got what he or she said so that person can move on to the next point),
4. Shifting the topic smoothly to an area of interest for all the parties engaged in the conversation,
5. Showing proper empathy (The other person is outraged, for example, so you become similarly outraged--though not to as great an extent),
6. Ending the conversation
There's probably other ways to score points, but I'm just trying to introduce the idea that it's a game. It's even a game to us NT people, but most of us probably haven't invested the thought into realizing it's a game.
That being said, I imagine it would be a tough game for someone on the spectrum to learn. Why? Some things can be learned through observations, but others can only be learned through practice. In practice, people fail. But social situations can carry strong penalties, especially if tied to negative prior experience. NTs have and have had a lot more opportunity to practice than non-NTs.
It is a game that you should learn though. Unless you live and work in a context that doesn't put you into contact with NTs (unlikely), you'll need at least some tolerance and skill for the game to make life easier. It's unfortunate that the Aspie or Autistic individual has to be the one to change, but society has a long way to go in terms of understanding the spectrum.
I'm still learning too, and one of the things I worry about in posting here is using wrong-terminology or insulting someone unknowingly.
Best,
Stephen
For NTs, socialization and being considered social is important. Silence can be interpreted by NTs as anti-social or judgement on the part of the other person or dislike. Often, we talk just to judge where we stand with others or to increase our standing. It's sort of a game.
The content is often irrelevant. It's seeing the reaction of the other person and seeing what effects we can create. We build emotional capital with one another because we believe we can use this capital later to do things like:
a. Obtain sex,
b. Make new friends,
c. Get assistance,
d. Learn new things.
So small talk is not purposeless; it's only that small talk may seem purposeless to some people on the spectrum who may think differently about social things. From what I've read (and forgive me if this does not apply to you), many people on the spectrum enjoy games. The key to being more comfortable and more adept at small talk may be to regard it as a game. You get points for:
1. Evoking a smile,
2. Making someone laugh,
3. Acknowledging another person's communication (There are different types of acknowledgement: one let's the person know you got what they said and he or she can say more; the other let's the person know you got what he or she said so that person can move on to the next point),
4. Shifting the topic smoothly to an area of interest for all the parties engaged in the conversation,
5. Showing proper empathy (The other person is outraged, for example, so you become similarly outraged--though not to as great an extent),
6. Ending the conversation
There's probably other ways to score points, but I'm just trying to introduce the idea that it's a game. It's even a game to us NT people, but most of us probably haven't invested the thought into realizing it's a game.
That being said, I imagine it would be a tough game for someone on the spectrum to learn. Why? Some things can be learned through observations, but others can only be learned through practice. In practice, people fail. But social situations can carry strong penalties, especially if tied to negative prior experience. NTs have and have had a lot more opportunity to practice than non-NTs.
It is a game that you should learn though. Unless you live and work in a context that doesn't put you into contact with NTs (unlikely), you'll need at least some tolerance and skill for the game to make life easier. It's unfortunate that the Aspie or Autistic individual has to be the one to change, but society has a long way to go in terms of understanding the spectrum.
I'm still learning too, and one of the things I worry about in posting here is using wrong-terminology or insulting someone unknowingly.
Best,
Stephen
Wow. I wish I were NT. *sigh*
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