Social skills vs social lies (repeated)

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We are a social species, meaning that we need each other to survive in the long run. We are not a species that only come together to mate and raise children. We are physically weak and defenseless, and need to rely on our brains and our numbers to survive in the world.

Because of that, most of us (including probably most autistic people) prefer having some connection to other people, because it reinforces the bonds that keep us alive. Many people prefer to reinforce those bonds in particular ways, and that is fine for them. It is not pointless or useless, it is a way of saying and ensuring "I will be there for you if something happens." And also of maintaining whatever social structure is being created (for better or worse).

Autistic people often like different kinds of socializing than usual, but rarely just naturally like no socializing. Posting to this board is a kind of socializing. Autistic people's cognitive differences do not appear to be social-specific, they are there in both social and non-social situations. And we seem to have the same range of social desires as every other person, just often different ways of fulfilling them, and trouble fulfilling them in typical ways just as we have trouble doing a lot of things in typical ways.

Social skills are just bulls**t skills. People just talk and talk and nothing ever happens. Talking is mainly used by people to big themselves up, and do others down, thus maintaining the 'neccessary' delusion that they are better and more deserving than everyone else.

I know we are a social species. I was talking about modern society, for which there is no real need. It's all talk - status - power - lies. People want to work for 'titles' or positions of power like that will give their life some meaning, or they want to impress their peers with gadgets, like that is going to complete their world . Does any of this nonsense aid our survival in the long run? It's all smoke and mirrors, a mass delusion.

The human race got by fine well before modern society. By modern society I mean cities and central governments, where we work for a wage and pay taxes and fit into a 'class structure'. This societal structure is an artificially created and maintained from of control, worked from well above our heads. The human race (IMO) was meant to live more like the Native American Indians than what we have today. We are so totally out of sync with each other and the world we inhabit it's not funny and it's all based on this ridiculous greed driven social structure that revolves around chatting and co-operating (or simply give the impression of co-operating before back stabbing them ) or competing with people we don't even like or have links with to get as much as we can (more than we can ever use) rather than just what we need to get by.

Talking is a waste of energy (if you want to talk about instincts and survival) yet most people spend their entire days wasting breath doing it. If it was not for this stupid social struture the human race swears by today we would not have the massive over population that is going to lead to massive shortage of resources and the eventual complete ruination of the environment for a start. Before anyone goes on about the advancements that society has brought us - they have not made us happy or brought any greater meaning to our lives in the long run, they have just made us more lazy, wasteful and depressed. We seem to have forgot that we are just animals who can still find solace in a simpler way of life - the way nature intended us to live.

Last edited by Berk on 24 Sep 2008, 3:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Exactly what I was getting at. The world is built on ego and delusions of grandeur. At the end of the day we are all just lumps of meat. Animals. No better or worse than each other or any other living thing. We all die and we all rot so why do so many of these people go around like they are gods and own the place and those around them?

I can understand some "white lies." Like if someone gave me a gift I don't like, I never tell them that I didn't like it. It doesn't matter that they probably spent less than half an hour thinknig about what they were going to get me, I don't want to hurt their feelings. Hurting others is bad.

However, I do miss the social construct of "lets meet for coffee" and "why don't we exchange email addresses" and not actually having any intention of following through with them. If that's so, why bother to offer in the first place? I don't understand this. I didn't even know this actually happened until I came onto WP.

I would've told the cousin that I intended to get rid of my car and had decided to give it to her, so I'd be calling her to arrange the transfer of rights. Then when she asked me a year later at Xmas what happened, I'd have told her that I had just said that to be "nice". See how maturely she takes it.

Meaning: everyone's quick to defend "white lies" when they picture themselves on the GIVING end, but everyone's quick to take offense when they find themselves on the RECEIVING end of a white lie.

Meaning: all those who defend white lies, if I came and told them Mary just whitelied to them and she told me she doesn't mean to call them EVER, would be instantly raging at Mary.

Do I see you tossing your computer out the window

I have a theory that white lies are used to prevent violent uprisings from the less attractive.

This reminds me of something on here so yeah aspies can do this too.


Someone on here says he wants to meet me and whenever I want to meet him just PM him. So I did and told him when I can meet and I never heard back from him.

Yes, we lack social skills.

I think social skills are not just BS skills. Social rules are often idiotic; but I classify social skills as something completely different. Naturally knowing when to say something, sensing when another person is uncomfortable, etc, are important and I know I don't have them.

Gotta argue with this teensie tidbit - talking is an excellent way of sharing information and learning important things about one's environment. Talking is only a waste of energy when it's superficial and only there to fulfill a social expectation.

Though I think I get what you're saying.

When someone is honestly acting out of their best intentions, I would find it cruel to talk harshly to them. And most people, NT as well as autistic, do mean well overall, I think, it's just that in many cases the bullies stand out the most in our minds. I mean, if someone went out of their way to do something nice for me that they didn't have to do, or just did their best at something I requested of them, it seems unfair to not take this into account when evaluating it. Just as I wouldn't want to be told how crappy something I gave to or did for someone was, I work off the assumption that others want their efforts as well as the outcome evaluated and approved of.

On the other hand, I have no tolerance for things and people I view to be ethically wrong. I will appear to be unaware of social boundaries or the general opinion of a group because I will point out what I disagree with rather than staying silent or going along with the majority opinion. The truth is, I am quite aware, I just don't give a damn. What is right is more important than what is socially acceptable, and I'm a strong proponent of the idea that all that's necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing. Even if I can't apply this on a grand scale, this gives me no excuse except cowardice to not express my opinions and make my stand where I can, however unpopular they might be, when I believe something needs to be said.

Extending social niceties that are appreciated to innocent or good-hearted people is, if not necessary, at least a good thing. However, people through their actions, no matter how popular or powerful they are to other people, can lose their entitlement to some of them, in my view. Just as they can choose to be a jerk to me or people/groups that I care about or sympathize with, I can choose to react accordingly and not waste tact on such individuals.

They send nonverbal signals consciously. Micro movements, tone etc all controlled. Do you wonder how Aspies can become experts at maths and physics yet the phenomenon of human body language is beyond our grasp?

Yea need to learn the art of deceit to do well socially. Learn to integrate the offset of context when someone makes contradictory truths.

Some examples where I goofed:

A woman I travel with says she feels pregnant because she has put on weight and a bit of tummy. To which I say, "You have always looked pregnant". That hurt her, didn't know.

Another remark I made, though I said this when I was stoned:"Your face looks like a roadmap (wrinkled)"

In India I met an American who showed me a series of very kitch paintings, mass produced and sold on the boulevards in Paris. He asked me my opinion, I said they were mass produced and not worth a penny and kitch.

He took offense and later on in another confrontation he threw it back into my face and didn't want to see me anymore. I was only being honest. he asked me my advice as an artist and I did...

Last edited by Loborojo on 25 Sep 2008, 5:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

that....

Most of the time when NT's say stuff like "If there is anything I can do to help just ask'' they are just saying it to be social. If you do ask for help even after they just made the statement they will roll there eyes and make a face like you are so stupid to think they really meant that. And of course have a million excuses why they cannot help you.