Bill Gates etc.

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i think Gates, Jefferson and Einstein is middle of apsie and nt

Jonathon does have a point. People need to strop stereotyping and labeling people just because of the stereotypes they have but at least doctors have focused on how they function and people too such as Temple Grandin.

But does he think if you're successful and made it through life, you can't have autism or AS? Give me a break. Is Temple not autistic just because she went to school and graduated, got real successful with her job by designing cattle equipment?


But how does depression cause sensitivity to noise?


Seems like the writer has stereotypical views on AS and autism because he was question if they really had it or not but he is leaving it up to the readers to decide after explaining about their lives.

Well, he's ascribing to the "I was cured all right" mentality first of all, so that must be taken into consideration when reading his piece. It is after, his opinion based on what he feels about needing to "recover" from his autistic traits. So to be fair that is his opinion and he is welcome to it. None of us have enough objective evidence to say anything with certainty so it's all just conjecture at this point. What we have is a preponderance of theories and most of them based on subjective observation colored by the NT brain of the observer trying to interpret the AS "symptoms." It isn't very scientific or objective.

I don't see Johnathan's theories as valid, but that's based on what I've researched and what I believe. Until we have brain images of people and objective diagnositc tools and data, we are all just in Plato's cave seeing shadows.

Bill Gates is probably a good person in his personal life, but i disagree with a business plan in which you make you customers fix the problems

Forget the Microsoft bashing. Forget that Gates is richer than any other singular individual on the planet (and wealthier than most, if not all, organized religions).

When we look at people like Gates, or Einstein, or any of the thousands (and perhaps tens-of-thousands) of far lesser known geniuses in the world (if you've never heard of a guy named Edward Witten then you should take a moment and look him up - he's quite probably one of the smartest physicists to ever live) what we're seeing is an intellectual/evolutionary pinnacle. The fact or fiction of AS in these individuals is simply not relevant to discussion of their achievements and mind-state, because they're all operating on a level so far beyond "normal" that they make all us average AS/NT types seem like we're grazing from the same field of grass.

They are as different from us AS types as they are from the NTs, and they belong to neither group.

Personally I suspect that there is some truth to Gates' genetic predisposition towards AS, but I equally believe that those traits have far less direct impact on his mind than they do on our "vanilla" AS crowd. In our lives, being AS seems to feel like the wind from a storm, blowing us ceaselessly in directions we seldom feel we have any choice over. For Gates et all, those winds are probably nothing but gentle breezes, suggesting directions but never driving them towards unwanted destinations. In their lives, their choices are simply preference, rather than imperatives.

Interestingly, what makes me think that Gates does exhibit AS tendencies has nothing to do with any overt physiological behavior (yes he rocks, and yes he was hygiene challenged until his wife and "minders" started making sure he remained presentable at all times). The things that seem to indicate an AS mindset are much more mundane - he is fabulously wealthy, but the cars he has owned have always been reasonably priced, fuel-efficient and (above all) safe. He met his wife by "remote control" -- she was, I believe, an MS software engineer he spotted one day while touring a department and, after finding out she was damn smart, he "arranged" a formal introduction (how many of us wish we had the ability to express our interest in someone in such a safe and controlled way?"). Gates could have had the pick of the litter - a trophy wife for every day of the month - but he ended up marrying a woman of average appearance.

And, at the end of the day, he is determined to divest himself of virtually his entire personal fortune in pursuit of charitable causes...

OK, now find me an NT out there who would do those things.


Nick

Jonathan Mitchell here. Though anyone who disagrees with my article and believes that Bill Gates is somewhere on the spectrum is certainly welcome to their opinion I would like to address the many factualy inaccuracies about CDD, autism, Bill Gates and my life that a variety of members of wrong planet have made in commenting on my article.

Autism as well as CDD can result in regression of abilities. It is very common for a child with autism to meet all of their developmental milestones and then stop talking at about 18 months of age. This is one reason that so many parents believe that their child became autistic due to vaccinations because the onset of symptoms occurs at the same time. Jactitio capitus can occur as a toddler and toddlers do get tired so I stand by my assertation that it is a more viable explaination for Gates' rocking than autism. As far as hygiene goes, if you remember my article, Gates was capable of good hygiene when the need arose, e.g. when he met with IBM executives to discuss the sale of DOS.

As far as Gates somehow intervening and preventing the proof from being published, that is nothing but speculation and it is up to those who would diagnose Gates to prove it. Perhaps the reason that Gates will not address whether he is autistic or not is that he is busy and has better things to do with his time than comment on a small number of people who believe in neurodiversity and would diagnose him just to make themselves feel better.

Gates charitable contributions are matched by many other persons contrary to what that one person posted. Examples of this are John Rockfeller, J. Paul Getty Henry Ford, Baron Hilton, Sam Walton who have all either set up foundations in their own name (as Gates has) or have divested their wealth after their death, so you might as well claim they have asperger's also if that is one of the criteria.

I believe Gates met his wife at a company picnic rather than by "remote control" whatever that means. Beauty is certainly in the eye of the beholder and Gates may have felt his wife more beautiful, either inside or outside than the trophy wife prospects, certianly nothing to do with aspergers.

One person claimed that I had published a novel and short stories. I have not had a single of my short stories published except on my web page and my novel was rejected by 10 literary agents and pronounced DOA by some book doctors who said i would have to write it again from scratch in order for it to be published. I barely graduated UCLA, was put on academic probation twice and half of my college time was spent at a community college before attending UCLA. I don't feel that this constitutes success in my life, along with the fact I no longer work and it has been so difficult for me to make a living I am having to retire at age 52.

I think certain members of wrong planet need to wake up and smell the coffee or something stronger.

Personally, I don't see the point of trying to classify famous people as AS, NT, or otherwise. I wouldn't try to diagnose most people I do know, and I think that to diagnose someone I had never met would be impossible. Some people even question the accuracy of self-diagnosis, and many of us are aware that professionals misdiagnose frequently.

Anyway, who knows what Bill Gates thinks about AS. Maybe he thinks it doesn't exist and would be offended by being classified as either AS or NT. Not that this necessarily matters, but at least it's another way to look at the idea.

@Jonathan Mitchell

Jonathan,

Your participation is appreciated, and I hope your sentiments are well regarded by other folks here.

To clarify - I agree that there is no reason to categorize Mr. Gates or any of the other oft-referenced celebrity figures that are mentioned here, and in numerous other AS-centric discussions, and I wholeheartedly agree that there are a minority of individuals who would like to "take possession" of these people as positive representations to justify their AS-ness --- To wit, saying "Bill Gates has this problem, and I have this problem, ergo I am as good/important as Bill Gates". Yes, that is nonsense, though I can understand why folks would like to believe it.

What I was trying to express in my prior post is that individuals who excel to the degree that Gates (and contemporaries such as Paul Allen, Nathan Myrvhold (SIC?), Steve Jobs, et all) do, can not be assessed in the same manner as the 99.99% of the population who wend their way through day-to-day existence in our modern world.

These individuals are exceptional in every respect, and if some part of their makeup includes character traits that might be ascribed to a pre-existing psychological/physiological conditions, then the very fact of their exceptional ability makes a diagnosis of those traits meaningless. Any effort to try and "own" people who exist at that level is simply absurd, and I sincerely wish everyone could just get over it.

As for my prior "remote control" comment, it was poorly expressed (apologies for that, but it's always late night before I get a chance to read/respond to these threads). Campus lore is that Bill spotted Melinda at a distance (it might well have been at a picnic, though I've only ever heard the story told as "he was inspecting the ranks"), and asked to be introduced. For folks with AS, one of the hardest things to do is to walk up to a complete stranger and say "Hi!" --- for an AS individual the idea that a trusted friend could take that first step by proxy is an incredible relief. I suspect that this scenario might be as much a problem for someone "famous" as it is for someone "incapable", though obviously for very different reasons.

At any rate, I hope everyone can recognize that discussions along this line are not truly useful, and that it is in nobody's best interest to compare/contrast themselves against the tiny percentage of the population who are exceptionally successful. Be content with insuring that there's a roof over your head and three square meals on the table every day. Anything else is a bonus.

Nick

I'd say if you want to find out if you think someone is on the spectrum or not and you can't address it personally with them, see if you can find a GOOD biography. Preferably a couple, to compare. As far Einstein.... well DUH. Who would think that because he had affairs he wasn't on the spectrum? I haven't noticed anything in particular about Aspie's that makes them particularly FAITHFUL. Heinlein pointed out multiple times in multiple books... geniuses make their OWN rules about sex and the hell with the rest of the world. Gates, yeah, I can see the traits, but Paul Allen is farther in, I think. Spielberg? So? LUCAS for Gaia's sake... and he's pushing for educating people on emotional intelligence... he SEES the problem. Take a good look at Robin Williams, Whoopi Goldberg, and a few other "eccentric" personalities out there. History? NEWTON, the man was a freaking lunatic about theology. He wrote MORE about the weirdest theology than he did about mathematics. The man had horrible rage attacks. Galileo, alienated almost all his peers. Michaelangelo, Mozart. How many "geniuses" in history ended up dead for OFFENDING THE WRONG PEOPLE.

Forget the famous... how many university professors, engineer's, computer programmer's turn up on the spectrum? Attorneys? Artists?

Dave you miss the point of what I was saying about Einstein. It was not whether or not persons with Asperger's or other autism spectrum disorders would be more or less inclined to have affairs, but rather the fact that persons with autism spectrum disorders have impaired ability to relate to people and this often precludes the males from having girlfriends or marrying. I am 52 and never had a girlfriend. I was just showing the fact that Einstein's success with women made a diagnosis of Autism less probable. And it would be autism and not the more mild asperger's in order to be consistent with the DSMIV where there is no speech delay in asperger's and that differentiates it from autism. One person trying to dispute my piece claimed that Einstein's popularity with women was just because of his success and status as a scientist. But this argument is refuted by his tryst with Marie Winkler as an adolescent.