Inequality - who is the onus on?
goldfish21
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@ olympiadis & skilpadde:
It might be nice if there were more compromise, but it's never going to happen.
Take a look at any other imbalance of power. Money, strength, intelligence, economics, politics etc.. "He who holds the gold makes the rules." There is a snowball's chance in Hell that NT's, the "winners," are going to accommodate the minority. It's simply not the way of the world. It's more of a "Might is Right," or "Survival of the Fittest," thing. Whoever has the power of whatever kind does things in the way they choose to, not in the way those they rule or dominate would like them to. That is why autistics must make the effort to adapt as best they can. Whether you like it or not, whether it's nice or not, I believe this is simply factual reality.
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Sweetleaf
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So now the talk is of some theoretical "compromise" where each side then gives a little more to meet in the middle?
Does not anyone else recognize the enormous imbalance that is our starting point here?
We do not call the shots. We are not the gate-keepers of society.
We can only continue to do our best by bending over backwards and trying to fall in line where possible.
In very general terms a "fair compromise" is when you end up getting half of something that you really want none of.
It also assumes that you started out at a fair and equal point to begin with, which I do not think is true in this case.
I think it true that most NTs, if faced with the proposition of making the same level of compromises that ASD folks already make, would find the situation completely unacceptable.
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*the eye roll is directed at society not you...
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Last edited by Sweetleaf on 09 Dec 2014, 2:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Sweetleaf
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I'm in one of those horrible NT/AS marriages. I make plenty of concessions to communication with him and ask for very little in return. I do expect courtesy and decency. Just today he got extremely angry with me because I pointed out that his plans for today couldn't be carried out as he had planned (without consultation with me) because I had plans myself that I had put on the calendar some time ago. Instead of expressing disappointment and looking for another way to carry out those plans, he told my son that "Mommy isn't allowing us to go." He stormed out of the house without a word. He was incredibly rude to me.
Some of the concessions that we NT spouses are asking for are common decency, respect, and reminders that you are important. If you don't want to make concessions in communication no one is making you, but you can't expect that people will tolerate rude behaviour forever.
When I think of any accommodation or NT's making an effort...I do not think of tolerating rude behavior. I prefer to know if I do something rude if I am unaware so I can make an effort to avoid doing it. Seems like plenty of people in general have no problem being rude and don't have a care in the world about it.
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We won't go back.
My father used to be quite the idealistic, armchair socialist. "To each according to his need," he liked to say, "and from each according to his ability." He was frequently seen toking a jay with one hand and holding the Bible propped open with the other while issuing such maxims; one wonders if he was talking about some hoped-for Earthly society or the Kingdom of the Lord.
In that spirit, I voted that it ought to be both. To each according to his need-- certainly it is true of all humans, for reasons other than just autism, that some need more accommodation (and it varies by the season of our lives) than others. From each according to his ability-- certainly it is true that, just as some of us at some times must ask for more, some of us (again in some seasons) have more to give.
Give-and-take isn't fixed, and it isn't fifty-fifty. It changes and flows; if you have been fortunate in your life, all the gives and all the takes even out to something like a zero balance in the end (neither having generally taken advantage nor having been generally taken advantage of). It isn't black-and-white either; sometimes giving gives to the giver, and sometimes taking leaves the recipient drained.
I have believed for most of my adult life that it must always be me to make the accommodations, and that any failure must always be my fault. So I was taught through research and therapy: my disease, my defect, my problem, my fault. I have adhered to that. Doing so has not made me a greater or better or stronger or more loved (or more loving) person. Instead, it has left an exhausted, bitter, depressed, resentful, burned-out shell. What have I bought with my soul?? Certainly I have not made myself a better wife or friend, daughter or mother. I think I've bought us all a mouthful of ashes.
My ancestors came from Italy with the same mentality: assimilate or die trying. Looking at my grandmother now, her contempt for her roots and her life of bitter social climbing, her stories of being beaten for her own good if she spoke Italian in her home as a child ("English! English! Brutta! Idiota!"), I think they also bought a mouthful of ashes.
I wonder what the American Aboriginal would have to say about that.
I think the idea that it's all up to one side or the other smacks of dominionism and colonialism and of everything else that got society into the mess it's in today.
Of course, we are here, in the mess we're in today. And there are somewhere between 38 and 88 of them for every one of us (Are there? Really?? If ALL the oddballs, the ADHDers and ASDers and depressives and schizo-spectrumites and bipolars and every other non-neurotypical got together, would the tables-- or at least the numbers-- perhaps be turned??).
And so, regardless of what SHOULD be, we will have to be the ones to do the accommodating. That remains the essence of behavioral therapy, after all. To do all the accommodating, and to see such as only the way it should be.
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"Alas, our dried voices when we whisper together are quiet and meaningless, as wind in dry grass, or rats' feet over broken glass in our dry cellar." --TS Eliot, "The Hollow Men"