Do labels matter? - or better lives?

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Get enough posts, you'll get that status. I prefer the Deinonychus. It's bigger than a velociraptor (thanks to Jurassic Park people think it's big, but they're about as big as a German Shepard. The one's in the movie were Deinonychus).

Deinonychus are cool too. I could go on about this but it would get in to my pathetically childish obsession with Beast Wars and Dinobot. Though I did know this thanks to Wikipedia. I like things compact, Pocket sized Raptor would be fantastic. Also.. imagining Dinobot being two foot is hillarious.

The title: "Do labels matter? - or better lives?", is misconsstructed, and suggests that as "better lives" matters, "labels" doesn't matter, but regard the following analog constructions:
"Do dogs matter? - or better lives?",
"Do pains matter? - or better lives?",
"Do children matter? - or better lives?",
the form, not the content of the phrase suggests its answer.

Fascinating - please could you share how you do it?

I know what you mean, but sometimes it's nice to connect, to share laughter with others etc

Haha, yes because AS don't laugh about anything, because we're logical minded we never laugh. I laugh, I'm laughing right now actually.

I don't feel like I am an embarrassment, I just feel like I'm not being able to give my wife the intimacy and connectness she wants when I am system crashed, and I also feel pretty crappy inside at those times (see my Belts & Braces page).

Really interesting what you say about Maurice method failures - please could you expand a bit?

but do you, can you, connect?

TrenoBlues, you say "Hmm, I only see one idea on your site that works", - do you mean works for you? - I can tell you applying these techniques is making a big difference for me. It works for me. I am beginning to connect with people. I know Aspie conditions vary a lot from person to person - maybe you can work out something too, if it needs adapting for you

In what context? I naturally am arrogant as you may have noticed, it has nothing to do with my AS it has to do with me. Whether I had AS or not, social ritual isn't me. I'm part of an INTJ board too, INTJ's are not social creatures by default. They objectively analyze everything. To say all INTJs have AS because they don't give a damn about your titchy small talk or emotional irrationality would get a good laugh out of them.

I think you are going about it the wrong way. It is not just compartmentalized thinking ala Baron-Cohen. It is a neurobiological difference that can be documented with neuropsych exams. To say that we are not wired differently is untrue. I'm sure you wife appreciates your efforts, but many of us here have long term relationships without resorting to reshaping our personalities. You are not responsible for your partner's feelings. Relationships are about meeting in the middle.



Maurice's book was all the rage about 15 years ago and people started doing intensive therapy with their kids. I knew a woman who pur her son through years of it and he's never said more than 10 words. He's an adult now and lives in a group home. Kids who have the capacity to develop normal speech will develop normal speech regardless of the therapy.

Just because you quack like a duck doesn't make you a duck. No one would suspect anything not normal about me. I can superficially socialize and talk small with people, but I don't like it. It doesn't give me any pleasure to chat with someone at a social event. My husband understands that and accepts it.

Are you not able to connect to your spouse? It can't all be you, she has to meet you part way. I'm also married to an NT and have been for a long time. He figured it out long before there was a label and we worked through it. And in reponse to your post after this one, yes I connect with him on many, many levels and I connect to others as well. I just don't do it in the same was as NTs do. The outcome is just to the same place. I don't always show it the same way, but NTs and I get along pretty well. I work with them, I live with one, I'm friends with some and I have hundreds of relatives who are. I didn't have to become NT or pretend to be to do that. In fact, I found that to often backfire because it caused misinterpretation on their end and a feeling of pretending what I didn't feel on mine.


For you and your spouse, I would suggest Asperger Syndrome and Long Term Relationships. It's very straightforward, easy to understand, has plenty of suggestions for different problems and is something you can both use to overcome the communication and intimacy problems that arise because you are so different from each other. Take a look at that and see what you think.

Yes, we INTJs do tend to act Aspieish even the ones who are NT and I've known some NT INTJs in real life as well as the cyber world. Asperger's is almost like INTJ and then some.

I connect, but only with those I want to connect with. I don't bother with others.

I can unlearn this

I had a similar discussion on Delphi Forums; in case of any use these my wrap-up comments there;


Thanks all for the posts.

Firstly my deep apologies if I have broken protocol or decency by mentioning my site. I have no aim other than to share with and hold out a hand to others whom AS has hurt and who might also want to take an escape route. I am not seeking money, fame or anything else - I'd be more than happy if others picked this up. (As I leave the Aspie sphere I don't actually want to keep being dragged back into it. I don't like remembering how it felt.)

A month may not be long but I can tell you I am experiencing real major differences, particularly in being able to cope with complex social encounters and in increased joy. I am keen to share that, but I guess a man finding he can see when among a community of blind people is going to have a hard time explaining how it feels to see.

On 'It is wonderful being AS - because I'm a great system thinker' I believe you are still a great system thinker whichever tools you use in managing social and other aspects of your life. The good thing is to use the right tool for the job; using a jackhammer to paint an oil painting is not great, but using it for road-breaking, computer programming, curing cancer etc may be. But for oil painting a paintbrush may give much better results for everyone involved.

On 'It is wonderful being AS - because that is what I am', I disagree. You are not AS. That does not define you. AS or NT is a choice you make in what tool to use to manage social encounters. Neil Young is Neil Young whether he's using a heavy electric band or a solo acoustic guitar to make music.

On 'It is wonderful being AS - because we have better lives than NT's', I think this is a defensive posture you don't really, way down, believe. AS makes life harder, more lonely, and more hurting to us and others.

On 'Learn some coping strategies if you want', I am not talking about a coping strategy, a treatment, a band aid. I am talking about stopping the problem happening, cutting it off at it's source.

On 'Everyone knows AS can't be healed' you have acccepted as a truth something that is not proven. Things are moving, changing, and we can be optimistic. Baron-Cohen only put his hyper-systemising thesis out last year. For how long was it that mankind thought the earth was flat?



The bottom line is: you have a very big, sub-optimal bit of software running in your head. Why not turn it off?



To those who asked me to describe my 'experience' so far, or to explain my thesis a bit more, please just read through my site.

I'll leave the site up there in case you ever (e.g. if AS ever hurts you or the ones you love) want to explore thinking positive and beating this thing. All the best.

I believe in you.