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arachnids
Snowy Owl
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10 Jun 2022, 1:11 pm

I think most NTs are focused on the group primarily. Social interaction and their place in the pecking order is of upmost importance to them. I notice that they are very competitive and would rather compete against each other rather than collaborate and get the job done quicker. They don't seem to think from the bottom up either. They'll take things at face value and just skim the surface rather than digging down and looking for the root cause of a problem.


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Dear_one
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10 Jun 2022, 1:31 pm

"Running a meeting" is supposed to mean making sure that everyone gets a chance to speak, covering the agenda, voting, and finishing on time. Some NTs I know think it means reaching a pre-determined conclusion or else setting up another meeting, usually without the dissenters.

Today, it occurs to me that while I've always known that some people study and practice safely at violence, and have observed that others focus on how to gossip for power (I'm looking at you, girls near puberty) I never realized that an even more important skill that does not seem to be taught is how to tell when either one can be used without triggering a worse reaction. Some people stand up for themselves very well, and others get put down every time they try.



Dillogic
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10 Jun 2022, 7:14 pm

lostonearth35 wrote:
... and yet they have the unshakable belief that we're supposed to automatically know and understand because apparently we're psychics who can read their mind.


Yes.

I've observed this various times. I've seen it where they expect you to know their thoughts via nonverbal cues, which would be uniquely NT. Their lack of desire to stick to a routine when it comes to time, will also be uniquely NT; there's always the chance something will come up, but there often won't be an apology and it'll be expected to not be a bother simply because it's not a bother to them. There's also those that just expect you to "know" when they give you nothing that can hint at their thoughts. I've also noticed some NTs seem to be able to read other NTs quite well when not much is given in the form of body language, and I think these people fall on the upper end of the Narcissistic Spectrum, as this allows them to uniquely target others with what they want to hear.

I've offended several people over the years due to being unable to read their minds. :| I'm sorry, but that's just something I can't do, and nonverbal cues are sometimes hard to read.



Jayo
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12 Jun 2022, 4:52 pm

Dillogic wrote:
lostonearth35 wrote:
... and yet they have the unshakable belief that we're supposed to automatically know and understand because apparently we're psychics who can read their mind.


Yes.

I've observed this various times. I've seen it where they expect you to know their thoughts via nonverbal cues, which would be uniquely NT. Their lack of desire to stick to a routine when it comes to time, will also be uniquely NT; there's always the chance something will come up, but there often won't be an apology and it'll be expected to not be a bother simply because it's not a bother to them. There's also those that just expect you to "know" when they give you nothing that can hint at their thoughts. I've also noticed some NTs seem to be able to read other NTs quite well when not much is given in the form of body language, and I think these people fall on the upper end of the Narcissistic Spectrum, as this allows them to uniquely target others with what they want to hear.

I've offended several people over the years due to being unable to read their minds. :| I'm sorry, but that's just something I can't do, and nonverbal cues are sometimes hard to read.


Yep...they certainly can be sometimes... I got better at it with time and practice, and from certain instructive techniques, but it's the spontaneity of it that makes it difficult for me...consistently... while I scored above-average on a test of discerning facial expressions (multiple choice, a to d) and I set a rule that I had to answer in less than five seconds, it was challenging to keep up the dynamic during a live interaction.

Thing is, my motives are good, I care about other people feeling validated and getting responses that satisfy them - but again it's been challenging to do this "in real time" with a constant barrage of non-verbal and verbal messages.

It doesn't help that in most situations, you're not really "allowed" to verbally question the meaning behind a non-verbal message. :(
Unlikely that you'd get an honest answer anyway...