Autism and the God Connection

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Said the kid play-acting a tv character

im not in gods fafor one old lady called me evil just wew hours ago when iwas in shopping and told her about asperger(like i would care )

If you want to take me on then actually fight my logic and don't sit around using Ad hominem attacks. The speaker doesn't matter, only his words.

~ SHODAN, AI Goddess Gone Mad

EDIT: In fact, I even found a picture to make understanding your logic fallacy easier, ain't I nice?

First off I must say that this has been one of the most interesting posts I have come across in my brief historical association with WP.

In compliance with the big bang, non deity,athiests posts I must agree from the logical view that through faith there is no way to be certain if religion is rightly worth the effort or not. Because the aspie mind is so centerally focussed through logic it would seem easier to believe through fact that religion to most would not seem feisable if not a complete joke all together. If you havent witnessed miracles, had visions,near death experiences, or simply seen something which could not be explained then you would not have the appropriate insight to put stock into any form or organized or unorganized religion. Evolutuion has been proven thus it would be more logical to say that there is a possibility that we evolved from apes due to our similar DNA. Regardless of the fact
no one can be sure EITHER WAY.

With this i would like to input that in logic there still lies an area of grey no matter how much you try to mask it. Application through scientific method proves through numbers and trail and error yet with what explanation can things which have not been documented or have occured yet be judged? Studies of humans with savant abilities for instance.


Before our religious aspies start pouring holy water on me let me combat what I just stated with this one word. "ABSTRACT"
before one can belive in religion one must be willing to understand that there are things which cannot be understood. Because of our aspie nature we question and probe and seek truth in reason. To those who do believe beyond this, you have jumped the curve and thus proved yourself worthy of belief through some form of faith which superceedes your own programned brain into a higher purpose of meaning or fuctionability. Simply put you have proven things cannot always be explained by rejecting the reason which our kind has so assurably advanced through.

We are all children no matter the age in search of........

Either way we are all in this together praying or not. Logicly speaking are abilities are of a purpose becuae what would be the use of having them if there was no use of them. Are they a divine gift from the heaven, that i have no idea but through my own experiences I have determined that I have abilities that apes do not and vice versa. If we are the procuct of apes then why are still apes around and why didnt they all evolve. Guess that be said for NT and Aspies as well? I guess the quest continues on......

that one was funny but so true..btw can i be first to use holy water?

Not really but I have a problem with the way you talk down to people who have spiritual beliefs just because you cannot understand it. I don't know what ad hominem means and I don't feel like looking it up. You like to use big words and a phoney pseudo-intellectual attitude to try to make ppl feel stupid because they believe in something.

Studies have been done and statistically ppl who believe in god are not less intelligent than ppl who do not. This is a quote from Temple Grandin's book Animals in Translation;

"There are at least three different lines of evidence that religion is basic to the human brain: (1) religion is universal to all cultures, (2) identical twins separated at birth have the same degree of religiosity as adults, and (3) there is a "God part" of the brain in the temporal lobe that makes you feel the presence of God when it is stimulated.''

Why should humans have such an area in their brain if not put there for a reason? It serves no evolutionary purpose at all. Maybe yours is defective. Like I have difficulty understanding math because I have dyscalia. Maybe that part of your brain is misfiring and not wired up properly.

I find your ability to attack straw men quite impressive. (Sarcastic)

No, I am attacking a film based on a logic fallacy (Begging The Question Fallacy) and the idea of religious experiences.



Don't put words in my mouth, I never said specially those with religious leans are less intelligent, they have merely fallen for an aggressive meme.



And I am about to bust all three in one post.



Because back then humans had no understanding of the world, they had no idea how volcanoes and tsunamis worked. Therefore they developed a system of ideas to explain this, "Gods" doing battle, getting angry, rampaging, you get the drill. And they needed a way to teach morals to the next generation, therefore they created myths with simple points "Don't Steal", "Revenge Is Foolish", I can go on for hours. It was a matter of societal practicality, not belief in gods that motivated the rise of religion in early man.

Eventually they started believing the stories they were telling and mythology was born.



If they are raised in the same culture by parents of matching religions. Give one child to an atheist couple and the other to a muslim couple and they'll come out with different religious systems.



I will now beat you to death with a neurology textbook.

This "god" area of the brain is actually the left temporoparietal junction. The left temporoparietal junction is located in the parietal lobe. The left temporoparietal junction of the brain evokes the sensation of self image—body location, position, posture etc. When the left temporoparietal junction is disturbed, the sensation of self-attribution is broken and may be replaced by the sensation of a foreign presence or copy of oneself displaced nearby, in some cases "communication" can occur with this foreign presence.

In the those with religious leans they feel often as if they are contacting angels or spirits, in the worst cases they suffer mass delusion and believe themselves to see "gods". Those who believe in alien conspriacies often feel like they are being abducted by aliens and see "greys", the sterotypical alien. Those with mild or no religious leans merely feel another person in the room and when they attempt to look at them their details shift.



See above rebuttal.

~SHODAN, AI Goddess Gone Mad

You keep claiming i've "attacked you''. Excuse me, but I fail to see where i've attacked you. In fact if anyone has attacked anyone in this thread and too numerous to mention threads in religion, philosophy and politics forum it would be you and your pals.

Anyway I tend to believe Temple Grandin who has a Ph.D in science and is a professor at Colorado State University. Rather than you a kid still in high school.

Then I will eagerly await your rebuttal, I am ready to raise a counter-point.

Because if I am as dim-witted as you claim this should be easy for you to bring down.

~ SHODAN, AI Goddess Gone Mad

Well, this thread stayed interesting a lot longer than average, but like most having to do with religion, it's degenerated into the same old bickering in which every participant already knows which side they're on, so no one's going to change their mind or be enlightened about anything.

Is this dumb movie really worth any sort of discussion about actual religion? It looks to me like another cookie cutter product churned out by a corporate machine that considers "christian" to be a demographic with predictable, knee-jerk reactions to anything with that word attached as an adjective. I expect we'll see an ad campaign for "christian brake-fluid" and "christian suppositories" before too long, and I'd like to think that if I were a christian, I'd be horribly insulted by this cheapening of my faith.

Oh, and I can think of an evolutionary function that the "God part of the brain" serves: a preprogrammed belief in subservience to some greater being makes it easier for a leader to organize larger groups/tribes, and a larger tribe can better compete with disorganized individuals for territory and food.

Wrong. The "God module" easily can have adaptive value and don't need to be put there by design. What initially surprised me was that Aspies and NTs had the same religiousity, despite the fact that religion seemingly is related to NT ingroup/outgroup concepts. I think this can be explained by different motivations. Aspie religion more likely is related to paranormal abilities instead of ingroup/outgroup thinking.

Perhaps schizotypal traits.

http://www.wrongplanet.net/modules.php? ... chizotypal

I would have scored higher on that test in the past when I was mostly agnostic. I think I score low on the "paranormal" things now and I'm atheist now. In my early 20's I was fairly religious having dreams where Jesus communicated with me. I guess one theory to explain the reduction of "paranormal" thinking would be the notion people tend to develop coping strategies for their maladaptive traits as they age(aspies relatively slowly).

I liked some of the questions in the SPQ-A test. Who did the questions? Can I borrow some of them and test them as experimental questions in Aspie-quiz? Some of the questions have obvious links to ASDs.

An interesting thing about the paranormal / religous questions in Aspie-quiz is that they group with sensory-issues. Perhaps one should expect this, I don't know?

http://www-rcf.usc.edu/~raine/spqrel.html
http://www-rcf.usc.edu/~raine/spq.htm

I think its public domain. 0_equals_true and I merely made a javascript version that would score itself and I decided it needed and in between and unsure option.

OK, it looked "professional" in some respects. Some of the paranormal questions also seemed a little weird and judgemental.

I think I will use it in the same way I used the AQ-test. I'll let interested people do the full test, give them the score, and in the evaluation I can "steal" any question that is interesting for the ordinary part of Aspie-quiz

This will also be an opportunity to show (in a different way) that SPD is related to ASDs and Aspie-quiz score.

I'm not interested in continuing this argument, i've already made my point. You keep trying to hijack my thread and turn it into some kind of a contest.