How do you perceive meaning in music?

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zeichner
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04 Feb 2009, 3:13 pm

I need to feel emotion in the music I listen to. Whether it's classical or pop, vocal or instrumental - I really need to feel as though the performers are making an effort (plus, they have to exhibit a degree of mastery over the music - I don't give points for effort if the performers don't have the chops.) An "effortless" performance is worthless to me.

That also goes for words - I'm not a fan of meaningless lyrics. I love to uncover layers of meaning in the lyrics (that's why I love Fiona Apple so much.) Double bonus points if they make be grab my dictionary once in a while. :lol:


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Eggman
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04 Feb 2009, 3:31 pm

with my brain


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Dussel
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04 Feb 2009, 4:19 pm

zeichner wrote:
I need to feel emotion in the music I listen to.


But there is also "pure" music, which does not transport emotions, but complexity:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCUS5F-DI2o[/youtube]



zeichner
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04 Feb 2009, 4:28 pm

Dussel wrote:
zeichner wrote:
I need to feel emotion in the music I listen to.


But there is also "pure" music, which does not transport emotions, but complexity...

Yes, I know. It doesn't do anything for me.


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complicitytheory
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04 Feb 2009, 4:32 pm

I love lyrics, but not for the social emotional information. That is flat to me. My lyric tastes are to the rhythmic and conceptual. Iggy Pop is my fav. poet. Frank Zappa rulz with language. People who have a sense of usage really get me to respond. Witty and clever lyrics. But not emotional stuff.



rivergoat
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04 Feb 2009, 4:40 pm

I don't listen to music... I FEEL it (or don't). Give me a good gut-wrenching bass-line (NOT the type that makes the trunk rattle!), the kind that I can feel in my ribcage, a stirring guitar that harmonizes my brainwaves, drums that beat in time to my leg-bouncing, and vocals that are like another instrument (that I get to play as I sing along!)

I like the lyrics, don't get me wrong - my favorite lyrics are the poetic type that increase the flow of the song, that roll along the melody and begin and finish a musical sentence. Certain music needs certain lyrics, and when they both mesh seamlessly together, I get transported to another plane, becoming one with the atmosphere...

am I making any sense?

goat

}:)~



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04 Feb 2009, 4:53 pm

I've thought about this before and I was just thinking about it last night so it's funny that this thread popped up today. I love music but I like to actively listen to it, I'm not a fan of having music on in the background just for the sake of noise. I don't really know how to describe my listening experience though, but I know that more often than not I don't pick up any meaning from the lyrics. I know I hear them because I memorize songs really quickly regardless of what language it's in, but it's more the sounds of the words and the melody that stick with me. There are tons of songs I can sing flawlessly through along with the singer, including all the tiniest nuances, and yet have little or no idea what they are saying. I intellectually know the words but for some reason in a musical context I have a hard time understanding them. It's like someone else said, the voice is just like another instrument in the song.

There are of course exceptions, there are lyrics that mean something to me whether it's a whole song or just a line or two from a song, but mostly it's just the way a song flows with all the different sounds working together.



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04 Feb 2009, 4:59 pm

rivergoat wrote:
I don't listen to music... I FEEL it (or don't). Give me a good gut-wrenching bass-line (NOT the type that makes the trunk rattle!), the kind that I can feel in my ribcage, a stirring guitar that harmonizes my brainwaves, drums that beat in time to my leg-bouncing, and vocals that are like another instrument (that I get to play as I sing along!)

I like the lyrics, don't get me wrong - my favorite lyrics are the poetic type that increase the flow of the song, that roll along the melody and begin and finish a musical sentence. Certain music needs certain lyrics, and when they both mesh seamlessly together, I get transported to another plane, becoming one with the atmosphere...

am I making any sense?

goat

}:)~


You made sense to me, I feel the same way. Have you played the game Audiosurf? It's a great way to enhance the feeling of the music if you play it on mono. It's quite a treat as the screen changes colours and visual texture as you drive down the virtual highway of a song. It's hard to describe but to me it feels like I'm even more a part of the song and I just want to experience all songs this way because it's really interesting and fun.



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05 Feb 2009, 10:05 am

I am totally and completely obsessed with music, and would have to say I'm equally affected by lyrics and tones, but which one affects me more depends on the song.

Lyrics, I'll remember even if I hear a song once and don't like it. That can be massively annoying, especially when I catch myself singing along to a song I can't stand when I'm out. However, if the lyrics are particularly powerful/meaningful or if I simply relate to them, I may LOVE a song even though the music sucks. As a kid (and even now, though I hold myself back from doing so most of the time) I could express myself better using lines from other people's songs than I could in my own words....in fact, for a long time, it was the ONLY way I could express myself. Likewise, people can get their point across to me far better by using song lyrics than by just telling me outright.

Pleasant tones strike me as well, and as a musician, that's usually what attracts me to a song and makes me want to play it (over and over and over and over, ad infinitum) on the piano. That being said, though, I have been known to dismiss many a lovely-sounding song because the lyrics brought about bad associations for me.



zeichner
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05 Feb 2009, 10:26 am

RoisinDubh wrote:
...As a kid (and even now, though I hold myself back from doing so most of the time) I could express myself better using lines from other people's songs than I could in my own words....in fact, for a long time, it was the ONLY way I could express myself....

I think I am still that way - it's like I keep a database of song lyrics & relevant dialog from movies/TV in my head. If I have a hard time expressing myself, I'll choose a quote from the "database" to get my point across.


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RoisinDubh
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05 Feb 2009, 10:31 am

zeichner wrote:
it's like I keep a database of song lyrics & relevant dialog from movies/TV in my head. If I have a hard time expressing myself, I'll choose a quote from the "database" to get my point across.


That's exactly how it is for me....even though I rarely watch TV and am not the biggest film buff, I quote from TV and movies more often than most people I know.

Makes sense, though, since we're notoriously lousy at expressing ourselves on our own....



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05 Feb 2009, 11:03 am

rivergoat wrote:
I don't listen to music... I FEEL it. Give me a good gut-wrenching bass-line, the kind that I can feel in my ribcage, a stirring guitar that harmonizes my brainwaves, drums that beat in time to my leg-bouncing, and vocals that are like another instrument...

I like the lyrics, don't get me wrong - my favorite lyrics are the poetic type that increase the flow of the song, that roll along the melody and begin and finish a musical sentence. Certain music needs certain lyrics, and when they both mesh seamlessly together, I get transported to another plane, becoming one with the atmosphere...

am I making any sense?

Uh... you got it! You are making perfect sense. What you wrote was entirely in the spirit of this thread. I feel the exact same way. Thank you for posting this.


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mosez
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05 Feb 2009, 12:25 pm

Well, I'm quite verbal and like to read a lot, so the lyrics gets my attention, but I don't lay too much meaning in all the songs. I'm a stones fan, and play the guitar myself, so most of my attention lays on the riffs and the way the guitars sounds like. I like other artists too, but I allways pays attention to the guitars. It's only rock'n roll, but I like it :D


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RoisinDubh
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05 Feb 2009, 4:18 pm

mosez wrote:
Well, I'm quite verbal and like to read a lot, so the lyrics gets my attention, but I don't lay too much meaning in all the songs. I'm a stones fan, and play the guitar myself, so most of my attention lays on the riffs and the way the guitars sounds like. I like other artists too, but I allways pays attention to the guitars. It's only rock'n roll, but I like it :D


I'm the same way, but with piano. Good piano playing in a song trumps everything, in my opinion.



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06 Feb 2009, 4:13 am

Lyrics matter a lot to me. I was listening to an album recently which I found vaguely disturbing. Sure the music was rowdy and intriguing, but the lyrics kept tugging at my subconscious, song after song. I could not make any coherent sense of the whole album, yet it seemed to have a single theme.

I looked up some sites and discovered the hidden theme. Without paying attention to the lyrics, I might have never known it. Playing the album with this new perspective was like discovering a new dimension. Artists can hide things in plain sight.

Most bands begin with a concept, maybe just a rough outline, then create the music to match the concept, then add the lyrics. Some create lyrics like poetry and then build up music that matches or complements those words. Remove the lyrics from serious pop music and you have one or two broad emotions. So with just a few instruments, there's no way to convey irony, or comedy, tragedy. All you can convey are emotions that are easily felt like mood, tension, pace. With a complex orchestra you can attempt the more complex stuff, but few people listen to classical.

Some artists like only the phonetics of lyrics, David Bowie claiming that he 'just likes the way words sound, there's no specific meaning'. His song "Fall Dog Bombs the Moon" might mean something, but only to David Bowie.

No matter what field you consider, be it painting, music, sculpture... its always about saying something to an audience. So when you have a chance to both say something and use the human voice as an instrument, all the better.



Barce
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06 Feb 2009, 8:22 am

Acacia wrote:
This issue came up when the person I live with told me, in reference to some music she was listening to, "you don't care about what they're saying!" . . . To which I replied, "I just pay more attention to the instrumentation and the patterns and rhythms..." and blah blah blah, etc etc, AS rambling.

But she had a good point. I really do not get a whole lot out of the words in most songs. It's not that I don't care, which most NT people would think. There's also nothing wrong with my hearing. It is superb. It seems to be because the words just don't carry much emotional weight for me. The music does. It's almost as if I can't derive a great deal of meaning from hearing the words. They don't raise emotions. My brain appears to be wired to respond emotionally to the elements of music: pitch, frequency, rhythm, melody, and so on. A good long round tone inspires me more than a superbly written verse. I have been moved to tears after hearing a particularly complex and beautiful harmony. Yet, lyrics that obviously have deeply emotional content don't seem to affect me much at all.

To sum, the basic comparison I am drawing here is this:
What comprises meaning in a song to you?
Is it the words or the music?
Why?

Also,
Do you believe that traits of AS might be responsible for not getting meaning out of song lyrics, or having a predisposition to have emotional responses to elements of music, as I described?

Thanks for your input!


I'm sorry, had to quote this all as what you said really struck a chord or soft spot. This is something i've been wanting to hear someone say, or read someone write. What you outlined is exactly how i've always felt about music. I never understood at all the meanings behind songs, nor did i care too much. It was always the tone and the ambience of it i was very responsive too. I can recall crying my heart out at age 7 to some slow-temp pop songs which were supposably up-lifting. some up-lifting songs i instead percieve as melancholic. Its amazing and trully blissfull how touched the arrangements of a song can have an affect on my inner emotions. And come to think about it . . . . This has made me understand now why im very indifferent to criticism by others if its kept at a 'NORMAL', assertive/passive tone. But when people criticise me, if they are aggressive and angry about it, i feel more hurt this way. I don't think its the words, but the tone. I think this may not be a HFA thing . . . but just a low verbal IQ issue.