So I posted in the infamous AS partners forum for NT's...

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I think abuse can occur somewhat unintentionally. My father was an alcoholic and when he was drunk, he used to beat my mother up. I feel like it could be argued that he wasn't entirely in control of his actions because he was impaired due to the alcohol and that his abuse of alcohol, what with modern ideas of alcoholism being a "disease" or whatever, was also not entirely within his control (I'm not sure that I entirely subscribe to that but drinking alcohol to excess by itself is not abuse so the first part still stands I think). I also had an ex who used to physically assault me and then claim he didn't mean to- like LeagueGirl mentioned, that guy claimed to "black out" when he was really mad (apparently I'm pretty infuriating…). It's not a "mistake" like giving the wrong kind of flowers unknowingly but it's also not necessarily intentional. I don't believe if you asked my father when he was sober if his wife deserved to be thrown against the wall until she's unconscious that he would think "yes". I think he would think "no way, that's crazy", yet he did it anyway. Why- I don't know.

As far as autism goes, my 15 year old son has physically injured me a few times quite badly during a meltdown of sorts. Not intentionally. And I don't consider it to be "abuse" but I do think the effects of it are identical to that of abuse, so it's kind of hard to say really- I don't think it's completely "black and white". If he gives me a black eye, he gives me a black eye. It doesn't matter if he's severely autistic or whatever- I still have a black eye which hurts. I would hope that any AS man who is getting married isn't having meltdowns like that- but if he were, I personally think his wife would still be a victim of violence- maybe not "abuse"- but she definitely does not deserve that and should not tolerate it IMHO.

I am sorry

I disagree that abuse only happens when there is an intent to harm. Neglect can also be abusive. For instance, if a parent has a serious addiction problem, and becomes incapacitated to the point they are unable to take care of their child and in some way the child comes to harm. Addiction is a real illness that may cause a person to lose control of their actions, and that parent may not have any at all intent to harm their child, but it's still abuse.

Abuse isn't something that can be judged in black and white standards. I do think certain acts are always abusive, especially where children are concerned. But beyond that, you have to look at the overall context of a situation. Abuse is almost always a pattern of multiple interwoven behaviors, not an isolated event. And it usually involves intent to harm, negligence, or incapacity.

Intent and purpose are not the only markers of abuse...also severity, frequency, proportion, and effect. And the subjective experience of the victim does matter.

One more thing regarding intent. It's not a 1:1 ratio where each action has a singular, isolated intent behind it. Intentions are dynamic and interconnected across multiple actions and behaviors. Not all intentions are acted upon, but they are still mapped out within a person's psyche.

When people lose control of themselves, they can default to acting out behaviors that are normally suppressed, but still intentional on on some level.

Yes, his wife would be a victim of violence (not abuse), and she should not tolerate it. Her husband should seek professional help, and ideally remove himself physically from her presence if he cannot control himself. That's what a loving husband would do. A husband who chooses not to seek help or otherwise attempt to prevent himself from harming his wife could be labeled abusive, because he is intentionally maintaining a dangerous situation.

Neglect and abuse are two different things. They are both bad things, but not the same bad thing.
I agree that people can be unintentionally negligent.

Neglect is a form of abuse. Particularly when children, the elderly, disabled people, or animals are concerned.

In terms of relationships, neglect is more open to interpretation. One partner feeling neglected by the other doesn't mean they are abusive.

To anyone that says abuse is intentional. That is what my post was directed at.

I once threw a cell phone at my husband as I have written before. Did I intend to throw that cell phone? Yes. Did I intend to hit him in the face with it? No. But it was still abuse even if it was unintentional.

When I was 13, I got upset about something so I pushed my mother. Did I intend to push her? Yes. Did I intend to push her so hard that she falls back and falls into a chair fortunately? No. But it was still abuse even if it was unintentional.


I get very upset so I say very hurtful things and then have no memory of it, same as how some people on the autistic spectrum have no memories of being violent after they were upset, it is still abuse and still not acceptable and this is what I have been informed. Well at least I am not violent and it's only verbal abuse than psychical. Would you call this abuse intentional or unintentional? The person has no memory of it so it's like amnesia.

I think some people need to work their issues out first before entering a relationship.

I was talking to a person online who may have AS but he was never diagnosed with it nor is self diagnosed but I suspect he could be. but he told me about his issues he has with anger and how he gets angry so easily it has gotten him fired before from his jobs. He told me he wouldn't be in a relationship with someone if he knew he was going to be abusive even if it's unintentional. He doesn't want to hit his girlfriend or wife and he is worried she might unintentionally push his button. I think that is a smart move he is making. He is aware of his issues, he doesn't want to hurt someone, he is aware he is responsible for his actions so if he thinks someone will be pushing his buttons, he wouldn't enter a relationship with her.


Even though my ex wasn't psychically abusive, more emotional to be exact and acted controlling, I think he had issues he needed to sort out first before trying to enter a relationship because that is what caused the abuse.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abuse#Dome ... c_violence
"It is important to remember that abuse is always intentional, and can not happen by accident"
Personally I don't know, I tend to avoid the word and just focus on whether or not the specific behaviour is harmful. It seems more of a legal term, and I think it's over-used in common parlance these days, though I'm not saying the cap never fits.

My ex neglected me, which was harmful, but I'm pretty sure that in her head, she didn't see it that way. I've no idea whether that was abuse or not. It didn't come up during the divorce because it would have done no good to accuse her of anything, it doesn't affect money unless they've practically murdered you.

So can you tick the boxes for abuse and still not be an abuser if it's an accident?

Does that not mean I was in a abusive relationship if her behavior was unintentional due to her issues?

Did I not abuse my husband then by hitting him in the face with a cell phone?

I see the word get used even if a action is unintentional, especially in the media. You can unintentionally stalk someone, unintentionally harass someone, unintentionally do sexual harassment and someone still gets accused of these things especially if they are on the autism spectrum and they didn't even realize they were doing it. What about teachers and parents who unintentionally abuse their special needs student and child. Yes what they were doing was intentional but they didn't do it to be abusive and didn't realize it was abuse because they thought it was the best interest of the child. I call this unintentional but yet they still get charged with abuse. Even people on the spectrum will apply the word to the situation. Look at that other thread about someone's blog about Benny & Joon and she called Benny's behavior abuse but I think he wasn't doing it on purpose because he was trying to protect her and thought Sam was taking advantage of her. But yet the page says it has to be unintentional and never an accident but the law doesn't seem to agree with wikipedia. Plus it's unreliable source.

I have noticed that sometimes professionals and parents try to avoid the word and use the word aggression instead for their child when they talk about their abusive behavior. Imagine being a child and being told you are an abuser or hearing yourself being labeled as such. I am not sure what that can do to the child.

In my view, yes.



I'm not sure who "her" is in this sentence.



I would say that you did abuse him, if you
a) intentionally threw the phone, and
b) intentionally threw it at him (as opposed to throwing it at a wall, for example, and missing) or threw it without regard for where it might go

My ex. I found out she just transitioned into a woman so now he is a she.

I think if a person knows they have issues and does nothing about them, then any consequences of their inaction could be labelled abuse. If they don't know they have issues, or they know but they're doing the best they can, then no. That doesn't mean the other person should just accept the situation, though. I think some people feel the need to use the word "abuse" in order to justify leaving a relationship, and that's unfortunate.

I think she did nothing about it and I don't know if she was in denial or wasn't aware. She was aware she had depression. But everyone around me tells me she was an as*hole and a jerk and my parents label as her abusive. I think the reason why she was so worried what people will think of her is because she has had negative feedback about her and IMO if more than one person has negative perceptions about you, then it's time you relook at yourself and reevaluate and work at what you need to change than going "Oh poor me people think I am a control freak, an ass, and an abusive jerk. I don't like you talking on the phone to your parents" The older I get, the more I realize. Now my opinion is if you have to talk to your friends or your parents about your relationship, then things are not working out and you should perhaps think about if it's working or not and leave. I couldn't even talk to my partner without her getting upset or taking what I say the wrong way and even if it was about general stuff, she still didn't like me talking to my parents and had to know everything I was saying to them and listen in so I had to wait until she was at work or go outside and talk. I had no idea this was a form of "abuse" until I read about it in a magazine. I think it was the Seventeen. Of course she never stopped me from talking to them whenever I would. She just made it feel like I couldn't talk to them. But then my justification for her behavior was "he was too worried about what people would think of him and cared too much what people thought." Then I kept reading how victims find excuses for their partner's abusive behavior. Go figure.