Defeatism, or "Learned Helplessness".

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You don’t have to have an empty and meaningless life with Asperger’s.

@Rainbow_Belle: Would you please start a thread of your own about your problems in The Haven instead of trying to take over this thread? Thank you.

It's the second time I noticed you started a thread about some issue and a member showed up to give an example of precisely the issue in question.
The other was the "I'm not talking to you" thread.
Funny.

I think that is a bit of an unfair general statement. I have used the employment-paid counselling and will be using my benefits to get a diagnosis. All the employer knows is that I went to see a psychologist. Clearly I am not the only one as they recently doubled the allowable benefits per year. Granted my example isn't quite the same thing: I can go to any registered and licensed psychologist in the province just like I can go to any dentist. I should mention I am actually getting a diagnosis it BECAUSE of work, at least in the public sector otherwise I don't have a hope in heck of getting past the initial screening since I am neither female, a visible minority or LGBT.

Perhaps if I had to seek a diagnosis on my first employer's dime I would have been able to identify that I wasn't crazy and they were trying to push me out because I was too knowledgeable and intelligent and opinionated to be an effective worker bee.

In this instance, I feel that:

1) Rainbow_Belle's concerns would best be served under the customs and rules of The Haven.

2) I started this thread to address Defeatism in its meta-context, not as a case-specific discussion.

3) There are at this point in time at least 4 members of WrongPlanet who either (a) express their problems in many unrelated or peripherally-related threads (thus derailing those threads), or (b) start multiple threads in multiple fora to express their same problems over and over again.

So I ask you, why should chronic complaining go hand-in-hand with a Defeatist attitude?

Because without defeatist attitude complaining wouldn't be chronic? My guess.

So chronic complaining could be a "comorbid" of learned helplessness ... ?

Possibly, I guess.
I see chronic complaining as a symptom of unhealthily strong pessimism, which may be part of the learned helplessness package.

That is actually a pretty cool insight. I can see how they would go together.

That is a really good point. I can see that as well now that you mentioned it.

(I haven't read many of the 75-some posts; so excuse this for its redundancy or irrelevance.)

I have a big serving of learned helplessness and yet have been very "successful" ---or is it that I genuinely need help and/or am ashamed and/or am scared (so it comes out as whining)?

My AS-like BFF doesn't complain at all and she has kept her world so very small (takes care of herself and close friends). My world is BIG (community impact) and I complain a lot, so between us complaining is striving. Now, of course one would like to strive without complaining in which case one would need to be empowered … by oneself, by the community. I think the huge degree of invalidation I received in my youth set me up for "learned helplessness" (whining). I see how ingrained it is for me. I would like to reduce my angst and then my whining would decrease.

I'm not so much helpless as I am afraid to be flattened by outside forces if I take action. Which I guess is helplessness. Oh, whatever.

I would like cheese with my whine please.

I also think that the dumpload of invalidation I received in childhood set me up for "Learned Helplessness" later in life. But knowing that my future was entirely up to me motivated me to make improvements in my attitude and actions -- it was either that or remain helpless, become homeless, and end up lifeless. I chose to get up, get out, and do what I have to do to not only survive, but to succeed.

I'm reminded of a scene from Gone With the Wind -- "As G-D is my witness, I will never be helpless again!!"

I still have things to complain about, but only when I can't "fix" them on my own.

According to this Medical News Today article:

Learned helplessness in children

Often, learned helplessness begins in childhood. When caregivers do not respond appropriately to a child's need for help, the child may learn that they cannot change their situation. If this occurs regularly, the state of learned helplessness may persist into adulthood.

Children with a history of prolonged abuse and neglect, for example, can develop learned helplessness and feelings of powerlessness.

Some characteristics of learned helplessness in children include:

• low self-esteem
• low motivation
• low expectations of success
• less persistence
• not asking for help
• ascribing a lack of success to a lack of ability
• ascribing success to factors beyond their control, such as luck

Learned helplessness in adults

In adults, learned helplessness presents as a person not using or learning adaptive responses to difficult situations.

People in this state typically accept that bad things will happen and that they have little control over them. They are unsuccessful in resolving issues even when there is a potential solution.

How to overcome learned helplessness

People with learned helplessness can overcome it. The most common treatment is therapy, especially cognitive behavioral therapy (CBT). CBT helps people overcome these types of challenges by changing how they think and act.

In therapy, people can:

• receive support and encouragement
• explore the origins of learned helplessness
• develop ways to decrease feelings of helplessness
• identify negative thoughts that contribute to learned helplessness
• identify behaviors that reinforce learned helplessness
• replace thoughts and behaviors with more positive and beneficial ones
• improve self-esteem
• work through challenging emotions
• address instances of abuse, neglect, and trauma
• set goals and tasks for themselves

Some research suggests that exercise can prevent learned helplessness in animals. Though there is no research into this particular effect of exercise in humans, physical activity usually benefits mental health and can reduce or prevent anxiety, depression, stress, and other health problems.

Eating a healthful diet, meditating, and practicing mindfulness are other lifestyle changes that can boost a person's mental health and outlook.

Last edited by Fnord on 10 Dec 2019, 4:39 pm, edited 2 times in total.

I’ve just been thinking about Gone With the Wind recently.

“I won’t think about that now. I’ll think about that tomorrow.”

Sometimes I say that to myself when I’m dwelling on negativity. Hopefully, by tomorrow I’ll have moved on and won’t think about it then, either.

Thank you for that. I would have thought I would have been offended, or scared, or otherwise shrunk from that information (e.g. my delay in posting to this post), but to my surprise I found that information quite helpful and feel good about it.

That’s my intent — to be helpful.

Sadly, there are those who need much more help than I can give.

Fnord, I think you really hit on something relatable with this thread.