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(People with Autism/Aspergers Only) Religion or Not?
I am very religious, and attend religious services/meetings as often as possible. 9%  9%  [ 54 ]
I am religious, but do not always attend religious services/meetings. 8%  8%  [ 43 ]
I am religious, and attend meetings/services on occasion. 2%  2%  [ 14 ]
I am religious, but I rarely attend meetings/services. 9%  9%  [ 51 ]
I am confused in this area. 6%  6%  [ 35 ]
I am agnostic. 24%  24%  [ 136 ]
I am atheist. 42%  42%  [ 239 ]
Total votes : 572

thechadmaster
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05 Jul 2010, 6:31 pm

jmnixon95 wrote:
thechadmaster wrote:
jmnixon95 wrote:
I'm an Aspie, so you can't be saying I'm an NT by asking this... but what's so wrong with NTs?


whats wrong with NTs :?: :?:

NTs to me have become a symbol of 13 years of pain in school, NTs who refuse to accept that not everyone is like them, (i know MONKEY is gonna jump on this: i accept that you are different, i just disagree with you)

NTs are subconciously (they dont even realize it) attempting to "normalize" anyone who differs. While i am a Christian Creationist, i do believe that "survival of the fittest" is a very real concept. "fittest" is a loaded word though, it is what the average NT defines it to be, if this world does not want autism, it will ignore it until we either assimilate or "fail"


You criticized MONKEY for saying something that 'sounded NT', which is implying that you think something is wrong with sounding NT... and that's really stereotypical of you to say that the average NT thinks that. There are mean autistic people, and mean neurotypical people. I've met many, many very supportive NT friends in my life, and I don't think it's any good of you to assume that most NTs have the same thought processes.



fair enough, i do tend to generalize, but this is just my experience, i live in the kind of town where you're either part of the in-crowd, or you are socially "banished" guess who i was?

and dont say its because of my religion, i know plenty of Christians who are just as guilty of this behavior


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Variant
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05 Jul 2010, 6:39 pm

thechadmaster wrote:
i dont know how to defend my position any further.


Concession accepted.

MONKEY wrote:
@Thechadmaster: lets see who right on judgement day? I don't think using those scare tactics will work on people who don't even believe in judgement day. I am not at all intimidated by the threat of going to hell.


Exactly, just like I'm not scared of Santa failing to bring me presents if I'm "naughty."

thechadmaster wrote:
MONKEY wrote:
thechadmaster wrote:
i dont know how to defend my position any further

PWNED


How NT of you to say that. you sound like every grade school bully i have ever known, i show one sign of frustration and you jump on me like a lion on a gazelle.


*Scrolls up a bit* Did you forget that you just used the same word, prior to Monkey using it?

thechadmaster wrote:
i am trying to help you understand where im coming from, but you obviously have your mind made up, if you want to take my words out of context, thats your perogative. i wont judge you or curse you, but i guess i cant expect any courtesy from any of you when it comes to a differing viewpoint.


A differing view point is fine, you're the one who started posting videos in an attempt to belittle/disprove our view point. So, I don't really see how you can complain when we respond in kind. You do realize that you are complaining about your own behavior, right?

thechadmaster wrote:
I pity you people.


Religious tolerance at work.


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thechadmaster
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05 Jul 2010, 6:44 pm

Variant wrote:
Concession accepted..


i never conceded, quit twisting my words.


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05 Jul 2010, 6:47 pm

thechadmaster wrote:
Variant wrote:
Concession accepted..


i never conceded, quit twisting my words.


I'm having fun with you, don't get your panties in a twist. :P

Seriously though, you do realize all the things you're complaining about you were guilty of first and then other people responded in the same fashion, right?


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05 Jul 2010, 6:51 pm

Aneres wrote:
I am Agnostic because god is unverifiable one way or the other. I can't state that I know, with no doubts, the truth, and I refuse to do so. That would be dishonest. Neither religion nor science can offer any undeniable proof and that is what would be required for me to go to either extreme of being either religious or Atheist. That being said, it is easier for me to lean toward the science.


Exactly, that is my opinion as well, and why I choose to say I'm Agnostic, rather than strictly Atheist. I will take science over magical fairy tale books any day though.


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05 Jul 2010, 7:17 pm

thechadmaster wrote:
if you are not intimidated by hell, im sorry, i cant help you


The mere concepts of soul and afterlife repulse me, my convictions are that existence and mind are curses and my hope is that it will only be short, which implies "no afterlife". So, to me if Heaven and Hell aren't really different.


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thechadmaster
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05 Jul 2010, 7:39 pm

I just cannot understand how someone could not believe in a soul or afterlife, you believe that this is it? this piddling little 80 year existence? it must be an empty feeling that there is nobody there watching you, caring about you, helping you when you need it. i do pity anyone who feels that "alone".

I could not function in this world if i thought that there was no help for me, an existence of pain followed by nothingness?

I believe that whatever i endure in this life, whatever i lose, whatever is taken from me is insignificant when compared to an eternity of peace, living with my Creator, the one who knows each of us by name. I feel honored that He chose to give me life, not earthly, painful, bodily life, but the life that will never end.


not only that, if you truly believe that there is no authority figure "keeping an eye on things" where is your moral code? without authority, you could justify anything, even murder. if there is no accounting for your actions then you could get away with it, whats to stop you from stealing or killing, or cheating on your wife?

history has proven that when someone lives only by his own authority, bad things happen, look at communism, a system that flatly rejects God. in china, female babies are aborted every day, the dictator tells you your every move, the government steals from its people who already have nothing.

in some countries, expressing a belief in God will get you shot on sight, these ruthless dictators reject the authority of God, and their people suffer under them.


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Variant
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05 Jul 2010, 8:00 pm

thechadmaster wrote:
I just cannot understand how someone could not believe in a soul or afterlife, you believe that this is it? this piddling little 80 year existence? it must be an empty feeling that there is nobody there watching you, caring about you, helping you when you need it. i do pity anyone who feels that "alone".

I could not function in this world if i thought that there was no help for me, an existence of pain followed by nothingness?

I believe that whatever i endure in this life, whatever i lose, whatever is taken from me is insignificant when compared to an eternity of peace, living with my Creator, the one who knows each of us by name. I feel honored that He chose to give me life, not earthly, painful, bodily life, but the life that will never end.


not only that, if you truly believe that there is no authority figure "keeping an eye on things" where is your moral code? without authority, you could justify anything, even murder. if there is no accounting for your actions then you could get away with it, whats to stop you from stealing or killing, or cheating on your wife?

history has proven that when someone lives only by his own authority, bad things happen, look at communism, a system that flatly rejects God. in china, female babies are aborted every day, the dictator tells you your every move, the government steals from its people who already have nothing.

in some countries, expressing a belief in God will get you shot on sight, these ruthless dictators reject the authority of God, and their people suffer under them.


Do you really want to play this game chadmeister? Cause I can make quite the long list of horrible, ghastly, vile things that have been done in the name of religion. Much worse things than anything you could come up with for atheism in fact.

And I notice how you conveniently failed to acknowledge any of my points regarding your previous complaints.

I feel sorry for you that you need to feel like someone is looking over you and protecting you, that you can't just live for yourself and be happy for the time you have here. Is your life that terrible that all you can do is look forward to some fictional bliss that is supposed to happen after you die?

And scientifically speaking, I won't return to "nothingness," as I didn't come from "nothingness." The molecules of my body were once part of the stars themselves. My molecules will rejoin those of the Earth when I die and eventually journey back in to space when the Earth itself dies. My consciousness might cease when my body dies, but my memory will live on in the minds of my loved ones. So, I will continue to exist for quite some time in one way or another.

As for a moral code, if you're a good person you shouldn't need to have a punishment lined up to make you do the right thing, you should just do the right thing because it is the right thing to do. But you seem to think all atheists are going to be murdering psychos since they don't believe in hell.


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05 Jul 2010, 8:06 pm

Variant wrote:

And scientifically speaking, I won't return to "nothingness," as I didn't come from "nothingness." The molecules of my body were once part of the stars themselves. My molecules will rejoin those of the Earth when I die and eventually journey back in to space when the Earth itself dies. My consciousness might cease when my body dies, but my memory will live on in the minds of my loved ones. So, I will continue to exist for quite some time in one way or another.


That's how I think of it. And also, the first thing I thought after reading this was that clip from the lion king "... we are all connected, in the great circle of life" when Mufasa was explaining the food chain to Simba.


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05 Jul 2010, 8:10 pm

One of the unknown things is where your neuron energy or EM field goes when you die.



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05 Jul 2010, 8:15 pm

thechadmaster wrote:
I just cannot understand how someone could not believe in a soul or afterlife, you believe that this is it? this piddling little 80 year existence? it must be an empty feeling that there is nobody there watching you, caring about you, helping you when you need it. i do pity anyone who feels that "alone".

I could not function in this world if i thought that there was no help for me, an existence of pain followed by nothingness?

I believe that whatever i endure in this life, whatever i lose, whatever is taken from me is insignificant when compared to an eternity of peace, living with my Creator, the one who knows each of us by name. I feel honored that He chose to give me life, not earthly, painful, bodily life, but the life that will never end.

not only that, if you truly believe that there is no authority figure "keeping an eye on things" where is your moral code? without authority, you could justify anything, even murder. if there is no accounting for your actions then you could get away with it, whats to stop you from stealing or killing, or cheating on your wife?
That is why you need your god. People will be evil, and religion has not stopped them in the past. Religion is a simple method of indoctrinating morals to the majority of a population.

I reject gods and devils as extraterrestrials messing around with ancient humans.
I believe in reincarnating. Why else would my dreams be so different from my waking life?
I believe the worse I behave in this life, the worse my next life will be.
Conversely, If I am good in this life, my next will be better.
Heaven and hell are constructs of this concept.

The next step in humanity is a return to the cycle of anarchy and barbarism, and the fall of civilization. The hope of enlightenment stands as a goal towards peace and expansion to other worlds. There is no more proof of your beliefs than mine.


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05 Jul 2010, 8:24 pm

thechadmaster wrote:
not only that, if you truly believe that there is no authority figure "keeping an eye on things" where is your moral code? without authority, you could justify anything, even murder. if there is no accounting for your actions then you could get away with it, whats to stop you from stealing or killing, or cheating on your wife?


Moral codes aren't the property of religion; even animals have them, different codes for different species that allow the group to survive as a species. And that's how it is with humans as well. I have never had religious schooling of any kind, and don't believe in god or hell, but murder, theft, adultery, and cheating are repugnant to me. This is taught by our parents and by society because it serves our species, and we adopt it as our own, although people do modify their own moral codes more specifically to suit their beliefs. For example, I might become a vegan and add animal slaughter to my list of immoral acts.

To have no ability to understand how people can govern themselves is to have no real understanding of the meaning of moral codes. Just out of curiosity, if you discovered that god did not exist, would you really feel free to just help yourself to other peoples' things, or take their lives if they didn't agree with you? Holy moly.



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05 Jul 2010, 8:32 pm

LancetChick wrote:
thechadmaster wrote:
not only that, if you truly believe that there is no authority figure "keeping an eye on things" where is your moral code? without authority, you could justify anything, even murder. if there is no accounting for your actions then you could get away with it, whats to stop you from stealing or killing, or cheating on your wife?


Moral codes aren't the property of religion; even animals have them, different codes for different species that allow the group to survive as a species. And that's how it is with humans as well. I have never had religious schooling of any kind, and don't believe in god or hell, but murder, theft, adultery, and cheating are repugnant to me. This is taught by our parents and by society because it serves our species, and we adopt it as our own, although people do modify their own moral codes more specifically to suit their beliefs. For example, I might become a vegan and add animal slaughter to my list of immoral acts.

To have no ability to understand how people can govern themselves is to have no real understanding of the meaning of moral codes. Just out of curiosity, if you discovered that god did not exist, would you really feel free to just help yourself to other peoples' things, or take their lives if they didn't agree with you? Holy moly.


people DO need authority, people are"modifying their moral code" in dangerous ways. look at abortion! if murder is damaging to a species, why is ok to kill viable members of that species?


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LancetChick
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05 Jul 2010, 8:44 pm

thechadmaster wrote:
people DO need authority, people are"modifying their moral code" in dangerous ways. look at abortion! if murder is damaging to a species, why is ok to kill viable members of that species?


Yes, we do need police, and that is why we have them, but that falls under the category of "self-government". To look at how well self-government works, you need to look at the whole society, not just an individual.

As for abortion, that's been part of many societies throughout history. Unwanted children have often been considered disadvantages, for a variety of reasons, whether it makes sense or not.



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05 Jul 2010, 9:06 pm

thechadmaster wrote:
people DO need authority, people are"modifying their moral code" in dangerous ways. look at abortion! if murder is damaging to a species, why is ok to kill viable members of that species?


So we should do things like they did in the times of the Bible shall we, have the unwanted kid and then bash it's head in with a rock? In my opinion, it is fair kinder to kill a lump of cells than to beat an unwanted newborn to death.

Also, what about the mother? What if the pregnancy was endangering her life? Do we let her and the fetus die or do we perform an abortion to save the mother's life?

There is nothing wrong with moral code or authority. The problem is when they become influenced by religion and thus harm or even kill certain members of society.


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05 Jul 2010, 9:26 pm

I just cant believe that the world is only 5000 years old and that it started in the garden of eden-with a talking snake-why dont snakes talk today-If god is all powerful he could talk to everyone on the earth simultaneously and say what his intentions are instead of speaking to one person in secret and letting them be the spreader of his word on earth-he could also wipe out hunger and suffering with ease-why doesnt it happen-he could say exactly what he want instead of people interpreting a book written by men and causing hate and bigotry across the world. The aspie literal and logical mind is the cause of this-my lack of imagination and abstract thinking will not allow me to believe anything else but solid evidence and facts.