Board index › General Discussion › General Autism Discussion

You're not Aspies, You're Indigo Children.

Page 6 of 7 [ 106 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next

Previous topic | Next topic

Maolcolm
Snowy Owl
Snowy Owl

User avatar

Joined: 22 Oct 2010
Age: 53
Gender: Male
Posts: 168

12 Nov 2010, 3:42 pm

I have no belief in Indigo Children either way. But It's fascinating to note that until fairly recently AS was not known to exist, and even today there are still those who dismiss AS as a fabrication and an illegitimate excuse for 'strange', 'selfish' or 'unsociable' behaviour.

There are certain parallels with the disdainful attitudes displayed here towards those who entertain the notion of "Indigo" children etc.

I know, I know, "It's not the same". But then, it never is is it? It's always "different" when it affects us.


"I really am skeptical about 'Asperger Syndrome'. I really don't think it exists at all. I say this as someone who has studied psychology for years, and who is intimately familiar with it.... Asperger's does not exist, in that it is merely a psychosomatic, behavioral condition. It is strictly behavioral. And any cognitive abnormalities associated with AS are in fact psychosomatic ones. I noticed this because my friend with it started making odd motor movements psychosomatically after he was diagnosed. Asperger's should be eliminated, as a lot of these people who allegedly have it have no symptoms of autism. Thus, only high-functioning autism should be considered, and AS should be eliminated from the Autistic Spectrum Disorders."

Physics Forum Link



wavefreak58
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Sep 2010
Age: 66
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,419
Location: Western New York

12 Nov 2010, 4:01 pm

Maolcolm wrote:
It's fascinating that until fairly recently AS was not known to exist, and even today there are still those who dismiss AS as a fabrication and an illegitimate excuse for 'strange', 'selfish' or 'unsociable' behaviour.

There are certain parallels with the disdainful attitudes displayed here towards those who entertain the notion of "Indigo" children etc.

I know, I know, "It's not the same". But then, it never is is it? It's always "different" when it affects us.


Indigo children are described via an entirely different paradigm than psychiatric disorders. This in itself makes the concept problematic. The idea of Indigo Children strikes me as an attempt to provide meaning to such outwardly disabling things as autism. This is one place where science fails us. Science can describe autism, and even give is how it came about, but it can never answer why. That there may be no "why" to existence is so discomforting to so many people that they continually seek it.



MONKEY
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 3 Jan 2009
Age: 31
Gender: Female
Posts: 9,896
Location: Stoke, England (sometimes :P)

12 Nov 2010, 4:04 pm

glider18 wrote:
jman wrote:
...Wouldn't you rather be seen to have psychic abilties that could change the world or would you guys rather have a disparaging label like aspergers syndrome stuck to you? :roll:

ASPERGER'S SYNDROME
Image


PSYCHIC
Image

Hmm...I think I will take Asperger's Syndrome.


They both look quite similar actually :lmao:


_________________
What film do atheists watch on Christmas?
Coincidence on 34th street.


Maolcolm
Snowy Owl
Snowy Owl

User avatar

Joined: 22 Oct 2010
Age: 53
Gender: Male
Posts: 168

12 Nov 2010, 4:19 pm

wavefreak58 wrote:
Indigo children are described via an entirely different paradigm than psychiatric disorders.


I agree, which is why I said "I know, "it's not the same". But the attitudes displayed are essentially the same and both derive from seeing something as absurd because our belief system does not allow for it. The paradigms may be different but the attitudes and responses that arise from encountering ideas which contradict our belief system are very much the same. That was what I was referring to. I'm, just not a fan of sneering and dismissive attitudes to things which don't fit our current world view. Socrates said "I am the wisest man alive, for I know one thing, and that is that I know nothing" and I tend to agree with his perspective. Therefore the more insistent people are in their judgments about what is "ridiculous" or "impossible" the more unwise they appear to be.

Quote:
This in itself makes the concept problematic. The idea of Indigo Children strikes me as an attempt to provide meaning to such outwardly disabling things as autism. This is one place where science fails us. Science can describe autism, and even give is how it came about, but it can never answer why. That there may be no "why" to existence is so discomforting to so many people that they continually seek it.


Yes, that's possible. Although, as far as I know the notion of Indigo children did not arise in relation to autism.

It's interesting that Tony Attwood posits something not a million miles away from this idea with his suggestion that Aspergers has persisted perhaps as a vital part of evolution for humans in that it allows for leaps in understanding which will then aid in the evolution of all mankind. The 'Indigo Child' idea suggests something similar, as far as I know, but with a decidedly more 'spiritual' flavor.



j0sh
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 18 Nov 2008
Age: 47
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,191
Location: Tampa, Florida

12 Nov 2010, 5:25 pm

glider18 wrote:
jman wrote:
...Wouldn't you rather be seen to have psychic abilties that could change the world or would you guys rather have a disparaging label like aspergers syndrome stuck to you? :roll:

ASPERGER'S SYNDROME
Image


PSYCHIC
Image

Hmm...I think I will take Asperger's Syndrome.


You don't like wearing hats?



buryuntime
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 Dec 2008
Age: 86
Gender: Female
Posts: 3,662

12 Nov 2010, 5:30 pm

I thought children with "ADHD" were indigo, not autistic. The autistic children are the product of vaccinations and toxins in the brain, duh.



Janissy
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 5 May 2009
Age: 58
Gender: Female
Posts: 6,450
Location: x

12 Nov 2010, 5:42 pm

Maolcolm wrote:
wavefreak58 wrote:
Indigo children are described via an entirely different paradigm than psychiatric disorders.


I agree, which is why I said "I know, "it's not the same". But the attitudes displayed are essentially the same and both derive from seeing something as absurd because our belief system does not allow for it. The paradigms may be different but the attitudes and responses that arise from encountering ideas which contradict our belief system are very much the same. That was what I was referring to. I'm, just not a fan of sneering and dismissive attitudes to things which don't fit our current world view. Socrates said "I am the wisest man alive, for I know one thing, and that is that I know nothing" and I tend to agree with his perspective. Therefore the more insistent people are in their judgments about what is "ridiculous" or "impossible" the more unwise they appear to be.

.


When considering which paradigm-challenging idea I should take seriously, I consider the source. If somebody with a New Age blog and a lot of links selling crystals says something paradigm-challenging, I'm not inclined to take it seriously. If Stephen Hawking says it, I am. When it comes to odd things which are outside the scientific model I am used to, I am more inclined to listen to an actual shaman who comes from a long-established shamanic tradition within his own culture than I am to listen to somebody who visited that shaman. I am open to considering new ideas. But only if those new ideas come from a source I respect as knowledgeable.



DandelionFireworks
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 16 May 2010
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,011

12 Nov 2010, 5:59 pm

Your list doesn't even indicate that I am an Indigo.

The problem with this is that there's a group of people. Let's call them Dandelions. Dandelions are just plain different from other people.

Doctors look at Dandelions and decide there's a group of people who are different, so they have a disorder, and they name it Asperger's Syndrome. If this stayed there, that would be well and good, but then they pathologize and attempt to "cure" something that wasn't a problem anyway.

New-Agers look at Dandelions and see that there's a group of people who are different. They identify what the outward traits are, and they call them Indigo, and if it stayed there, this would be well and good. But then they try to come up with an explanation for WHY, and what it means, which is also an admirable pursuit, but the conclusions you've come to are false.

So. What do I, as a Dandelion, call myself? I call myself an Aspie because most of the others I know who are like me use that label. I also use this label so as not to incur the scorn that follows calling yourself an Indigo, not to mention I don't know much about what you've learned. It would be nice to compare notes. We could do studies free of pathologizing, though not free of bias.

The thing is, you're looking at and describing a real phenomenon, and you realize that the observable behavior is the tip of the iceberg, and so you try to figure out what's under the water. Great so far. But from there, what you've come up with is just wrong.

You're not the only one to get stuff wrong. Calling it Asperger's Syndrome doesn't magically make you able to discern truth. If yours were the prevailing view, things might be better for us, but not because you're right, just because you venerate us rather than seek to exterminate us. If instead of Dandelions who were considered Aspies or Indigos, it were blue-eyed blondes, both would be equally valid labels and both would lead to stupid assumptions.

But there's a movement to be able to call ourselves Aspies WITHOUT the stupid assumptions. Why take the label Indigo and start the same thing from square one?


_________________
I'm using a non-verbal right now. I wish you could see it. --dyingofpoetry

NOT A DOCTOR


Coldkick
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

User avatar

Joined: 29 Jun 2010
Age: 30
Gender: Male
Posts: 397
Location: Sarnia, Ontario

12 Nov 2010, 6:03 pm

We are more than Indigos we are Star People

Star People

A little excerpt if you don;t want to take the time to look through it

Catherine Adams wrote:
# Loneliness, as if you do not belong here or do not have family here
# A special event or visit from someone that made you feel connected with Home at around age 5
# An illness, accident or event that served to isolate you for a time at around age 11 or 12
# Impatient with earth life, used to doing things instantaneously (do you ever accidentally walk through furniture as you move to the other side of a room?)
# Avoidance of religious dogma, racial separateness, martyr mythologies, rescue mythologies... realizing all you have to be is YOU
# An extra vertebra
# A much lower basal body temperature
# Very sensitive, to the point of having a hard time blending... dislike of killing animals, of hurting others, etc.
# A late bloomer
# Empathic (picking up others feelings and thinking they are your feelings)
# Dislike of crudeness or harsh behavior
# Wanting your path in life to contribute to humanity, the environment or the Earth
# Talents in areas such as understanding advanced physics, healing or working with crystals, thinking in symbols and colors rather than words, telepathic, clairvoyant, healing abilities, etc. Talents can run a huge range of expressions, but they will be out of the norm, and the use and expression of them is expanding to whatever field you are in. It may be that you are a counselor and your ideas expand people's sense of what is possible. You may pioneer a new branch of study in some field. You may light up a room just by walking into it.
# You feel you are in a rush, as if you are on a mission, and you have limited time.


Gah, It does fit us more, but it doesn't change the fact that there is no scientific basis.



ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 18 Jun 2008
Gender: Female
Posts: 12,265

12 Nov 2010, 6:08 pm

jman wrote:
I seem to have alot of traits described on the site

why don;t you guys buy into that?

Wouldn't you rather be seen to have psychic abilties that could change the world or would you guys rather have a disparaging label like aspergers syndrome stuck to you? :roll:

I've been told I have psychic abilities, to some extent, and yeah, it is more positive sounding than a name like Asperger's Syndrome. People often think negative things when they hear the word "syndrome" and they don't understand how it can be positive.



Severus
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 9 Sep 2010
Age: 49
Gender: Female
Posts: 719

12 Nov 2010, 6:18 pm

Ah, please, don't give me any of this indigo stuff.



Maolcolm
Snowy Owl
Snowy Owl

User avatar

Joined: 22 Oct 2010
Age: 53
Gender: Male
Posts: 168

12 Nov 2010, 8:12 pm

Janissy wrote:
When considering which paradigm-challenging idea I should take seriously, I consider the source. If somebody with a New Age blog and a lot of links selling crystals says something paradigm-challenging, I'm not inclined to take it seriously. If Stephen Hawking says it, I am.....I am open to considering new ideas. But only if those new ideas come from a source I respect as knowledgeable.


Playing Devils Advocate, it could be said that this amounts to being willing to have your 'paradigm challenged' only by those who already operate within your preferred paradigm. That's perhaps something of a convenient catch 22, as those who share your paradigm are rather less likely to want to or be capable of challenging it. As Einstein said - and I think the general principle can be extended and applied - “You can never solve a problem on the level on which it was created”.

But I take your point and I think we all operate that way to some degree.

I'm certainly no expert on what 'actual shaman' say about the concept of Indigo Children in this time period, but as far as I know, respected Elders in many tradition (such as the Hopi) do endorse remarkably similar concepts. But I'd have to do some research to demonstrate this and most likely nobody cares that much, myself included LOL.



Last edited by Maolcolm on 12 Nov 2010, 8:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

mgran
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 May 2009
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,864

12 Nov 2010, 8:20 pm

What a load of crap.



Maolcolm
Snowy Owl
Snowy Owl

User avatar

Joined: 22 Oct 2010
Age: 53
Gender: Male
Posts: 168

12 Nov 2010, 8:25 pm

mgran wrote:
What a load of crap.


Congratulations, you just answered the koan, 'What is the sound of one mind closing?' LOL.

You could be right. But then again....



nthach
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 28 Feb 2008
Age: 39
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,457
Location: SF Bay Area

12 Nov 2010, 8:31 pm

Put the LSD/'shrooms/peyote down and walk away slowly.



Cuterebra
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

User avatar

Joined: 20 Feb 2010
Age: 45
Gender: Female
Posts: 361

12 Nov 2010, 8:32 pm

Don't get me wrong, I think the Indigo Children thing is a bunch of New Age nuttiness, but I'm absolutely fascinated by the fact that people are making the correlation with aspies. Whether it's real or not is beside the point. In a way, the two are now linked by language in our minds, where we have all made the association between them. Words are powerful.