The site "The Neurotypical". What do you think?

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Yes, not only is the site offensive to autistics but is also actually offensive to NTs too, or anyone really.
I mean, how do we know that it wasn't written by some narcissist sociopath or something? They're brilliant at manipulating others into thinking their way, in a callous sort of way, and making themselves look the victim when actually they are the insensitive ones that are bad at relationships.

Anybody who would create a site like that doesn't have all his/her marbles.

That's why I ignore these sorts of sites.

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THANK YOU...THANK YOU...

What disturbs me is the comments section on the site where people discuss their "awful" relationships with their "awful" ASD partners. It's not so much the comments, it's the amount of comments. Are there really that many people with such miserable experiences with autistics? When people read it, they will think "oh, lots of people have had bad experiences with ASD partners, so I will steer clear of ASD people too."
It's like they are all focussing on the lack of empathy BS and nitpicking. I don't know.
But sites like that are the reason I don't tell anyone that I have ASD. Those sites are made purposely to make us feel ashamed.

This was one of the comments. How the hell does this even make sense? How is feeling offended by their s**t lacking cognitive empathy? Do they even know the meaning of the word?

That is not generally true, although it is true for a small minority of kids diagnosed with autism. See the separate thread "Losing" Autism diagnoses/"Recovering" from autism for more details and discussion.

"The Neurotypical" is one of several similar websites that have been around for a long time. The oldest of these, that I'm aware of, is FAAAS (Families of Adults Affected by Asperger's Syndrome), founded in 1997. Others include "Heartless Asperger's," "Asperger Partner," and the website of a psychotherapist named Maxine Aston.

As far as I can tell, these websites came into being before much if any constructive support had emerged for neurodiverse couples. Nowadays there are also much better, more constructive resources available. I listed some of them in this post over a year ago.

As near as I can make out from looking around on the Internet, approximately half of the children diagnosed as ADHD outgrow it and approximately none of the children diagnosed as autistic outgrow it.

Kafka trap?

Agree with us to prove to us you have empathy. You don't agree with us and think we are a hate site because you are offended about hearing how your behavior harms us, proof you lack empathy.

I really do believe they actually think this. They think if we actually had empathy, we would feel guilty and bad for ourselves for the pain we put people through. We would not be upset and offended. We would feel guilty and feel bad than playing the victim.

Honestly this website looks like a website I would see with personality disorders and it's politically correct to attack cluster B disorders. If it were about schizophrenia, ADHD, etc. it would be seen as bigotry and an attack.

Then they seriously need educating about autism and empathy. I mean, all the people at school who belittled me, humiliated me, rejected me, made me feel hurt and worthless, and said anything they could to hurt my feelings - simply because they didn't understand autism even though they knew I had it - didn't seem to express a hint of guilt or remorse. I bet even now they've forgotten me and are happily getting on with their lives. And I did nothing to deserve such unfair treatment, I was a kind and thoughtful child who would never want to upset anybody. I just wasn't so skilled socially as they were, although it didn't mean I was socially clueless.



That is the exact word I was looking for but couldn't remember it.

Is it still a kafka trap if someone actually believes what they are saying?

Not sure.


Another thing that has really annoyed me was something I read from an NT spouse of an Aspie on another autism hate site (it might have been on the heartlessaspergers one). She was complaining because she'd been fired from her job and so was unemployed while her Aspie husband worked full-time to pay the bills and mortgage, etc. Her complaint was that the husband was working too much and didn't have time for her, and when he did come home from a hard day's work he was too tired and grouchy. She said that he did not care about her, and she said that if he did care about her he would have looked for a better paying job so that he could work less hours and still afford to pay everything and give her all the attention she wants.
This woman sounded like a selfish and ungrateful b***h with a complete lack of understanding, and SHE had the cheek to call him that. Working full-time is exhausting for everyone, but especially for an Aspie who probably has to mask all day and likes time to himself. And maybe he's happy in that particular job or he can't find another job that's higher paid. If she had better empathy she would understand that he is working hard to support them both (not sure why she got fired BTW) and she'd understand why he feels tired when he gets home. But she's acting like a spoilt teenager.

Not triggered yet? Then get this: All the replies were all like "aw, poor you, having to put up with that, it's time to end this relationship and look for someone who cares, ie an NT man", and they were also calling him "selfish, uncaring, immature".

Do these people just use these hate sites to nitpick at their Aspie spouses? It's like an Aspie could save 10 people from drowning and would still be labelled as uncaring, not because of what they do or don't do but because they're autistic and so many people are so hung up on the "lack empathy" BS that they don't think about anything else.

The site helped me a lot to understand that NT women expect so much more from their mate, more than I imagined!! I would never be able to communicate as much, show so much affection, have so much sex, etc, etc. The difference between me and NT men is indeed pervasive and NT women seems like they just very painfully feel the difference, and I don't blame them for being angry that they got cheated out of a normal relationship. The way I see it, a bad NT relationship still has those NT communication things, be it even bad ones, and better than no communication at all for the NT women.. it is hard to put a finger on what that NT stuff is, but when it is missing, it is very noticeable.. like my mom used to complain about my NT dad who she never liked - 'he could be good or bad, but I just wish he could be anybody.. as it is, the person is just missing in all the ways.'

I wrote a paper about how the 'research' on the website is just amateur collection of reports from various women, and not done according to any research protocols. It sums up to qualitative research with no inclusion criteria, personal accounts and case reports of women's bad experiences with AS men. No wonder it has a negative bias, because the inclusion criteria is biased toward women with bad experiences. I doubt she can get funding for her 'research', because it would never be allowed into a college program. I doubt her 'research' is taught in psychology classes, although it may be mentioned perhaps. AS is a developmental disorder that makes relationships difficult, so you knowing that, you don't need to do research to know that women who marry AS men will experience less satisfaction.

I don't think she is doing the women who complain on her site any favor. It's just dragging them into more misery and making them stuck there. She herself is stuck in negativity, perpetually blaming her former AS husband for ruining her life, decades later after they divorced, instead of moving on with her life to something positive. People like to feel validated, and many therapists will give you that satisfaction and take your money, despite it being bad for you in the long run to be complaining and not moving on to something positive. The first thing many cheap/bad and unscrupulous therapists will do, is get you to start blaming and criticizing your parents for being wrong, abusive or neglectful. Never mind that some people have no parents at all, that you got so much benefit from just the basics of not being an orphan, and that being a parent is overall challenging and you gain nothing from complaining about them!

Yes, a lot of the women could not get a popular/hot/socially astute NT man, and instead, they went for an AS man with a steady job. Then, they got bored and felt neglected. Never mind, these women may not have jobs themselves, may not be of great interest to NT men due to their body type or their personality. An NT man can beat a woman, be in prison, sell drugs, be unemployed, abuse her financially and she will still love him.. but an AS man can hold a job and pay bills and put effort, and she will still resent him. You cannot buy love from women by being 'nice' to them.. they either like you, or not. If they like you, they will be more inclined to 'appreciate' you.. but the AS men in these comments lacked the qualities that would make women like them.. so the women have this existential feeling of being cheated by life, because they are with men who do not deserve them in the first place, due to absence of communication and NT personality.

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That does sum it up. Thank you for explaining.

As an Aspie I don't seem to find romantic relationships that difficult. I have an NT boyfriend, and I can say that my ASD doesn't seem to interfere negatively in the emotional and communicative areas of the relationship.
My AS-related flaws are probably:-
- Laughing at a lot of odd things (but not inappropriately)
- Repeating myself (not excessively though)
- Impulsive chattering (probably due to ADHD)
- Ironically TOO MUCH expressing feelings and thoughts
- Extreme affection, constantly telling him how much I love him and that I mean it
- Can be hyper and he does sometimes get annoyed, which I'm aware of, but he still loves me and loves being with me
- I get jumpy or anxious, which he does criticise me about, even though I tell him that I can't help it
- Intolerance to loud bodily functions like when he coughs or sneezes (he was a heavy smoker but is quitting because he got diagnosed with COPD), it literally hurts my ears and I sometimes have to put my fingers in my ears. But I do have sympathy, but at the same time I can't help my ears hurting no more than he can help coughing or sneezing
- I'm not the best cook in the world so he usually cooks, but he's actually never handled a vacuum or an iron (it's true!), so I do those sorts of chores

Errm, that's about it I think. Our relationship is based on true love, communication, compromising, trust, happiness, etc.
There are also differences we have, but not because of him being NT and me being Aspie. It's more the typical male and female differences.

In fact, he is drinking less and has found smoking easier to quit, all because I am the first true girlfriend he's had who doesn't bring him stress. His ex-wife (NT) cheated on him, took all his money and nearly caused him to have a breakdown. He lost trust in women for a long time, until he met me. And he says that he can trust me 100%. I have even told him that if he ever does feel worried about losing me, he's only got to say and I will understand because of the way he has been treated. He said he's never met someone so understanding as me. He calls me "emotionally bright". And he's not taking advantage of me either; he truly loves me. And we've been together for 6 years.

So there you have it, one successful Aspie-NT relationship.

I think you fall into the category of AS women who have the quality of interest and affection toward a mate. That is an NT quality. I know an AS guy whose AS gf is like that, but only toward him. My crappy therapist would have called it being 'relational.'

I think many, probably most of us are capable of "interest and affection toward a mate," but just have difficulty expressing it in ways that feel natural to NT's.

Also, if indeed there is any truth to Simon Baron-Cohen's "extreme male brain" hypothesis, one likely consequence would be that it is more difficult, on average, for most autistic men to relate to NT women than for most autistic women to relate to NT men.