Could they like us?

Post Reply New Topic

All the people who reject us, distance from us, cut contact with us, etc... Could something make them find us less unpleasant?

I ask this because I see a lot written here about educating people, about tolerance, and I wonder if being educated about AS and being a tolerant person would make them find us OK for friendship.

Because it's not like gays, or blacks or Jews - where once you overcome your bias, they're just like anyone else. With Aspies - after you've gotten over the prejudice, you still have an "alien form" to deal with...

My two cents: after my own experiences with As and other things I've witnessed/heard about I really can't give humanity much credit to be gracious, charitable, accommodating, accepting or understanding, with my family the main offenders. (I am always asked to change but they don't have to do sh*t.)

I think that "they" (neurotypicals) can absolutely like people with AS. It will take work on both of the part of the Neurotypical person AND the person with AS.

Firstly, the person with AS has to actually care somewhat about other people. I know of people with AS that admitted to really not caring about hearing anyone's story or being with anyone. In this particular case - it will be hard for a Neurotypical to "like" the person with AS. They will respect them as a human being, but will never be friends with them.

As for people with AS who truly do care about others - just that they have trouble with social cues and social relations - some of these skills can be learned. Along with genuine interest in relating to a Neurotypical and understanding on the part of the Neurotypical of the unique challenges that the person with AS has - a true friendship can be formed.

I mention this workshop in some of my posts and it deserves mention here as well. I took a workshop called "Non Violent Communication" I learned specific language to use to identify feelings in myself and others. I found this method of communicating to be deeply respectful and wonderfully clear (which I thrive on). With genuine interest in forming friendships and positive relations with neurotypicals and the skills to do this - I think that we can absolutely be "less unpleasant" - even downright wonderful

It goes like this (in my experience):

1) First few minutes of meeting me: OMG he's cute! And smart! Let's talk.

2) Then very quickly: Hey this guy is weird/antisocial/arrogant/smartass, I want nothing to do with him!

3) After a few months: hey this guy is cool and nice and kind. Why did I think he was weird???!

The challenge for us is moving from 2 to 3. I've only been able to do that with people who have no choice but to stick around me: school, work, neighbors. A random person I meet would not give me the chance.

Gays and Jews and whatnot are still different after you get to know them. Jewish people have customs most people don't have, at least to some degree; and gay relationships, while they have a lot of parallel to straight ones, will always be a bit different too. Black Americans have enough of a culture that you can get a college degree studying it.

It's not that "when you get to know them, they're not so different"; it's, "when you get to know them, you stop seeing the differences as preeminent." There's a lot more that's similar between a straight guy and a gay guy than there is that's different. The focus shifts. Similarly, there's more that an Aspie and an NT have in common than they have that's different--simply because they're both human.

Some people can't ever be educated; the dyed-in-the-wool bigots. But some people, if you point them in the right direction, will just about educate themselves, because they are the sort who don't realize they're prejudiced and become ashamed of it once they do realize it. Those people--and that's most NTs, I think--are just a few short steps away from being OK with the fact that there are an awful lot of weirdos in the world.

Shortly after I got out of the Navy I enter into an Aircraft Maintenance school at a local community college. This Aircrat Maintenance program was also used by a Saudi Airline to train many of thier Mechanics. Everyday at 8 am we would get a break from class when we could go over to the caffateria and get some breakfast. They had culinary school there so it was an opportunity to get some really good food cheap. So I would load up my plate with eggs, bacon and sausage and, go sit next to my school mates and chow down. It took several weeks of Dark brooding hate filled stares before one of them got up the courage to kindly ask me to eat my pork product somewhere else. I had no clue.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that when your very nature challenges people's deeply held social conventions, it's going to be hard for them to ever except you for anything else other then a disruption.

I know a friend with Asperger's and I understand her fine, in fact we're in Love. I think it's certainly possible, as I think the general trend is that the Aspie simply has to work around their weak points or get the other to understand that the lack of empathy is not intended to be hurtful.

A more problematic scenario is where the Aspie has multiple bad experiences which cause them to withdraw, lose affect, or even begin to despise others, and this is when it is far harder for the neurotypical person to try and work with them.

Honestly though this is just how I understood it, so perhaps I've misunderstood bits, the latter point is a very similar defense system I use as a Schizoid to protect my 'true' personality, in which I create a flamboyant, ostentatious, mostly contemptuous alias and hide behind it, thus leaving my 'actual' personality intact. That friend is the only person I feel comfortable being real with, and vice-versa, though I have before got frustrated when she's accidentally been shunning me, unaware of my chagrin.

I voted, but I think the question is wrong because it lumps people into one "they". People are varied. Including those have have been rejecting towards aspies they've encountered.

Basically, we can't force others to change. Some people will respond well to being educated or such. Others won't. Best to spend one's friendship time and energy on those who are accepting.

I am so lucky to have a social situation that's ongoing so that friendships truly can take time to develop. Not just so others can have the time to realize I'm not weird (well, not in a bad way ), etc. Actually, the big one for me is probably anti-social. Or people just thinking I'm not interested in friendship with them.

For me, it allows me time to notice people, and to realize they are interested in friendship, and to be able to develop a friendship without having to make the effort to stay in contact in order to do so.

From my experience, most NTs get along better with people they normally don't like if they understand there are "special circumstances" that are behind the issue they have a problem with.

Someone who is "odd" is avoided on the basis that they CHOOSE to be that way. When someone realizes that such a person has little to no control or choice over the behavior, they are a lot more understanding.

The more highly evolved NT's are capable of it. I'm convinced that there is something about my bio-electric field that is out of phase with NT's. Because of this my mere physical presence causes them discomfort.

I think that is a hefty chunk of it. I think a lot of Aspies aren't percieved as Aspies. They are perceived as NTs who have chosen to ignore social cues out of sheer stubborness or for some other inexplicable reason. A lot of slack is cut for "can't". No slack at all is cut for "won't". In the absence of a t-shirt reading "I have Aspergers Syndrome and have no idea why your face just wiggled around like that", missed non-verbal signals will be seen as deliberately ignored, not accidentally missed. Get past that and more slack will likely be cut.

As Callista noted, some NTs are one eye-opening paradigm shift away from acceptance of difference. In most cases, this paradigm shift is triggered by discovering somebody they love is autistic or has Aspergers Syndrome. For a lot of the older adults here, this is too little too late. Most of the beneficiaries of this are children or twenty-somethings who have been carrying the diagnosis since childhood. And many people report that family can just as easily go the denial route as the acceptance one.

After someone gets to know me they usually like me. This is not the same as wanting me for a friend though.
At first they think I'm odd, and sometimes even stupid. In a work place for example, even though I have a good resume and the necessary skills, do well on the interview, impress the chain of command that is involved in my hiring, the initial month or two or three (sometimes even a year) is really hard to endure because I do and say things which are misinterpreted and make me appear stupid - until little by little, they see there is a method to my madness, don't know how else to put it, and I begin to solve problems and improve methods and efficiency - and then it's like the veil drops from their eyes and they see me for the person I really am. They don't really want me for a friend, but they respect me, and that's cool. That's enough.

Here, on Wrong Planet, it's a lot different, harder really, for me to feel accepted and be seen as someone worth knowing and respecting. I get ignored a lot and this is really painful for me. For example, I compliment people on their posts and their threads and their creative endeavors and achievements, but rarely if ever do they acknowledge or respond to my compliments or comments, yet they respond to other posters. Why do they ignore me completely, am I chopped liver? I try to participate in threads if I feel I can add something intelligent, informative, constructive. Very few if any, respond or acknowledge my presence in a thread. So why is that? I really can't figure it out. It's a bummer, and the rejection, if that's what it is, throws me back into that old high school mentality and the pain of being intentionally shunned by all the cool people.

Sorry for whining. This has bothered me for a long time. Decided to get it off my chest. Boo Hoo Hoo

Cosmiccat, many people complain of being ignored on here, and if I have to mention one reason why i think it happens, it's that they don't post enough to get noticed. We're (fortunately) masses of people here. Your posts aren't annoying, stupid, exceptional, weird, original enough to be noted, I'm afraid. It's strange that you and I joined at the same time 2 years ago and I only noticed you in the last couple months. Maybe you started posting more lately...? You happen to be one of the people I consider most sensible on these forums, so you did get noticed by me.

BTW, we have a cosmiccat in our local forum in my country, what a coincidence.

And I've tried to make a cartoon of my photo, but didn't succeed in making the Toons program work.

To clarify, I'm not asking about slack getting cut but about active liking. As I wrote on my OP: "I wonder if being educated about AS and being a tolerant person would make them find us OK for friendship"

Quoting Greentea

I don't know whether to laugh or cry.