What do you think?

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When I look at life I wonder why people write books saying Aspergers should change! I do not understand why aspies should have to fit into the n.t mould just to please others! The so called "Norms" do not have a life! I sometimes wish I could get on with n.t's and wish I could be like them! But why? Why should we be in the last class and the n.t's should be in the first class? I do not think it is fair! I feel like the world is tearing apart! I'm not sure if anyone else feels the same way? All my life I've just experienced times with n.t's! All they seem to do is run around in circles! And they do the same mistake over and over again! if I could make the world again! I would make everyone get on and I'd make the world a better place! everything would be free and when it rained I would make the rain glitter like the stars! sadly the world is not like that! but I think it should be! I do not believe aspergers should be changed! I believe that n.t's should change! because their attitude towards people gets them nowhere! I hope that I can feel safe and free in world again! and I hope that others can feel the same! I'll be glad when that day will come!

I'd like to hear your views about what I said!? feel free to say what you want!

Lizzie, you have timed your post quite close to one leaning the other way:

<<How far do you think an aspie can improve?>> also in general discussion.

I wonder if I'm going to sit in the middle and take fire from both sides?

"I do not understand why aspies should have to fit into the n.t mould just to please others"

Especially when, as William Hazlitt put it
"Mankind are a herd of knaves and fools. It is necessary to join the crowd, or get out of their way, in order not to be trampled to death by them."

But look at his two courses of action: it is because the crowd is so unthinking and herdlike that sometimes the best strategy can be to look like (not become) one of them.
At other times, yes the realisation that there is no "must" about fitting in with the crowd can be liberation indeed. Why should I do things the majority way, just because that's what it is? (There may be other reasons: liberated or not, I still drive on the conventional side of the road)

The herding, tribal majority is not going to be changed easily. Some accommodation, and that is going to include cloaking, coping and masking skills, is going to come in very handy.
But aiming to be like them, as a prime objective? No way.

(copied, in main, over to the other thread)

Sorry! I didn't know there was a topic simalar to this one..should I delete this topic?

No, not at all!

I pointed out the coincidence of timing to both threads, and posted a similar reply to each.
I wondered if people might want to tackle the topic form both ends, as it were.

An unsaid policy that exists in the world is that the smaller group is expected to adapt to the larger group. A policy the smaller group is not unvocal about its displeasure with.

I just don't get who wants us to change? The only people directly affected by our condition is ourselves, I spent all of my school years "mirroring" other people, I fitted in well. My school days were no different to anyone elses that I hung out with. One day I thought "hang on, why am I doing this?" and decided I'd just get on with things my own way and nothing changed! I just wasn't affraid that my jokes weren't funny or that I may bore someone so I talked a little more, my friends didn't notice a thing!
I think that yes as a group we are dismissed as second class citicens and even if NT's were to read up on AS then the criteria is quite a scary thing to read and hard for them to see that "inability to understand body language" should be "sometimes AS ppl are a little confused about this but usually learn what it means after the first missunderstanding" If they met us personaly and as indeviduals I doubt this opinion that we should change would stick.

I don't think the aim is to be an NT yourself, but to learn to communicate with NT's so that you can benefit from them and they from you.

Increased tolerance for people who are different would, however, be much appreciated from the NT community.

When I have tried to fit in with n.t's it has never been easy for me! When I talk to n.t's they just get angry at me and don't have the patience to understand why I say the things I do! I have bled for n.t's and have been as nice as I possibly can to them! but every time I just fall out with them no matter how hard I try! am I not an asd because I don't copy the n.t behaviour? or am I not an n.t or an aspie at all? I was badly bullied at school because I couldn't adapt! when I try to adapt it feels so wrong and so inhuman of me to do so! I am so confused I wish I knew what I was! is there something wrong with me? or am I just a stubborn asperger? I'd really like to know!

Also thanks for the comments! ^_^

No, there's nothing wrong with you. (although maybe you are stubborn; you would know better than I) You can only do so much. You can try to engage with "typical" people, and you do have to do this on their terms, to some degree. Once people get to know you better, then they can accept your differences more easily. It's just that the opening stages of making acquaintainces is a real nusance! Also, the older you get, the more self-confidence you gain and you don't feel the need to be socially accepted as much, as long as you have some friends. One of the hardest things for me to do is to learn to be misunderstood and not be bothered by it.

To sell books

I've noticed a lot of people like parents of AS children are at WP looking for answers for their childs problem. There will always be people that try and make money off of anything.

The suffering industry is big money,people find a group of people suffering from something and pretend to be the answer to their problem.

It's not that ASD books say to change it,it's coping strategies for dealing with the difficulties that are discussed usually,these are a good thing to an extent because our NT dominant societies are not going to change for us any time soon,so we need to know the basics to be able to cope with them.
Being different to the majority is often seen as a threat and isn't generally welcome.
But that is their problem if they are prejudiced against those who are different to them.

Just as all Aspie's are individuals and different from one another, so are NTs. People often don't know how to handle what they don't understand ... places like this will only help. I see how difficult it is though, since knowledge of AS is so new, and so limited. It's no different than the intolerance you see in people for others' races, religions, ways of thinking, etc. All anyone can do is keep trying to learn and grown and be compassionate for others, no matter the differences.

I haven't found any of the AS books I've read suggesting that Aspies should try to change who they are ... what's offered is information describing the differences, and developing mechanisms for coping with a society that doesn't recognize or understand. We don't have alot of choices about who we are when we arrive in the world. We all have our strengthes and weaknesses ... the best you can do is work on being the best person you can be, by your own definition, because you're not going to change anything external to you.

I hear you, KoR, and take your point, but also think you are being optimistic. It isn't just their problem as long as they are in the majority and setting the tone of society.

Even researchers slip into the "majority as ideal" mode if they are at all inattentive: look at this little quote:
"When healthy people watch a film of moving triangles and a circle, they often imagine that the objects have social relationships ("The big triangle is helping the little triangle out of the square."). When people with autism look at the same clip, they see independent objects. ("The small triangle and the large triangle are moving to the right. The square isn't moving."). "

Personally I'd consider the second statement more accurate, and the first loaded with unjustified anthropomorphism, but then I am autistic. And clearly not healthy, by this account.