Can someone have these traits and NOT be on the spectrum?

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I feel as though I am being redundant here. I let the threads where people were trying to call some of us out as fakes and wannabees get to me a little, and after lengthy pondering, I have decided to post this...it feels redundant, because I have probably posted threads like this in the past.

I am assessed as having aspergers (have said it a million times)A psychiatrist I visited in an attempt to get on ADD meds agreed with the assessment...but neither of these is a real diagnosis.

There are things about be that are atypical (but not unheard of) for a person with Asperger's...namely, I have a somewhat alternative lifestyle and help run a venue....where I am subjected to loud music every night...it took me a long time to get used to this and though it is the sort of job where it is good to have decent social skills, mine range from hospitable-but unconventional to just plain bad....where i alienate the people I am hosting...
I have been in a fair number of relationships, but I think this has had to do with my being in a band since I was young...(singing is one of my main special interests, and my parents let me do what I wanted)

Also, I am very left-handed right-brained written-word-oriented....

Since childhood, I have walked on my tiptoes
Have never been good with eye contact....but might have gone through phases where I made more eye contact...I really don't know...
I don't know if I lined things up, but I am pretty sure I stacked things...because I stacked my books...
I was really late to tie my shoes, dress myself properly, stop drinking out of a bottle (as a matter of preference) and not wet the bed...
I did very badly in school, but made very high scores on standardized tests.
I was not really shy, but I had no sense of boundaries and was always being unintentionally rude.
My messy developmental traits seemed to be at their worst between the ages of 6 and 10, and things got to be somewhat better once I hit puberty...but i really had to struggle to seem on par with what peers there were who would have anything to do with me...

There have been times when I have been able to be very socially gregarious...but not in a "normal" sort of way...

i have always had funny voice issues...

i have issues with severe executive dysfunction, ADD traits, OCD-ish hoarding (which runs in the family)

I could list more things but will stop there.

I have been accused by some people who are close to me of being a wannabe or hypochondriac in the past...and I still have doubts all the time about the true nature of my condition....Maybe it was caused by something else...ptsd...head trauma...maybe I amplify my symptoms in my mind...Maybe I really have been worse since I have been on the aspie board....

If I am not a "real" spectumy person, how do I atone for all the hours and hours I have spent every day on WP?

If it is not some form of high-functioning autism that I have, then what on earth else could it possibly be (i guess..aside from the alternative theories I have listed)
My best guess would be ADD with some slightly autistic traits that could be the result of anything (which is what I thought I was in the first place)....and even though I think that ADD is on the spectrum..the larger opinion still places it up in the air, I guess.

I don't know but I will say I never doubted your reasons for being here. This place is for people who find the world confusing and hard and for the people that love the people that do. Whether you have AS or not, you still want to talk to people who know what you mean when you talk about your life. So there.

Really, a lot of those threads that are bothering you, you just can't take seriously. A lot of people start them just to cause trouble. They want to feel special, they want to say that so many people can't have the same disorder they have, so they get up and whine and say that everybody else is a fake, they're the only real one.
A similar-sounding but completely separate sentiment will be echoed by those people who are concerned by the number of people who call themselves aspies but have no problems. This is an issue that is, I believe, being addressed-- both in the narrower terms of how it's thought of on WP, and on wider terms so far as how the spectrum is going to be described in the next DSM. What I'm thinking is that there are people who cannot be diagnosed with an ASD because they don't currently have any impairment, but those traits would need to be taken into account if at some point in the future they needed some kind of psychiatric treatment. A programmer with a good job who associates with other AS-ish people wouldn't have too many problems inherent to their aspie-ness, but if they developed depression, NT-style therapy would be unlikely to help them, because they don't think like an NT and a therapist wouldn't be able to figure them out.

From what I can tell, when non-trolls talk about concerns about non-spectrum people diagnosing themselves or even manipulating a professional into giving them a diagnosis, they have specific examples in mind-- they're speaking in general terms, but it's about specific things they've seen that they've found disturbing. I'm fairly certain that you're not one of those examples.

I believe you have AS.

unless you plan on being professionally diagnosed, don't worry about it!! if you relate to the spectrum and the people on it, just keep doing your thing. it can only be beneficial and beats not having anyone or anything to relate to at all. even if you don 't have an ASD, you clearly have similar symptoms, and threafds here and general info on ASDs can be helpful in managing those symptoms, regardless of the root cause. do not deny yourself this simply because you are not 100% sure.

I personally believe you have AS...IMO though psychology itself is a big mystery and autism is an even bigger one. Sometimes I think that not one "disorder" really describes me perfectly but if you took a little from each, you would have me. Hence, why my diagnosis is pervasive developmental disorder-not otherwise specified/ Obsessive Compulsive Disorder. I also think I have obsessive compulsive PERSONALITY disorder but I don't want to be a hypocondriac. (I also think I have hypocondriac disorder lol) My point is the human brain is so far more complex than we thought ten years ago and I'm sure it's even more complex than we think it is now. The possibitlities are endless and I think human made labels offer a lot of explanations, but at the same time create even more confusion and self doubt. You're here because you relate to people here and it makes you feel better to come to this website ( I assume) so you're obviously on the same brain wave length as most of the people here. The threads you've been reading are useless and they bore me to tears, honestly.

You're obsessing. That's so cute. And worrying yourself into an anxiety attack about nothing, what more evidence do you need?

Besides, which, assessed AS by two different professionals - that's essentially a DX without the rubber stamp required for State Assistance and if you don't need assistance at this point in your life its a moot issue.

I could never point a finger at anyone through the wall of anonymity of the internet and pronounce conclusively what they might or might not have, though I sometimes suspect some who appear out of nowhere with seemingly wildly exaggerated claims, of trolling and baiting for their own amusement or for attention.

I only worry that someone who is just young and shy might grasp the idea that AS is their problem and cling to that as an excuse for sitting alone in their room, rather than get out and risk living a full life, when in fact they're just dealing with routine anxiety and they'd get over it if they'd just get out there and get on the horse. But again, I'm not qualified to say definitively what someone else's problems are, certainly not without ever having even met them.

And I'm sitting alone in my room right now and prefer it, so what do I know?



But that having been said, to answer the question in the OP: Its probably highly unlikely that a person with all those symptoms would NOT be on the spectrum. And until there's a genetic test, that's really all any MH pro has to go by anyway.

It occurs to me that there aren't a lot of NT's here (I know some people will disagree, but I'm not interested in arguing that here). Those that are here seem to have some reason to be here -- autistic kids, spouse, sibling, friend, etc. If autism forums were just cool, fun, interesting places for NT's to hang out, I'd think this place, being an open forum, would be flooded with them. If you don't have such a connection, and keep coming back, I think that that likely does mean something.

I don't care if you're AS or NT. I don't think you're here to cause problems, and if you share symptoms with us, then we can help each other and learn together.

I agree with pretty much everything that has been said so far. If you can't be on the spectrum, Poopylungstuffing, than who can?

I totally understand all the self-doubt, though. I experience it all the time. I've been immersing myself in the study of autism for six years now, at first just to get a handle on how to be a good mother to my AS son and how to advocate for him when teachers don't understand. Sometimes I look at the DSM-IV, and go, "Well, maybe that's me." Who gets to decide what "qualitative impairment" is or what "appropriate for age-level development" is (or whatever the exact words are)? I mean, really? What constitutes normal peer relations for a 42 year old woman? I manage to make a new acquaintance every five years or so, and once in a while they become friends. That suits me, but suspect I'm a bit lacking in that department. Who can say, though? What is the gold standard for "normal"? I'm not greatly impaired by any of my possible AS characteristics, but I certainly was back in the days when I was having to hold down a job. I always just assumed that I was "impaired" by the fact that my bosses and coworkers were a-holes everywhere I worked, but me being on the spectrum seems to explain things as well.

One thing that's certain is everyone on the spectrum is different. I think what happens is someone "knows" an autistic guy, and sees that that guy rocks back and forth and talks about nothing but icebergs, in a too-loud voice. So when someone else, who is not like that, says they are autistic, it's like, "No, you aren't. I've seen a real autistic person, and you aren't anything like him." I wrote a letter to an old friend, who happens to be one of the only people in the world who has ever seen me in a variety of situations (work, roommates, best friends, travel companion). I asked her to tell me what she remembers of me, twenty years later, because I suspect I might be on the spectrum, and I'm curious to know how I have appeared to others. She wrote all kinds of lovely stuff, but ultimately said, "You were a bit quirky and unique, but definitely not mentally ill." Which of course, wasn't helpful at all, but just reminded me that people don't have a clue about autism.

I've noticed that a lot of times I come here to WP and the people I most understand and whose view of the world most strikes a chord with me, are the people who are have been diagnosed autistic since they were small children, and who have no doubt that they are on the spectrum. I find that interesting, and am not sure what it means. I guess perhaps it means that, in my mind, I see the world like an autistic person does. I've always been aware that other people, in general, seem to experience the world in a way that seems strange to me. But I have no clue how other people see me, other than the fact that no one has ever suggested I might be on the spectrum. I managed to join the military (and be utterly miserable there), get a college degree (without making a single friend), and get married (happily, to a computer geek who is watching "The Prisoner" right now.) Apparently autistic people aren't supposed to be able to do those things, so who knows? A doctor thought I was mentally ret*d when I was very little, because I didn't smile. Then I taught myself to read at 2.5, and the idea of me being mentally ret*d was dismissed. Apparently I have a high IQ, but I don't remember being tested officially, or why anyone would have had that done.

Oh, sorry, I'm going on and on about me, as always. Me me me. I'm tempted to delete it, since it's too much about "me", but I've spent all this time typing it, and maybe someone will get something out of it. (Like a headache.) I'll shut up now.

I'm convinced you are AS, and that's good enough for me.

no don't delete it!..I think it is good to go on about "you you you" sometimes...nothing shameful in that..I am in a loud place and my thoughts are scrambled...just deleted most of this post because it was too jumbly...

I enjoy reading your posts elderwanda. I wish I was as articulate as you. I might be able to pull it off if I spend several hours writing and rewriting.

The two main diagnostic points are [for an adult]:

A lack of social reciprocation, which manifests in a few different ways
+
the typical area of obsessive focus

The second point can be absent, but there'll be other secondary points there, like a need for routine and order, funny motor mannerisms (walking on your toes...), and/or other repetitive behaviours that serve no noticeable useful purpose to outside observers.

(The lack of appreciation and exhibiting of nonverbal cues goes without saying.)

Poopylungstuffing, I think many of the things you describe are very spectrum-like, especially when put together (I mean, one does not get on the spectrum for one trait alone).
Also, as we know, being on the spectrum doesn't mean having all traits. As for me, I'm not especially bothered by loud noise in itself either.

A somewhat alternative lifestyle you can have both on the spectrum and outside. Maybe it's even more likely on the spectrum, because we tend to be more unconventional in some areas?

As for helping running a venue (maybe you could explain to me what it is exactly, as I didn't find suiting translations for it in my dictionary?): I've been volunteering in a drop-in-centre for more than 5 years now, which may sound quite un-spectrum-like too, but am still on the spectrum.
I'm very social I guess, though also socially awkward at times, and may need a pause during a social gathering.
Relationships are not that uncommon either for spectrum people, band or not. But not having had them is common too, eg. I have never had any.

Just my thoughts.

And, of course, WP is for all who want to join.
And IMO you certainly make some great contributions to this place. I would miss your posts if they weren't there.

My venue is an art and music space. We have an art gallery and local and touring bands play here all the time...When we first opened, I used to freak out and have meltdowns/panic attacks on a regular basis from all the noise and stress, but i have gotten used to it over the years.
My partner has issues, and he sorta "collects" people who have mental issues to be his friends...that is partially why he pursued me...
His best friend/music partner for years has been our bi-polar schizoaffective friend..who has some autistic traits.

I cannot say that I have a complete and utter lack of social reciprocation, but it is a lot more difficult for me than for most of the people around me. There are people who have been coming around for years who I simply cannot talk to without it causing me a lot of stress. There are some acquaintances who I am more comfortable with than others, but I have only been able to bond with a few people. I am not like some people who will meet someone and automatically be their bestest huggy friend...
I can be social if I have a specific thing to talk about..Last night I was chatting up the band Unwed Sailor...but only because I was screen printing some shirts for them and they were fascinated and watching me do it...I never reached a point where I knew any of their names, or could really tell any of them apart, for that matter....But screen printing is something that I can talk about and i can easily explain my entire process from beginning to end to anyone willing to listen.

Despite stuff like this I still have had people say.."I don't think you're autistic..I think you have something else"...(nonspecific)..
Then again...um...I guess...what do they know?

I really should relax about it.