Preoccupation with Evil and Crime

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Almost every single person on the spectrum I've met (myself included) has an interest in serial killers, sociopaths, rapists, and such.

I have several theories about why this is (these sound terrible and feel free to shoot them down)

1. People who commit hideous crimes are outsiders and the minds of outsiders are east to relate to for someone on the spectrum who's probably been bullied.

2. It's a rationalization that so-called "normal people" that we've always been persuaded to mimic are not all good.

3. It's fascinating for an autistic person who's preoccupied with rules to see rules broken to this extent.


Anyone else have theories? I don't like to think and I don't think it's true that Aspies are aspiring criminals.

I also have this fascination but can never EVER see myself doing any of the things I read about. I am horrified at the idea, really. I dont have any theories as to why it would be a spectrum trait or common interest. I didnt realize it was, anyway, There is a certain complexit to the criminal mind that maybe holds the fascination for us. It is a puzzle, and maybe puzzles are a common interest in ASDs????

I love to talk about or imagine gruesome things, like decapitation, or body parts being chopped off. However, I'm not a dangerous person. I would never do it in real life.

I have such an interest, but would never think of doing any of the things I read about. We're Aspies, not sociopaths!

~Kate

Ya I'm not CRAZY! I had an interest in killers and such and find Darth Vader/Voldemort more interesting than Luke or Harry Potter as characters that is.

I've imagined gruesome killing stuff too. It freaked my parents out LOL! I made 2 research papers on Serial Killers while I was in College. I heard from an old friend who took a gun to school and shot into the roof and it kind of freaked me out a little (so talk/read/write sure study PROBABLY NOT!) LOL!

I love "The Wire," I love mafia movies, and I especially *love* Darth Vader. Though I don't know why, because I would *never* do any of the horrible things these people do.

I know I used to be fascinated by the mind workings of someone who could go all the way to killing. It felt to me like madness...like that's the definition of crazy, crossing that line. I don't like to 'watch' crimes being committed, like on TV. But my daughter who is AS...she LOVES crime shows. A church friend introduced her to NCIS, and since then....she's got a few she HAS to watch...like or else.

I think if I was a witch in the Harry Potter world I'd be fascinated with the Dark Arts.
My reason would be that I'd want to do such things against people that have picked on or bullied me. I mean I wouldn't be too much into the whole pure blood thing but I just would like to 'dabble' in the Dark Arts.
I also agree with no. 3.
When I was younger I was into gangster/ mafia films.

Oh I know I do!! ! Such people utterly disgust me in one sense, but they exert a strange fascination in another.


I can definitely relate to #1 and #2, though I don't feel the need to further elaborate on #2. I DO NOT relate to #3 whatsoever. I define myself as an anarchist, so i'm all for breaking many of the rules established by the authoritarian institutions of government, big business, organized religion, the media and the neurotypical/mainstream/bourgeois society in general. However....I abhor sadism, cruelty and abuse of any sort so a "rulebreaker" like Richard Ramirez can go to hell.


Nonetheless....I do not deny the darkness which dwells within my own limbic and paralimbic systems. Supposedly those very primitive and "reptilian" parts of the brain are the seat of the Freudian ID. I have often fantasized about being a serial killer or a mass murderer myself. I don't feel too guilty for this as there is no such thing as a thought crime. There is no sexual componant to these fantasies....only revenge, rage, a hatred of injustice and generalized misanthropy fuels them. I will admit that a "friend" of mine (who turned out to be just another bully) and myself came darn close to being the Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold of the 80's. My father had both the weapons and ammunition to do it and 16 years of torture gave me the desire...however unserious it ultimately proved to be. My "friend" and I were skipping school one day at my house, smoking hash and listening to the Doors song, "The End". In short....we were both angst-ridden teenagers who were sick of life and severely depressed. He wasn't bullied at school too much, but he had his own mental health issues mostly related to his abusive alcoholic father. He was the first one to make the suggestion....he wanted to go grab my dad's AR-15 and various handguns and make our way to Auschwitz.....excuse me....our high school. Though I knew in my heart i'd never go through with this, I followed him up the stairs towards my dad's bedroom anyway. Before we reached the bedroom....I just said "Jason no.....we can't go through with this". He just stared at me for a few seconds without saying a word and then we just walked back downstairs and never harmed a fly. I have never harmed a fly since, but I have no idea what became of Jason. For all I know...he could be dead, in prison or just living a normal life.

Anyway....as much as I hate to admit it....sometimes I have pangs of regret for not going through with it. The rage I keep bottled up inside me has been in check all these long painful years. Sometimes I feel if this rage could be weaponized like plutonium, it would be enough to obliterate all infinity. I'm sure all those who bullied me turned out rather well while I have lived a tortured and impoverished existence thanks to learning/memory problems I won't bother to expand upon in this post. I've done so in countless other posts of mine and if anyone actually cares to know more about them....well.....you know what to do.

At any rate... my rage has pretty much been replaced by hopelessness and despair these days. It was never easy to exert the self-control that has kept me from lashing out in violence. But my strong sense of ethics, fear and ultimately, my revulsion towards violence of any form has kept this demon chained in the depths of my psyche. It's all very complicated actually and rather difficult to explain. Also, I think the fact that I lean towards determinism has helped.

That is.....I really don't believe human beings are any more responsible for their behavior than a killer grizzly bear is. Thus....revenge only makes sense to me on an irrational/emotional level and I try not let my emotions get the best of me, at least where anger is concerned. It never solves anything, it just alienates people further. You go from a harmless dork to a potentially dangerous psychopath....no thanks. So all my rage, hatred of "injustice" and lust for revenge is really meaningless on the rational level. Ultimately reality simply IS...there is no "injustice", no "good", no "evil", no nothing but the iron laws of physics, (however much quantum physics ultimately tweaks a few things), chemistry and biology. There is nothing after death aside from the extinction of consciousness and the transmutation of our energy into something that is no longer "us". I don't claim to be certain of any of this and I leave my mind open to an infinite range of possibilites. I just don't see any good evidence to suggest some other alternative vision of reality. Especially considering the life i've lead, it's very painful to believe that this is all there is. I just don't seem to have the capacity to deny what seems to be reality to me though.....sometimes I wish I did. Sometimes I wish I could at least believe in some all-loving god and that everything will be OK in the end. Even if it wasn't true, perhaps such a belief would provide me with SOME peace and serenity.

Still.....I am fascinated by extremely abnormal human behavior whether we're talking about the comparatively benign abnormalities of ASD, NVLD, Schizophrenia or the nefarious ones of serial killers, sociopaths, dictators, etc....The inner world of humankind fascinates me much more than the outer world of the cosmos. Unless we finally discover some truly "spiritual" dimension to reality, I really can't get too excited by masses of dead, soulless matter billions of light years away which doesn't effect our lives here on earth in any way. In any event....while i'd say most aspies are a fairly peaceful and harmless bunch, I personally know one who has been convicted of some rather horrible crimes. Since it's a small world, i'd rather not be specific or mention any names, but i'm sure most of you have a pretty good idea of the type of crimes i'm referring to.

I'm not saying Asperger's had anything to do with these crimes........but the person it question claims it had everything to do with them. This is just another awful rationalization among countless ones humans use to justify their anti-social behaviors and I don't even feel like dignifying it with any further remarks.


I'd say your theories are pretty much spot on Julia the Great. I really can't think of any others which might explain any possible fascination spectrumers might disproportionately possess for serial killers and company. Their actions are so alien and horrific to me in one sense (in terms of the sadism, cruelty and psychosexual motives of many of them) and yet so familiar in terms of the raw fury, abnormality and "non-humaness" of them.


I think serial killers are motivated by that highest human motivation of all.....the desire to become god. Some, like myself, aspire to omniscience. I desired nothing more than to get as close to omniscience as I could in this lifetime. Like Faust...I would've at least been tempted to sell my soul for all the knowledge in infinity. But alas....my spirit is very willing, but the flesh of my brain is seemingly very weak. To the hell with the bullying and social deficits....herein lies the root of all my misery in this life. Others aspire to omnipotence and i'd say serial killers are often in this category. Maybe you have noticed many criminal profilers and serial killers themselves claim that the desire to "play god" was foundational to their motives. I think everyone wants to be god (I of course don't mean this literally.....or maybe I do....nevermind. That depends on one's individual beliefs about the nature of reality) in their own way even if it doesn't involve having power over others or if they don't admit it, even to themselves. Consider the following:


"The Universe as we seek to make it"


"In the first part we have seen all the numbers as veils of the One, emanations of and therefore corruptions of the One. It is the Universe as we know it, the static universe. Now the Aspirant to Magic is displeased with this state of things. He finds himself but a creature, the farthest removed from the Creator, a number so complex and involved that he can scarely imagine, much less dare to hope for, its reduction to the One.

I am not God. I wish to become God. This is the Hindu conception

I am Malkuth. I wish to become Kether. This is the qabalistic equivalent.

I am a fallen creature. I wish to be redeemed. This is the Christian conception.

I am Malkuth, the fallen daughter. I wish to be set upon the throne of Binah my supernal mother. This is the qabalistic equivalent.


I am the finite square; I wish to be one with the infinite circle. This is the Unsectarian conception.

I am the Cross of Extension; I wish to be one with the infinite Rose. This is the qabalistic equivalent.

From; "777 and other Qabalistic writings of Aleister Crowley".

Irrespective of what anyone thinks of the infamous Crowley, (I personally think he was a bit of sociopath himself, but certainly a towering genius who made some worthy contributions to human knowledge...so credit where some is due) all of this seems to dovetail nicely into certain aspects of secular psychology.



Consider Maslow's hierarchy of needs and you might see what I mean. All of Crowley's statements here can be filtered metaphorically and he made that clear himself many times. Simply put, you don't need to believe in anything "spiritual" to find some potential wisdom here. Humankind lusts after perfection and though we never achieve it, many us try our best anyway. Unfortunately....serial killers view their crimes as a means to self-actualization IMO. Why they choose such a means is not entirely understood and perhaps it never will be. But we're getting better at understanding it and I would recommend Barbara Oakley's "Evil Genes" for some insight into the neurobiological and environmental factors which may fuel serial killers and other "evildoers".

There was one time in my life, that I was obsessed with Jack The Ripper, because he was a famous Cockney.

then count me a partial exception. i try to avoid thinking about such folk, and sociopaths especially make me keep my distance. Ted Kaczynski is the one morally ruined person who got to my heart.



partially applicable to my own experience. i was bullied as a young'un [after a period of being a bully myself that i outgrew and karmically paid-for later]. i've thought about shooting my tormenters, but short of that my revenge fantasies were mostly impersonal in the "dish best served cold" category of divine justice- i would imagine bullies getting run-over by city buses, or bullied themselves by higher-order bullies. for the older bullies, i would imagine their fat and psychopathic wives/GFs beating them within inches of their lives [imagery courtesy pink floyd].

aside from this all, i've found that mass murderers such as Ted Kaczynski made me weep bitter tears in sympathy for the accumulated psychic blows, the miserable limitations of their own conscience/emotional consciousness and angst which caused him and his ilk to wreck their lives and the lives of their victims. Mr. Kaczynski especially made me cry for him, as he was and remains so lost in his own convoluted mental habitrail. the poverty of his existence, in his cruelly cramped hermit hovel in the woods reminds me of myself and my equally disturbed older brother, a pair of hermits who live separately in the woods. the spareness of his solitary confinement at the supermax prison constitutes an echo chamber of his own warped being, a punishment worse than if he'd blown himself up with one of his own bombs.