I really need some help

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I really need some help guys and girls, so if any of you have experienced this and have found a solution then it would be a great help.

Firstly this isn't about me but about my AS brother, he has been depressed for a long time, he doesn't know for how long but i think it might have been for years as opposed to months and week.

Okay Im not entirely sure how to word this so it might be very difficult to understand and i may accidentally miss out a few things connected to it so the structure could be quite bad.

Anyway my brother (who may also be on this website) feels he has a problem which is causing him to become depressed and feel down.

Over time (since he can really remember) he has been trying to figure out what the problem is and how to solve it. To compund this, he is also VERY impatient so it greatly frustrates him that he is unable to identify the problem or know how to solve, and makes him angry upset, depressed and in some cases suicidal (he says he has seriously contemplated this and has already planned it out).

Since he can really remember he feels hes been fixating on this problem and been deeply analysing potential causes and solutions. Even if he does feel he's found a cause/solution he is unable to "keep it" as he constantly questions whether its just merely a guess, whether it in fact is correct and often concludes it isn't the answer.

Considering that my opinion of it is that the actual problem is the thought that there is a problem in the first place he's told me that he doesn't want the thought consciously, but also feels that as it has been going on for such a long time, subconsciously and instictively he doesnt know if he wants to or can remove it.

Also one last thing he feels that the problem "changes" over time and with his emotions(! !!) (he can still have a happy thought but cant "keep" it for more than a few hours), and as a result feels that when he explains it to my parents, and his psychologist he isn't telling the whole truth and only telling them how he is feeling in that moment and time.


I hope that all makes sense, and if you have any sort of experience of this then it could really help.

I have also been looking at anti-deppresants like protazin (spelling?) and through my very brief research and limited bio-chemistry expertise im not if it will particularly help. Also i dont know if it will be wise for him to go on drugs as he is taking his second year A level exams in about a months time and considering he needs to get top grades (which he is more than capable of doing) putting him on drugs during his revision time may not be wise.

Gassy

wow, remove the suicidal part and your brother sounds really similar to me. the other difference is i dont feel im depressed, i just feel that i am, usually an emptiness is how i would describe it. ive even written on a piece that goes along the lines that "hapiness is temporary" . i would say tell him alot of my skewed twisted view of the world, but you said hes had suicidal thoughts. that akes it a difficult situation.. because if he hears what ive come to learn and the ways i cope he'll most likely kil somebody or commit suicide(sorry if im being too morbid here). you know his situation best so i highly advise that you take care in the advice you get here. listen to it certainly, but if you honestly feel it a bad idea dont listen too it. however i do have an idea.. he obviously has trusted you enough to tell you about his problem, that or you forced it. ask him to promise you that if he has suicidal thoughts or plans anything out of that nature, that he will come to you. if hes anything like me he'll be obligated to that promise and i feel it could save him in the situation that it happens.
i have other advice, but i would like to know more about him, if you dont mind.

Before I will try to help, please let me try to understand as much as possible.
What I have understood so far is:

1. Your brother tries to figure out 'what the problem is'
2. Obviously that problem eludes him and you, but there should be 'symptoms' of that problem though you did not name them.
3. The struggle of figuring out 'what the problem is' is a problem itself.

Is that about what you meant? If yes could you perhaps explain the 'symptoms' mentioned under 2.

When a person gets to the point of actually planning out how to commit suicide, it's time for serious, immediate action. Would he be willing to see a professional of some sort? Some kind of anti-depressant medication could be helpful. I think the professional he sees needs to be someone with a good understanding of AS, though.

i dont mean to make gassy confused with muddled opinions, but theres a reason i asked to know more about him. if im rite, all you need is the promise that i talked about. and if hes like me he also wont like the idea of being probed about his thoughts by some stranger. be there for him, he needs a person who he feels like he can always go to. offer advice when possible.

once again, he may not be like me and the profesional may be an option. strangly i find the idea that hes planned it out and not executed(unintentional bad tasted pun) means its not as dangerous as other suicidal cases. he is thinking. either he figures it wont work, or he doesnt find it worth doing.

once again, im not trying to argue, afterall, this is a very serious topic.so please keep it so.

I call that the "'Something Is Missing' Syndrome", and I find it characteristic of people in need of a problem to solve.

A long-ago acquaintance once called it the "Silver Bullet Syndrome" and reminded me I am not the Lone Ranger.

Placing one's focus on solving other problems solves that one.

crap, how did i not see that. ok so im now guessing your brother is what i could have become... i spent my life from age 10 on looking for others problems to solve... its only when i cant find it that i begin to focus on myself... and IT ISNT FUN. thank you poster above me. still, make him promise.

dont worry about it (im very confused already but thats another story for another day).

Ok to start off he is seeing a psychologist at the moment. She seems pretty good and he likes her (ive also met her and had a couple of sessions with her), she also helped in his diagnosis of AS i believe, but either way he has known her for a long time. Whether he started speaking to her before or after the "problem" arose im not sure as he cant really remember when the problem started, but from that i guess the problem started before his diagnosis (whether he knew about it, or it was just as severe or not).

One potential factor though is that she is only able to help him through the NHS till he is 18 (he is 18 in june) and then he will be talking to social workers and how to live as an adult and so on. However we (my parents) are prepared to pay for her help privately after that if necessary (which i believe will (have to) happen).
So maybe that is part of the problem, if there is a "problem" in the first place.

When it comes to the suicide i dont think he wants to do it and he hopes he doesn't, but it certainly seems to be a possible and viable solution in his head. However as a result we need (at least my parents feel the need) to keep a 24hr eye on him and know where he is. For instance they dont want him walking home from college on his own (it is about a 40-45minute walk) and it is semi-en-route to a big multistorey car park which he has been to a couple of times. Also there have been a couple of other people (none that we know) in fairly recent times who have jumped off it.

In response to soaring yes my brother is trying to figure out what this problem is. He either doesn't know consciously, or isn't telling us what the problem is, or could be. It might be a combination of problems (either conscious or sub-conscious) which might be influenced by the uncertainty of the future, his social skills etc, but this could also be the symptom of the original "problem" which i personally believe might be the case which is causing the depression if that makes any sense.

It seems to me he is almost in a circle.

Im feeling down (or more accurately i think im feeling down and depressed)
What is causing me to feel down and is their a solution?
I have a solution (either to the problem or finding out what the problem actually is) albeit temporary.
Is the solution working is it correct?
Come to conclusion that it isn't either through something happening or just losing the emotion and becoming depressed.

One more thing he states (fairly enough) that he doesn't want to look (or more accurately "guess") what the solution (or the actual problem is) because he doesn't want to feel down and depressed. But is becoming impatient (as he often states he is) (this is where me and him differ completely) and only wants to find the problem/solution.

However he also feels that because this thought has become so instinctive sub-consciously, he doesn't know how (or if he can) get out of it and therefore doesn't feel he can permanently fixate on another problem.
This is something thats occured to me that maybe in his subconscious somewhere he feels that this is the only permanent problem he "can" solve (but how can you completely solve a permanent problem?). For the reasons stated above he doesn't want to "guess" at the problem and is only looking for the solution (not saying there isn't more than one tho) which might be starting to create an unexpected separate problem.

Hope that makes some sort of sense

gassy

well, like i said, if he does trust you, ask him to make that promise, unless you done so. this will make sure he talks to you before he takes any action if he feels any obligation to his promise. although from what it sounds like his fixation on his solution is keeping him from suicide and thats another reason to make him promise. the moment he feels cured, his list of objectives is empty, and he may feel he has lost his purpose. i personally have feared that i will lose mine, and have purposely not finished things. like i said im pretty confident me and him have a few things in common.

Yeh it seems very similar though i think the problem is allowing him to focus on solving the other problems as this has just become to instinctive (and maybe subconsciously a want/need to solve the problem). out of interest how did you manage to change what you tried to solve? (i think that is the solution but just not sure how, or what problem to fixate himself on would be suitable)

im not sure if you were adressing me with that, but i can input. at age 10 i met another messsed up kid and we spent our time pissed off at the world for our misery, we learned alot about teh human mind, studied it, and used it against thsoe around us. we eventually turned on each after 6 months. afterward i felt what i would call robot guilt. its not normal guilt but more or less my code that justified things being out of order, and therefore i feel i must make things balanced and make amends. although i know this is clearly not something useful to ur case specifically.

sorry if it sounded like i was ignoring you before, just trying to answer one topic at a time

i think you could very well be right but im not entirely sure if he will feel he's lost his purpose at least on the conscious level. he has other interests including philosophy (which i personally am not sure if it completely helps - it might do in some ways but i could be wrong) as well as physics but this is his "aspie obsession" as it is often called.

either way though i think you're pretty much dead on either on the conscious or subconscious level (so the last paragraph probably made little sense).
however i am disinclined in telling him about this thread at this particular time as even though he did say he's been on a couple of times, im worried that when reading what i wrote

a might be wrong in some way
or more importantly b) might make him more depressed. he seems very disinclined to write a journal or anything, as it might/probably put him in a worse situation.

EDITED TWICE as a little mistake in the second paragraph at the end
sorry i forgot to say he did promise us that he wouldn't do it but (maybe its just me) but i dont completely trust it (probably down to me not trusting my own promises as i instinctively feel the world is nothing more than a "dream" and therefore unless im consciously reminding myself i dont care what i do even if i promise). i mean if he ends up deciding that there is no solution and ends up getting angry at it/himself theres no telling what he could potentially do.

AND ANOTHER IMPORTANT THING I COMPLETELY MISSED

He is not sleeping well at all due to constantly thinking about this problem. It seems like everything and all these solutions are whizzing around his head, possibly even in his unconscious mind. I think the tiredness is pivotal in this!!
We've put him on prescribed sleeping pills (and homeopathic stuff - whatever you might think of it) and isn't particularly helping.

Last edited by gassy on 05 Apr 2010, 8:01 am, edited 2 times in total.

Bear in mind that what I'm saying is a guess. I think your brother is supressing his feelings and thus the cause of his distress. He's then getting frustrated because he can't find the solution (that he's either consiously or unconsiounsly). Perhaps there's also an element of fear, it makes him feel so bad and perhaps in some way thinks that it will hurt really bad to look at it.

I'm speaking from my own experience, I was afraid to look at my feelings because, when they were supressed, they felt so bad and I felt that looking at the feeling/problem/source would hurt more than dealing with it. The way I got past the fear, I think was, to use calming excersises, and when very very calm, asking myself what harm is there in looking. I also had a person ask me to promise them to tell them when I was really low and/or suicidal.

This may not be his issue at all but it's worth thinking about.

The promise thing mostly works, it lets the person know that you care and means that you'll have an idea of where he's at mentally.

yea.. the purpose idea would explain the cycle you were refering too. just do the promise, and keep an eye on him. get him invovled in other things, voluteer work maybe. you could even tell him that youll willing to help him figure out the problem and when your done your going to do somethiing else together. give him a future beyond his issues.

OP, you describe your brother as suicidal enough to make plans, and impulsive. That is NOT a good combination. Get him help, now. He is most likely not thinking straight enough to get it for himself; when you are that depressed you often don't have the logic left to do it. If you can get him to tell his psychologist, good; if not, you can write a letter for him to give to her; failing that, yes, psychological emergencies are legitimate emergencies and you can call an ambulance just like you would if he were having a heart attack. Once the immediate danger is past, he can start working on solving the problem--even though the problem may be the persistent feeling that there is a problem!

I'm afraid I do not feel competent enough to help you. To be honest I think that I don't really understand (due to my limited mind rather than your posts) most of it. The one thing I do understand is what others have pointed out before me: if he is suicidal he needs PROFESSIONAL help now.
The other thing is that I think you could be right about your brother 'moving in a circle'. As far as my limited knowledge of depressions go is that this is more or less the essence of any depression and what makes it so hard to get out of it.

I'm sorry I can't really help you, but to be honest, in this case I could not make any responsible suggestions other than to get professional help.