Page 1 of 2 [ 20 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

zombiegirl2010
Toucan
Toucan

User avatar

Joined: 20 Apr 2012
Age: 45
Gender: Female
Posts: 273
Location: edge of sanity and bliss

22 May 2012, 9:20 am

My gf's sister was out of town with a couple of relatives. Well, one of the relatives has had throat cancer for some time, and I suppose he was in some of the last stages of it. Well, they were at a hotel...he in one room and she in another. He had had a hard/rough day physically and she advised him to go on to bed. When she woke the next morning she couldn't get him to open his door...she used her key (he gave her a copy before bed in case of emergency) and she walked in to find him deceased.

Here is what I don't understand: she is blaming herself and apparently having an extremely hard time with dealing with it. How is this rational? He was already dying. He had had a bad day, and apparently realized that it was possible that he may not fair well (he gave her a key to the room). I don't understand her rationale/logic...or lack thereof. She is acting as though she was negligent.

My brain doesn't compute. :?


_________________
Your Aspie score: 193 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 7 of 200
You are very likely an Aspie


EstherJ
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Apr 2012
Age: 33
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,041
Location: The long-lost library at Alexandria

22 May 2012, 9:25 am

I think she felt bad because she didn't do more...or see it coming, or anticipate him dying.

Apparently, not anticipating stuff like that is a major no-no. I don't understand it, but people feel bad if you surprise them.



Ann2011
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Jul 2011
Age: 54
Gender: Female
Posts: 3,843
Location: Ontario, Canada

22 May 2012, 9:25 am

People sometimes want to think that their actions could have changed things. I think this is a normal stage of grief. A sort of denial. There wasn't anything she should have done differently. Hopefully she will realize this.



ictus75
Velociraptor
Velociraptor

User avatar

Joined: 7 Sep 2011
Age: 69
Gender: Male
Posts: 432
Location: Just North of South

22 May 2012, 9:28 am

It's rather strange how people think sometimes. She may be thinking, "If I had only checked on him maybe he would still be alive," which is a rather absurd thought, given he had advanced cancer. There's absolutely nothing she could have done and she needs to realize that it was just his time to go.


_________________
?No great art has ever been made without the artist having known danger? ~ Rainer Maria Rilke


zombiegirl2010
Toucan
Toucan

User avatar

Joined: 20 Apr 2012
Age: 45
Gender: Female
Posts: 273
Location: edge of sanity and bliss

22 May 2012, 9:30 am

EstherJ wrote:
I think she felt bad because she didn't do more...or see it coming, or anticipate him dying.

Apparently, not anticipating stuff like that is a major no-no. I don't understand it, but people feel bad if you surprise them.


Hmmm, she's not a doctor so how could she have known to do more? I mean, I do know her and she is a very self-centered person...so, there is a possibility that she ignored some tell-tell signs that she should have called emergency services, but I suppose that is neither here nor there because what was a late stage cancer patient doing traveling to begin with!? Perhaps that was selfish on his part?

Your last phrase made me chuckle..."but people feel bad if you surprise them"...ya know, like death playing peek-a-boo. :lol:


_________________
Your Aspie score: 193 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 7 of 200
You are very likely an Aspie


zombiegirl2010
Toucan
Toucan

User avatar

Joined: 20 Apr 2012
Age: 45
Gender: Female
Posts: 273
Location: edge of sanity and bliss

22 May 2012, 9:34 am

ictus75 wrote:
It's rather strange how people think sometimes. She may be thinking, "If I had only checked on him maybe he would still be alive," which is a rather absurd thought, given he had advanced cancer. There's absolutely nothing she could have done and she needs to realize that it was just his time to go.


Yes, it is absurd.


_________________
Your Aspie score: 193 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 7 of 200
You are very likely an Aspie


EstherJ
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Apr 2012
Age: 33
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,041
Location: The long-lost library at Alexandria

22 May 2012, 9:46 am

zombiegirl2010 wrote:
EstherJ wrote:
I think she felt bad because she didn't do more...or see it coming, or anticipate him dying.

Apparently, not anticipating stuff like that is a major no-no. I don't understand it, but people feel bad if you surprise them.


Hmmm, she's not a doctor so how could she have known to do more? I mean, I do know her and she is a very self-centered person...so, there is a possibility that she ignored some tell-tell signs that she should have called emergency services, but I suppose that is neither here nor there because what was a late stage cancer patient doing traveling to begin with!? Perhaps that was selfish on his part?

Your last phrase made me chuckle..."but people feel bad if you surprise them"...ya know, like death playing peek-a-boo. :lol:


Let me clarify - do more, as in check, or say goodnight better, or show more concern, not leave him alone...

And yes, actually, that's kind of what I had in mind about death and peek-a-boo... :P



zombiegirl2010
Toucan
Toucan

User avatar

Joined: 20 Apr 2012
Age: 45
Gender: Female
Posts: 273
Location: edge of sanity and bliss

22 May 2012, 9:50 am

EstherJ wrote:
zombiegirl2010 wrote:
EstherJ wrote:
I think she felt bad because she didn't do more...or see it coming, or anticipate him dying.

Apparently, not anticipating stuff like that is a major no-no. I don't understand it, but people feel bad if you surprise them.


Hmmm, she's not a doctor so how could she have known to do more? I mean, I do know her and she is a very self-centered person...so, there is a possibility that she ignored some tell-tell signs that she should have called emergency services, but I suppose that is neither here nor there because what was a late stage cancer patient doing traveling to begin with!? Perhaps that was selfish on his part?

Your last phrase made me chuckle..."but people feel bad if you surprise them"...ya know, like death playing peek-a-boo. <span class='tooltiptrolol'><img src='https://s3.amazonaws.com/TrollEmoticons/lol.png' /><span>lol</span></span>


Let me clarify - do more, as in check, or say goodnight better, or show more concern, not leave him alone...

And yes, actually, that's kind of what I had in mind about death and peek-a-boo... :P


Oh, I suppose that could be what she is "what if-ing" about..."what if she had checked in..." blah blah blah.

Yes, I get the mental picture of a grim reaper poking out from behind a door! :lol:


_________________
Your Aspie score: 193 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 7 of 200
You are very likely an Aspie


zombiegirl2010
Toucan
Toucan

User avatar

Joined: 20 Apr 2012
Age: 45
Gender: Female
Posts: 273
Location: edge of sanity and bliss

22 May 2012, 9:51 am

Ann2011 wrote:
People sometimes want to think that their actions could have changed things. I think this is a normal stage of grief. A sort of denial. There wasn't anything she should have done differently. Hopefully she will realize this.


Denial? But I think her entire problem is that she is accepting the fact that he is dead. ??


_________________
Your Aspie score: 193 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 7 of 200
You are very likely an Aspie


SilkySifaka
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 Apr 2012
Age: 39
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,396
Location: UK

22 May 2012, 9:52 am

Maybe it was the dying alone aspect? When my friend died of cancer I didn't feel as if I should have done more (there was nothing that could be done, by anyone) but I did feel guilty that I wasn't there when I had said I would be (he died while I was travelling to the hospital) A year later, I don't feel guilty any more. People sometimes have odd reactions to grief, it isn't rational and there isn't a right or wrong way to feel.



Chris71
Sea Gull
Sea Gull

User avatar

Joined: 24 May 2011
Age: 53
Gender: Male
Posts: 208
Location: Netherlands

22 May 2012, 9:57 am

She's blaming herself because she wonders "what if?" .... what if she stayed and monitored him at night? There might have been a chance I could at least try to save him, or call for help earlier.

Best to tell her that there's almost certainly nothing she could have done. Ask her why she feels guilty about it, giving her the opportunity to explain how she feels might make her feel better.

I'd probably feel the same (feeling of guilt) if a relative of mine died like that. I would need people to tell me there's nothing I could have done, I would need to hear from other people that it wasn't my fault, even though the purely scientific explanation says the person was going to die anyway. When there's a loss of a relative, people want to feel that other people are around and care about their feelings.

hmmm, it is difficult to explain. I'm sure the others can explain it better.



zombiegirl2010
Toucan
Toucan

User avatar

Joined: 20 Apr 2012
Age: 45
Gender: Female
Posts: 273
Location: edge of sanity and bliss

22 May 2012, 10:03 am

Chris71 wrote:
She's blaming herself because she wonders "what if?" .... what if she stayed and monitored him at night? There might have been a chance I could at least try to save him, or call for help earlier.

Best to tell her that there's almost certainly nothing she could have done. Ask her why she feels guilty about it, giving her the opportunity to explain how she feels might make her feel better.

I'd probably feel the same (feeling of guilt) if a relative of mine died like that. I would need people to tell me there's nothing I could have done, I would need to hear from other people that it wasn't my fault, even though the purely scientific explanation says the person was going to die anyway. When there's a loss of a relative, people want to feel that other people are around and care about their feelings.

hmmm, it is difficult to explain. I'm sure the others can explain it better.


I see, but I have never liked her and I am pretty sure the feeling is mutual...so the likelihood that we chat about this is zero.


_________________
Your Aspie score: 193 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 7 of 200
You are very likely an Aspie


Tuttle
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Mar 2006
Gender: Female
Posts: 3,088
Location: Massachusetts

22 May 2012, 10:05 am

Is there a possibility of guilt from him having to die alone?



zombiegirl2010
Toucan
Toucan

User avatar

Joined: 20 Apr 2012
Age: 45
Gender: Female
Posts: 273
Location: edge of sanity and bliss

22 May 2012, 10:10 am

Tuttle wrote:
Is there a possibility of guilt from him having to die alone?


yeah, that is what Chris71 was saying. But...don't we all "die alone"!?!? I mean, you can't enter nothingness with anyone...that would not be nothingness.


_________________
Your Aspie score: 193 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 7 of 200
You are very likely an Aspie


CanisMajor
Toucan
Toucan

User avatar

Joined: 26 Feb 2012
Age: 35
Gender: Female
Posts: 271
Location: Miami Beach

22 May 2012, 10:11 am

zombiegirl2010 wrote:
Ann2011 wrote:
People sometimes want to think that their actions could have changed things. I think this is a normal stage of grief. A sort of denial. There wasn't anything she should have done differently. Hopefully she will realize this.


Denial? But I think her entire problem is that she is accepting the fact that he is dead. ??


It's more a denial of the circumstances than the fact that he is dead, I think. She's in denial that she was helpless to change things. As has been said, there really wasn't anything she could have done. But she can't accept that yet and feels some sort of undue burden, denying that she really had no way to save him.



zombiegirl2010
Toucan
Toucan

User avatar

Joined: 20 Apr 2012
Age: 45
Gender: Female
Posts: 273
Location: edge of sanity and bliss

22 May 2012, 10:14 am

CanisMajor wrote:
zombiegirl2010 wrote:
Ann2011 wrote:
People sometimes want to think that their actions could have changed things. I think this is a normal stage of grief. A sort of denial. There wasn't anything she should have done differently. Hopefully she will realize this.


Denial? But I think her entire problem is that she is accepting the fact that he is dead. ??


It's more a denial of the circumstances than the fact that he is dead, I think. She's in denial that she was helpless to change things. As has been said, there really wasn't anything she could have done. But she can't accept that yet and feels some sort of undue burden, denying that she really had no way to save him.


Oh. Hmmm. I still am of the opinion that that line of thinking is ridiculous given the facts.


_________________
Your Aspie score: 193 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 7 of 200
You are very likely an Aspie