Aspies and feeling entitled.

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What's with that? Why do so many people with Asperger's feel entitled? Like the world owes them something, or that Neurotypical society should bend, twist and distort to accomodate them...

Not having a go, just geniunely curious as I'm dealing with this issue at home right now.

Those sort of aspies are the same as old people thinking the world owes them something, and deadbeats thinking the government owes them money, and are usually bitter and concieted. There have been many coming and going through WP, and they are all miserable.

I don't know what's "with" it, but it's using the diagnosis as an excuse because they're too weak minded to take responsibility for themselves.

Yeah, I have explained things I do because of aspergers, but i've never ever thought i'm OWED anything. I think i'm owed the same respect as normal people, if I give it, if that's asking for too much.

Probably a theory of mind thing. A lot of aspies dont understand how the world works. Having said this I have met few aspies who I would call entitled. Butit would be nice if people were a bit nicer to us. If they put wheelchair ramps up for people in wheelchairs and allow blind people to take service dogs with them, whats wrong with wanting some accomodations for us, when the world is built with NTs in mind?

I'd have to see exactly what you're talking about to give a judgement -- I can see a sense of entitlement going either way. Some NT's seem to feel entitled to eye contact. One person might judge an ASC person refusing to do that as unreasonably expecting the world to bend to their whims. Another might see it as a reasonable sacrifice that costs the NT person little, and benefits the ASC person fairly.

Some seem to be of the Marc Segar "adapt at all costs (and then commit suicide)" mindset, and others "make no adjustments; let the world do all the adjusting." Though (without seeing a specific example) I personally see little of the latter.

I think seeing what is balanced is really tough, since people have huge motivations to mis-estimate others' difficulties or inconveniences (for NT's and AC's).

Ok I guess need to explain a bit about the specific situation. I was hoping not to as my younger sister would despise the thought of me discussing her online! But I need some info!

My sister is 13 year old Aspie, she's always been not into the idea of being on the spectrum and hid it from most of her peers (her own choice) and she didn't have too many problems so it was ok. But this year a whole new stem off issues cropped up and we needed to get her some support, I got her into a support group type thing with other Aspies (from 13 - 18 ) and ever since then she has developed an unusual attitude about having AS. In the past she was happy to work past her issues and she was usually successful with enough effort and time. Ever since joining this group she seems to not be interested in trying anymore and just wants everything to bend to her will. I've seen this group in action and there is alot of talk about how horrible society is and how it should be changed to suit Aspies and their desires (including a passionate discussion about how Aspies should have their own society and place built for them and funded by NTs...????).

I'd be at least semi-ok with this attitutde if there weren't already major accomodations being made on her behalf both at home and at school. Her school has been fantastic and has a few kids with AS so they have at least a bit of knowledge and experience. But all of a sudden, it's not enough! For example, if she is feeling overly anxious or frustrated there is a quiet room in which she can take time-out in, at the start of the year when that was sorted out, it was fine! Now she's trying to demand that she should be allowed to go to the Computer Labs instead, now there are quite a few reasons why this is innapropriate (other classes, supervision, de-stress time is not surf the web time), but she doesn't care! And there are other similar examples that I wont go into.

I just wonder how a kid who was always so into overcoming obstacles has done a 180 into demanding this and that and being completely unreasonable! I was considering that it might be a 'teenage' thing kicking in, but the other kids aren't like that, and it just seems to coincide with joining the group, and all those kids are on their Aspie high horse (that's not an insult, the group is a place for them to feel good about being Aspie and have that feeling supported and reinforced, I do think they take it overbaord though).

I understand the theory of mind issue, but that's what's so confusing, she used to think differently, and now the attitude has completely changed!

She mainly sounds like a 13 year old who just found a group of friends she fits in with and she's going through the teenage process of forging an identity. The attitudes of 13 year olds always drive adults crazy. It's just a phase. Acting as though the mindset of a 13 year old is a predictor of the mindset of the impending adult is just an exercise in futility. She is with friends. That's a good thing.

Just my $0.02, but maybe it's just the first iteration in a process of successive approximation in figuring out how to balance pushing to overcome vs. going for accommodations.

It's a little hard to relate, being part of the "pre-diagnosis" generation, though it is heartening to hear that they aren't isolated and have some pride, even if a little excessive (no one should be suicidal at 13).

I pushed very hard when I was young, and then burned out very hard (resulting in physical health problems and unexplained cognitive losses -- wasn't just tired or depressed). After getting approved for SSDI/SSI it was hard not be too inert at first. It's been like feeling around in the dark trying to strike the best balance. Probably a lot better to learn young how to respect one's own state (not toughing it out to the point of damage) against taking it too easy.

Reading this umm....

Girl has AS/democratic ideals/socialist ideals/communist ideals/deafness/<insert own whatever here> gets into club with others who have AS/democratic ideals/socialist ideals/communist ideals/deafness/<insert own whatever here>.

most of the group/since founding of the group the main ideology are more the "its all horrible and unfair and we know better!" more than the "what can we do?".

sad, incredibly normal, totally reasonable and TBH something that's usually grown out of.

This argument can be turned around. Why do NT's feel like they are entitled to eye contact, constant mindless chit chat or hogging broadcast tv with endless stupid sitcoms? I don't mind NT doing these things among themselves, but I don't think they are entitles to impose them upon autistic people.

With that said, it is human nature for members of a specific group to develop an elitist and/or us-verses-them attitude. You will find this in police departments, political groups, college campuses, labor unions, government agencies, etc. It all goes back to pride.

Everybody is entitled to certain things: this is also known as natural justice.

It is a noble philosophy and not a product of autism to think that way.

Cast your eyes upon the rich and powerful; how many inherited wealth from their parents, or benefited from a privileged upbringing?

Yes, every human being is entitled to live a dignified life, with full and perfect liberty.

This is the most beautiful of all humanist hymns.

I think that whenever we want help or something additional, it would be helpful if we remember that nobody is perfect and there are times where we need to give or bend, too. Good old fashioned reciprocity.

NTs get scared, get hurt feelings, or worry about things, just like anyone else. So I think it's best to just remember that while I (for instance) may be the one having problems now, that we ALL have our times.

(And this is why I like the Golden Rule, because it is a POSITIVE formulation, not just saying don't do what you don't like others to do to you...it "forces" you to be more proactive towards others in the same way you would like them to be proactive towards helping you.)

I don't think you guys are getting it here. I'm not against people with disabilities being accomodated for. I'm all for it. And that's the issue here. There are so many extended accomodations in place for her. Things that the other kids would never be allowed (though they'd probably very much like and benefit from). But because of this new found sense of entitlement there should be MORE! It's almost like she's expecting to be put on a pedestal.

It is not a human/society thing in this case because I have seen where this attitude has come from andhow it has developed.

Yes we give ramps to people in wheelchairs, but there's no person employed at the bottom of every wheelchair ramp to push them to the top, they do it themselves (when posibble!). My sister and these other kids not only want the ramps, they want to be pushed up them! And you guys think this is fine? The school and me and the parents and teachers of the other kids should just respond to every whim and desire? Because they're aspie? I just don't know about that.

Oh and btw, NTs don't feel entitled to eye contact, or mindless chit chat, it's just what we expect because the majority of people we have met perform these social tasts with ease. Expecting NTs to just SNAP INTO an "ok this is an Aspie I need to act like this and that and this..." is really another great example of Aspie entitlement. <sarcasm> OF COURSE, we NTs should have a complete understanding and perfect response to Aspies when we meet you, and we should know exactly what to expect and say....</sarcasm> I mean...COME ON!! ! We do our best, but you want more more more!