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wavefreak58
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17 Dec 2010, 11:52 am

So, to go along with my obsessive need for accuracy, there are two things in the DSM that would have me DXd HFA not Apsergers. First is this:

(in Asperger's list)
F. Criteria are not met for another specific Pervasive Developmental Disorder or Schizophrenia.

So if I were following a flow chart, this would be the first thing to ask relative to an Asperger's DX.

So moving over to the actual Autism criteria, I meet the criteria without question in all categories except perhaps language development. (everything bold applies)

Quote:
A. A total of six (or more) items from (1), (2), and (3), with at least two from (1), and one each from (2) and (3):

(1) qualitative impairment in social interaction, as manifested by at least two of the following:

(a) marked impairment in the use of multiple nonverbal behaviors, such as eye-to-eye gaze, facial expression, body postures, and gestures to regulate social interaction

(b) failure to develop peer relationships appropriate to developmental level

(c) a lack of spontaneous seeking to share enjoyment, interests, or achievements with other people (e.g., by a lack of showing, bringing, or pointing out objects of interest)

(d) lack of social or emotional reciprocity

(2) qualitative impairments in communication, as manifested by at least one of the following:

(a) delay in, or total lack of, the development of spoken language (not accompanied by an attempt to compensate through alternative modes of communication such as gesture or mime)

(b) in individuals with adequate speech, marked impairment in the ability to initiate or sustain a conversation with others

(c) stereotyped and repetitive use of language or idiosyncratic language

(d) lack of varied, spontaneous make-believe play or social imitative play appropriate to developmental level

(3) restricted, repetitive, and stereotyped patterns of behavior, interests, and activities as manifested by at least one of the following:

(a) encompassing preoccupation with one or more stereotyped and restricted patterns of interest that is abnormal either in intensity or focus

(b) apparently inflexible adherence to specific, nonfunctional routines or rituals

(c) stereotyped and repetitive motor mannerisms (e.g., hand or finger flapping or twisting or complex whole-body movements)

(d) persistent precoccupation with parts of objects

B. Delays or abnormal functioning in at least one of the following areas, with onset prior to age 3 years: (1) social interaction, (2) language as used in social communication, or (3) symbolic or imaginative play.

C. The disturbance is not better accounted for by Rett's disorder or childhood disintegrative disorder.


The only one impossible to answer with any certainty is B. since I have no records but my memory. That said, my memory is that I have ALWAYS been this way, that my earliest memories are similar in 'feel' to those later in life that meet all the other criteria.

Since I am currently being evaluated, should I go through this step by step? I thought of even doing a flow chart with explanations of each point of agreement.


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League_Girl
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17 Dec 2010, 12:48 pm

I probably met it in my early childhood but only because I had hearing loss so I was speech delayed but it was dropped.


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kfisherx
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17 Dec 2010, 12:55 pm

Okay so here is where you and I diverge. I too fit every criteria that you have bolded. The difference is that I do not give a crap about the label so I am not pushing it either way. I only accepted the label given to me by my Dr so that he and I had a baseline by which to start and work through the grief issues I was there to see him about. I also score on every ASPIE test significantly higher than the proported "average" asplie score.

Obvious social ret*d is obvious... LOL!



Jediscraps
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17 Dec 2010, 12:58 pm

In a couple years isn't it going to be changed to autistic spectrum disorder?
I think you'll then just have the problems you may currently have and deal with it from there.



wavefreak58
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17 Dec 2010, 1:03 pm

kfisherx wrote:
Okay so here is where you and I diverge. I too fit every criteria that you have bolded. The difference is that I do not give a crap about the label so I am not pushing it either way. I only accepted the label given to me by my Dr so that he and I had a baseline by which to start and work through the grief issues I was there to see him about. I also score on every ASPIE test significantly higher than the proported "average" asplie score.

Obvious social ret*d is obvious... LOL!


Heh heh.

It's not about the label. It's about how I think. I can't stand having ill-formed conclusions banging about in my head. It agitates me. I don't like being agitated.

There is a rather large component of selfishness in my being professionally evaluated. I am doing it for my own satisfaction. To hell with the mental health conglomerate. I am using them for my own personal reasons.


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TPE2
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17 Dec 2010, 1:06 pm

wavefreak58 wrote:
So, to go along with my obsessive need for accuracy, there are two things in the DSM that would have me DXd HFA not Apsergers. First is this:

(in Asperger's list)
F. Criteria are not met for another specific Pervasive Developmental Disorder or Schizophrenia.

So if I were following a flow chart, this would be the first thing to ask relative to an Asperger's DX.

So moving over to the actual Autism criteria, I meet the criteria without question in all categories except perhaps language development. (everything bold applies)

Quote:
A. A total of six (or more) items from (1), (2), and (3), with at least two from (1), and one each from (2) and (3):

(1) qualitative impairment in social interaction, as manifested by at least two of the following:

(a) marked impairment in the use of multiple nonverbal behaviors, such as eye-to-eye gaze, facial expression, body postures, and gestures to regulate social interaction

(b) failure to develop peer relationships appropriate to developmental level

(c) a lack of spontaneous seeking to share enjoyment, interests, or achievements with other people (e.g., by a lack of showing, bringing, or pointing out objects of interest)

(d) lack of social or emotional reciprocity

(2) qualitative impairments in communication, as manifested by at least one of the following:

(a) delay in, or total lack of, the development of spoken language (not accompanied by an attempt to compensate through alternative modes of communication such as gesture or mime)

(b) in individuals with adequate speech, marked impairment in the ability to initiate or sustain a conversation with others

(c) stereotyped and repetitive use of language or idiosyncratic language

(d) lack of varied, spontaneous make-believe play or social imitative play appropriate to developmental level

(3) restricted, repetitive, and stereotyped patterns of behavior, interests, and activities as manifested by at least one of the following:

(a) encompassing preoccupation with one or more stereotyped and restricted patterns of interest that is abnormal either in intensity or focus

(b) apparently inflexible adherence to specific, nonfunctional routines or rituals

(c) stereotyped and repetitive motor mannerisms (e.g., hand or finger flapping or twisting or complex whole-body movements)

(d) persistent precoccupation with parts of objects

B. Delays or abnormal functioning in at least one of the following areas, with onset prior to age 3 years: (1) social interaction, (2) language as used in social communication, or (3) symbolic or imaginative play.

C. The disturbance is not better accounted for by Rett's disorder or childhood disintegrative disorder.


The only one impossible to answer with any certainty is B. since I have no records but my memory. That said, my memory is that I have ALWAYS been this way, that my earliest memories are similar in 'feel' to those later in life that meet all the other criteria.

Since I am currently being evaluated, should I go through this step by step? I thought of even doing a flow chart with explanations of each point of agreement.


Yes, you are HFA, not Aspie. And is exactly because the two same reasons that several studies had came to the conclusion that nobody or almost nobody has AS and most diagnosed Aspie are simply HFAs who are misdiagnosed.



azurecrayon
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17 Dec 2010, 8:00 pm

personally i think a LOT of aspies are actually classic autism, especially those being diagnosed as adults. if the accuracy bugs you, i'd say pursue it. go over the diagnostic criteria with whoever is diagnosing you. be prepared with examples, or if your friends and family can write up statements with examples take those with you.

i know it bugs me to have my son diagnosed AS when he fits almost every single classic autism criteria. thats my own neurological issue tho =P but we did get him in to see a neuropsych last month for a more accurate diagnosis.

overall, it shouldnt matter too much, but accuracy is a good thing if you can get it.


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wavefreak58
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17 Dec 2010, 9:54 pm

azurecrayon wrote:
if the accuracy bugs you


LOL. It probably shouldn't. But it bugs me. There is a bit of trepidation that once the DSM V comes out I will have to be re-evaluated since Asperger's will disappear.


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pensieve
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17 Dec 2010, 10:55 pm

I tick all boxes for classic autism. There's a bit of uncertainty for a language delay but I didn't want to speak to anyone until I was 14. I was definitely more developmentally delayed than people with AS. I just prefer to say I'm autistic. I probably would pass the DSM V criteria. But if you are diagnosed already you don't have be again.


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