Theory of mind

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If Im good at this, can I then exclude to have AS ?

I believe that I am better than average in this. I remember that I knew what my mother would be thinking (and other adults and children) and took advantage of it as a child. That means I tricked people; I had a lot of secrets while making people believe something else was going on. This was very often the case, and not only sometimes.

Does anybody know what it means or can give me some input on this?

You actually knew what they were actually thinking, or you simply knew what they would do?

There is a big difference.

I knew what they would think if they got the "right" input. And I knew what they would do if they got the "right" input.

Same here, and that is simply because people do tend to be predictable and some of us do have acute observational skills ... and that can lead to some occasional passive-aggressive behaviour (even if unintentional) on our parts ... and all of that boils down to instinctual behaviour.

"passive-aggressive behaviour"... you got me there.

I think it happens because I notice that my conversation partners dont concern about me as much as I would concern about them, so that I sometimes feel its a monologue when somebody wants to share something with me, because its their wish to share it, and they sometimes even expect me to cheer etc., wich makes me feel completely run over, so sometimes I cant hide that Im annoyed and respond irritated.

In situations where I feel ignored and run over:
I can be polite: I let myself force to cheer when somebody attacs me with their information, with the result of an annoying feeling I suppress.

I can also attack them back by taking care of my inner values, that I have a right to be here as much as other people, and express it with irritation.

I can also respond in a rude but funny way, so that the person knows I dont care at all and at the same time has something to laugh about.

My mother used to say that you have to treat me with silk gloves.

I can predict better than most. It's an acquired skill.

What about the "non verbal" aspect ( reading body language) by tracking what someone is feeling? To be "them" (or better "experience them") and connect with the "moment " and "feel" it as they do during communication ?

I recall as a kid at around 7, I knew I was going to get into trouble with my mischief of touching and playing with "verboten things."

I broke the rule and span the hands around on an analogue clock, and the hands ( the hour & minute hand) fell in gravity to a 'down 6 O'clock position.'..... broke
I sat outside in a lawn chair in the front yard thinking or scheming of how I was going to circumvent a possible slap.
Aha, , I knew if someone came over it would break the spell , so I arranged my grandmother to visit us when my mother came home from work.
Now knowing my mothers behavior , as if something would distract her , would break the bad mood spell and she'd forget about it.... no later reprisals. I saw her do it before in an incidental occurence.

Now my wife pretty much says I'm clueless with her and can't read a "thing." I tell her to please tell me( verbally) because I don't know what she is feeling.

I've seen autistic people on this forum talking about how they have an easy time reading someone's true intentions vs. the front they put up.

I think the theory of mind thing is a simplistic observation of things that autistic children have been observed doing.

Sure, and that is (or is at least evidence of) where our theories-of-mind differ from those of other people.


Whether or not we actually know or understand things other people think, say or do, at least some of us are inclined toward preemptive actions in order to bring things about as we believe things should be. Sometimes we do that defensively for self-protection, and sometimes we do that manipulatively or offensively in order to get other people to do what we want or expect ... and we do those kinds of things (when we do) simply because our minds work differently (or on different "theories" related to success) than the minds of others.

+1 - I do think there is something behind this theory, but I don't think it is as simple as it is described. I'm not sure if the description is even accurate at all. I've noticed with other things to do with AS, the "experts" seem to observe what they can see on the outside, and take no notice of what we're experiencing on the inside.

I absorbed your words.

Got to think about this, because I definitely dont match with most people regarding e.g. enthusiasm, humor and subjects of interest. So its just different? But why cant they understand me, when I understand them?

And its not just something I say. I really understand what people value and why, and I just accept it.

I know some people who dont have the usual theory of mind, and I understand them too. I know when something is inconvenient for them or how they most likely will respond in different situations. Because its more like I would, and its interesting to see how somebody else handles exactly the problems I face myself. So, are NTs incapable of reading us, or are they just so used to meet like-minded people, that they dont see that we exist?

It is not just autistic people. I have had a psychiatrist tell me that what people experience is irrelevant, and suggest that symptoms from two different conditions that look the same on the outside are also the same on the inside. I can report I have difficulty initiating action, and while I can describe what this problem is (a glass wall between intent and execution) he would say that depression has exactly the same symptom. Even though I have never heard that glass wall description from people who are only depressed, but have heard it from people who have executive dysfunction from ADHD or ASD.

It seems like often there is more weight given to standard interpretations vs. more subjective perspectives from the patients and clients themselves.

Couple that with how the vast majority of autism research is almost entirely ideological, and yeah, no real room for autistic people to speak and be heard.

Last edited by Verdandi on 13 Jan 2011, 4:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Edit: I guess I could say that again.

Last edited by Verdandi on 13 Jan 2011, 4:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Ok.... It took some time before I understood this sentence (Im not native english speaking).

This information hits me hard, as it changes my theory; that people are more or less good at it and more or less conscious about doing it.
I mean understanding other people without exchanging words.

Sometimes though, some people understand that there is something else going on than whats on the surface, like parents understand their children and like girls suddenly know if something is going on with each other?

If its really not normal, I can have developed it because of something that made it necessary for me to understand others, but actually I almost think of it as if I have no choice but being fed with intimate details, as if people force their "personalities" upon me, no matter if they (or I) want it or not.

I dont know what to say.