Is it normal to be not normal.

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I have never really enjoyed interacting with other people, normally do it out of necessity.
For most of my life I've been suffering from seizures and I have spent most of my life trying to keep it hidden, not an easy task I can tell you.
But recently I went to see a neurologist for some treatment for it, when we had a little confrontation about something he had said during a previous consultation, scenario goes like this.

Digsy: "Before we start I'd like to address an issue that I'm not to happy with, during our last conversation you said that I couldn't be epileptic because I'd never been taken to hospital by ambulance, but that is because there have been events where people have phoned an ambulance, but I never stick around long enough to wait for it, I'm normally off out of there as fast as my body allows (which can be a challenge at times when it's feeling like lead and head is pouring blood)."

Neurologist: "That's not normal, which is why I'm referring you back to the psychiatrist"

Digsy: "why isn't it, if I'm going about my worldly obligations and somebody calls an ambulance because I've had a seizure, why should I be ripped from my worldly obligations to attend a trip I don't particularly want to make".

Neurologist now looking at digsy as if he's not all there: "but that's not normal, it's just not, most people seek help when something goes wrong with them, they don't run from it" he said getting a little irate.

Digsy: "but calling me an ambulance does not help me get to where I am going and do what I need to, and I've sought help that's why I'm here, but all I can see it that your notion of help is to run a few tests and tell me I'm not normal".

He then went on to tell me how he wants me to take an MRI so that he can show me the picture and tell me that there is nothing wrong with me (mainly because he believes the majority of the seizures are panic attacks, but is willing to accept that a few appear to be epileptic?).
As always I'll just take his word for it because he's the trained specialist and I'm not.
But I think £250 is a lot of money to pay for a little re-assurance, when the medication he's advised may do the job anyway.

But the question I want to ask you folks is, do you consider it normal to do things that other do not consider to be normal?
Where do you fit in?

Last edited by Digsy on 20 Feb 2011, 11:09 am, edited 4 times in total.

What is "normal"?

It is like when meteorologists start on about "normal temperatures for this time of year". "The normal temperature for this time of year is -5C, but we're above normal today at +5C". What does that mean? -5C was the historic average temperature, which was calculated based on measured temperature values for a particular date over many years. These values were not necessarily equal to the average of -5C. There are some values that were +5C, and others that were -10C. And all the numbers in between. And more extreme.

I believe this parallels human behaviour. There is a range of behaviour, with a larger number of people exhibiting certain types of behaviours than others (think bell curve). People then call this bump "normal".

Most seizures are usually diagnosed using an EEG, but you usually have to have one during the EEG.

Some seizures, but not all, are caused by lesions that will be visible on an MRI.

I don't think a determination of epilepsy or a seizure condition should be made based on whether or not someone has been taken to the hospital. Most types of seizures aren't very spectacular and only last a few seconds.

I can share both your sentiments.
During a time in my life where time = money, I didn't have time to be ripped from making money, I equated that the time it takes to suffer one and get over it collectively over time would still not amount to the time it takes in a hospital waiting to be seen.
To be perfectly honest I'm not really bothered if it is epilepsy or panic attacks, I'd just like them to stop, they happen too infrequently for an EEG to pick up so I've accepted a trial of medication to see if they prevent any further seizures, and I hope they do.

I don't really want to meet the neurologist again, so I don't think I'm going ahead with the MRI, plus he's already told me what he intends to do with it, his words were.

"It appears we don't have an MRI in your files, I'd like you to come back and take one so that I can show it to you and tell you that there is nothing wrong with you".
I got home and looked up the cost of an MRI, I'm not comfortable with wasting that much money on a little re-assurance.

I disagree that people seek help when something is wrong. People get worried because of stigma sometimes or they are embarrassed about their problem so don't want to talk to anyone about it.

Anyways, to answer your question, yes, I do feel it's normal to do things that others don't consider normal.

I've lost consciousness in public 3 times over the years (from a condition that I know I have), and luckily no one has ever called an ambulance.

If someone did, though, I would get out of there ASAP, because 1) I don't like being touched strangers (especially when ill), 2) don't want to pay $1000 for an EMT to take my blood pressure and tell me what I already know, 3) when ill/hurt all I want to do is go home and hide (like how animals hide when they get sick or injured).

I think there may be an autistic element to this, though -- that people do typically do reach out to others for help, or make it known that they are hurt. -- As opposed to quietly holing up somewhere like a cat.

My normal is different from my wife's normal, my daughters' respective normals, my brothers' and so on and on.

I have had your same kind of dilemma when a doctor seems to believe I do not do normal things, or that I do not do things normally, but he is wrong: The things I do are normal for me and they are the things I normally do.

Nevertheless, he still considers me a "nut job" simply because my particular normal is not what he normally sees. So, the real question here is one for the doctor and me to each answer with accuracy: Does my particular normal cause harm to me or to anyone else?

Even if not, however, he is still going to treat me the way he normally treats people he typically sees as being abnormal ... and that can truly be frustrating for those of us who are simply sane and logical thinkers.

It sounds to me like your neurologist was trying to get rid of you.
He obviously wasn't addressing your concerns
Here is where you have to figure out on your own (do some research) what makes sense.
Hopefully your psychiatrist is a little better.

I find it very odd that he would say "most people seek help when something goes wrong with them, they don't run from it"
That is most definitely not true for a lot of people.
I first instinct if I were hurt somehow would be to hide somewhere, as in avoid other people.
I do have the ability to seek medical help if I truly thought something was wrong.

The irony here is that you think something is wrong with you, manage to get an appointment with a neurologist and then
you are treated in a condescending and unhelpful manner. And the doctor wonders why you wouldn't try to get help.

I live in England so health service is free, which is why I can see his idea of normal, but it is not my idea of normal, just because a large chunk of society (and I'd dispute it as being the majority) decide to run off to the docs to get vaccinated up to the eyeballs every time they get the sniffles doesn't mean I do.
Being touched is one of my quirks too, and I get really really defensive when I regain conciousness, although I don't intentionally hurt people, I was a martial artist and did use my skills to basically keep hands off.
Apart from number 1 we share the same views.

Jackbus I couldn't agree more.

Last edited by Digsy on 20 Feb 2011, 2:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

i think it is. normalcy is like averageness.


nothing is average because the more samples you take, the more homogenetic the arbitrary point of averageness lies. no actual specimen equals exactly the criteria for infinitessimally displaced averageness.

if there are one hundred people in a room, and 50 of them were 1 foot high, and the other 50 were all 100 feet high, then you would have (50+5000)/100, then the average height of the people in the room is 50.5 ft. since there are 50x1 ft short people and 50x100 foot tall people, then every specimen in that group deviates from average to the maximum degree possible, and therefore the least likely height of any person in that group is the average height of people in that group.

so it is very uncommon to be precisely normal i think.