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pascalflower
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18 Apr 2011, 7:25 pm

There have been several analogies of how Autistics see themselves in the world.

To me, an analogy for how I previously saw Autistics is like a talking rock. I once had a friend, whom I strongly felt had Asperger's from the moment we met in high school. She once told me that many of her friends no longer talked to her, or keep in touch. I wanted to tell her that I felt it was probably because she had Asperger's,but I didn't. She more than likely never heard of it, and wouldn't believe me.

In talking to people with Autism, it doesn't feel natural. There is a lack of human(-ness) to conversations. It's like talking to a rock, that can say anything like a human, but isn't quite human. From this NT perspective, Autistics are too logical, and inflexible in their opinions. They seem like rocks, solid and un-moving; incapable of the cognitive flexibility that most humans have.

The world does not operate on logic. Normal people can be very illogical, and that is still normal.



Zen
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18 Apr 2011, 7:37 pm

A winter's day
In a deep and dark December;
I am alone,
Gazing from my window to the streets below
On a freshly fallen silent shroud of snow.
I am a rock,
I am an island.


But yeah, thanks for the support. :lol: We are acutely aware that we are not normal and mostly unable to be, and this is the source of much pain for many people on the spectrum.



bumble
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18 Apr 2011, 7:44 pm

The neurotypical world isn't some fantastic place full of 'normal' people who don't have their own set of problems either. Some neurotypicals can actually be less feeling than those with a form of autism.

I have come across a few inhumane neurotypicals in my time.



Apple_in_my_Eye
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18 Apr 2011, 7:52 pm

That seems like the common impression, even historically.

I think, that underneath all the academic abstractifying, that that impression is the origin of ideas such as "lack of empathy," "lack of imagination," "lack of emotion," and, of course, lack of theory of mind. I'm not even saying those are all or completely wrong, I just see an impression that informs a thought process in an unrealized, dangerous way. Too many assumptions, too many unwarranted projections.

Oh and like Zen said, it does suck to be thought of that way. I see more concern here about not bashing NT's than I do in the world for not bashing... Well, not bashing anybody who isn't normal enough.



eudaimonia
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18 Apr 2011, 7:57 pm

Zen wrote:
A winter's day
In a deep and dark December;
I am alone,
Gazing from my window to the streets below
On a freshly fallen silent shroud of snow.
I am a rock,
I am an island.


But yeah, thanks for the support. :lol: We are acutely aware that we are not normal and mostly unable to be, and this is the source of much pain for many people on the spectrum.


I have my books, and my poetry, to protect me.
that song pops into my head quite often :) it is a source of much comfort.


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pascalflower
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18 Apr 2011, 7:57 pm

Zen wrote:
A winter's day
In a deep and dark December;
I am alone,
Gazing from my window to the streets below
On a freshly fallen silent shroud of snow.
I am a rock,
I am an island.


But yeah, thanks for the support. :lol: We are acutely aware that we are not normal and mostly unable to be, and this is the source of much pain for many people on the spectrum.


That's actually a very apt post. The truth is, NT's are both jealous and scared at the same time. A rock and an island is strong and one-with-oneself- something many people strive to be. Autistics have got the good and the bad rolled into one.

But please don't get me wrong, I was merely showing the other viewpoint. People surely think worse of me, from first impressions.



wavefreak58
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18 Apr 2011, 10:10 pm

pascalflower wrote:
There have been several analogies of how Autistics see themselves in the world.

To me, an analogy for how I previously saw Autistics is like a talking rock. I once had a friend, whom I strongly felt had Asperger's from the moment we met in high school. She once told me that many of her friends no longer talked to her, or keep in touch. I wanted to tell her that I felt it was probably because she had Asperger's,but I didn't. She more than likely never heard of it, and wouldn't believe me.

In talking to people with Autism, it doesn't feel natural. There is a lack of human(-ness) to conversations. It's like talking to a rock, that can say anything like a human, but isn't quite human. From this NT perspective, Autistics are too logical, and inflexible in their opinions. They seem like rocks, solid and un-moving; incapable of the cognitive flexibility that most humans have.

The world does not operate on logic. Normal people can be very illogical, and that is still normal.


Well I'd rather be a diamond than a mushroom.


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cyberdad
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18 Apr 2011, 10:34 pm

pascalflower wrote:
The world does not operate on logic. Normal people can be very illogical, and that is still normal.


Yet many generations in the future people will probably consider modern NTs as primitive.

Thanks for your interesting post, it puts one thing in perspective, Autism is a glimpse of how the mind of our future generation will be shaped, logical yet human.



rabidmonkey4262
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18 Apr 2011, 11:01 pm

I do have problems expressing emotions, but that doesn't mean I don't have them. I may seem like an automaton in every day life, but I play piano very much like a human. I express my emotion through my playing and I have actually made audience members cry.


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rabidmonkey4262
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18 Apr 2011, 11:06 pm

pascalflower wrote:
The world does not operate on logic.


Well, I guess Newton and Einstein were wrong all along.

Their theories successfully explain many natural phenomenon using only logic and thought experiments; so I'm not so sure you can make a blanket statement like that.


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CockneyRebel
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18 Apr 2011, 11:17 pm

I've met some pretty cold NTs who don't show any feelings.


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anbuend
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18 Apr 2011, 11:27 pm

I've always said that some people respond to my communication as if a potted plant just got up and talked. 

For my part, it's revealing to see how people behave and what they say when they perceive me, not as a talking rock, but just as a rock. Many who have seen me use language still respond to me like that the moment I'm unable to write, move, etc.  Watching people transform in front of me from respectful to disdainful and cruel is also educational. 

But I am not a rock. My answer to people who see me as empty in that way is here:

http://www.dsq-sds.org/article/view/1052/1238

(See in particular the quotation about... "barren rock".)

And in more general form here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4c5_3wqZ3Lk

And even rocks are more than most people give them credit for.

Also, some autism stereotyping going on. I (and many others) am virtually nothing like the Spock stereotype.


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Last edited by anbuend on 18 Apr 2011, 11:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

opal
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18 Apr 2011, 11:30 pm

oxymoron :roll:



so_subtly_strange
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18 Apr 2011, 11:42 pm

at times i wish i were not so narrowly confined to puritanically logical perceptions, however i dont see how this could be wrong. I try my hardest to not be too aloof but i cant understand why everyone doesn't see logic as the RIGHT view point. I feel like i'm being redundant, but not sure how else to put it, logic is logic. Whatever i logically lack there must be a logical way to it if i can find the way. Any misunderstanding should be able to be bridged with reason. I dont understand how it could be any other way.



so_subtly_strange
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18 Apr 2011, 11:44 pm

ooh and i love simon and garfunkel by the way



nirrti_rachelle
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19 Apr 2011, 12:56 am

wavefreak58 wrote:
Well I'd rather be a diamond than a mushroom.


Amen :)


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