Social Anxiety vs Asperger

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Hello,
I am pretty sure I have Social Anxiety or Asperger (possibly both). How can I determine which one it is? Don't tell me to go to a psychiatrist; I mean, what are the symptoms for each. Once again, please try to avoid vague generalization, I prefer specifics I don't really know what to tell about myself, so if there are any questions that might help you with helping me determining which of these conditions I might have, feel free to ask

Google and the search function here are incredibly helpful...

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/social-anxiety-disorder/DS00595/DSECTION=symptoms

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/aspergers-syndrome/DS00551/DSECTION=symptoms

And, just to rule out the third possibility:

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/schizoid-personality-disorder/DS00865/DSECTION=symptoms

No need to be condescending. I did my research, and I opened this thread to get further and deeper insights than links that I already have read.

I have both social anxiety and aspergers and by now both disorders are very intertwined so its hard to untangle them.

Basically the difference is that with Social anxiety you know to socialize but your terrified about people judging you so you avoid people or when you actually go into social situations, your thinking everythings watching you and judging your body language on the smallest things. Whereas Aspergers, you feel like you dont know what your doing in a social situation which is primary the reason for the anxiety and you can try and try but making friends and acquintances and maintaining them is always harder your fellow NTs.

Ive known NTs with social anxiety as well as fellow aspies. From an outsiders perspective. Aspies tend to be more awkward, poor social skills, go off on tangents like its harder to hold a reciprocal conversation, slower to make friends/acquintances, will do more things that are "off". Whereas people with social anxiety are terrified of being judged in turn they feel awkward when they might not be, but they do have most social skills but they might be a tad awkward due to them avoiding social situations, people tend to be a lot more receptive towards them then aspies. They have more success making friends by putting less effort and getting people to like them then as aspie.

If you have both, you might come off as very interesting to your peers. Your aspie side makes you appear unpredicatable, unconventional, rather off at times. But then your constantly terrified of being judged by everyone and your constantly thinking your doing something wrong because your social skills arent as good as your NT peers and you think soo much what your doing that one would think if you thought that in depthly about your social skills you would not be this awkward and unpredictable.

Why do you think you have aspergers and/or social anxiety. Your best bet is to go see a psych and eventually go in for a diagnosis.

Is this an Aspie thing, that I need specific examples and dislike generalizations? I'm sorry if I am a bit annoying with this...

Anyway, what social skills do people with social anxiety have that people with aspergers don't? Could someone give me a short example of how someone with social anxiety and someone with asperger would act in the same situation?

people with social anxiety would know what to say and do but would be scared about saying the wrong thing or doing the wrong body language where people with aspergers have no clue how they are supposed to deal with the problem [unless taught] so they are scared

Well this can highly vary based on severity. Say the situation is at a party where the person has no friends just some acquintances. A person with aspie might awkwardly approach some people and the people might not be very receptive towards the aspie, but they might still talk to them. When the aspie is talking, they have trouble holding a reciprocal conversation, but might still all the standard small talk statements, but they use it as a script awkward to keep the conversation going. The aspie might go on and on about tangents being not as aware as the sharing that goes on in conversations. The aspie might be a bit scared about going up to people or they might not be. There just really unaware of whats going on socially.

Whereas an NT with social anxiety will go into the party feeling awkward and terrified but when they actually go up to people, they come across as mostly normal with social skills but they might just appear shy and/or fearful. The person with SA might be able to cover up there inner emotions and act very normal and not show that they are in fact terrified. If there forced into this enviorenment, they often might just force themselves to talk to people because some people with SA can also be terrified of being judged to why there standing by themselves. The NT with SA is aware of whats going on, but they might just overblow peoples potential judgements in there head.

Id be happy to answer anymore Qs, i'll do my best

I think it's more complicated than just SAD vs AS. Most people with SAD are introverts. Introversion carries many traits that have some overlap with ASD as suggested in this excellent paper:

http://etd.fcla.edu/CF/CFE0003090/Grime ... 005_MA.pdf

Heres a link that might be helpful:

http://counsellingresource.com/ask-the- ... l-anxiety/

Coming from a person with both: Individuals with both SA and Aspergers develop severe tension/anxiety when they try to create a relationship due to not understanding the mechanims of communication and relationships.

Were you diagnosed by a psychiatrist/clinical psychologist for both or is it self-diagnosed?

No condescension intended. You asked for specifics. In searching for my own answers I laid out all the dx criteria lists and basically ticked off the traits I felt I had. I recently had a psychologist suggest that I had social anxiety disorder, not Asperger's. I do not identify with most of the dx criteria or the common symptoms of that disorder at all. Looking at them all side by side made my self dx much clearer.

I'm pretty sure I have Asperger's and maybe also some degree of ADHD. I fit the criteria for those. I'm already dx'ed with depression. Not trying to be a smart ass - just providing what worked for me. Searching old threads here has also been incredibly helpful as well. Most subjects have been explored exhaustively in the archives.

I could have provided some explanation of that - sorry...

A guy from the SAD forum who also has AS posted this very interesting summary of the Aspie quiz summarizing the Aspie vs NT traits for each sub-component of the Aspie quiz. If you find that your talents are exclusively in the Aspie side for each sub-component, then I think that's a hint that the SAD may be secondary to something else. It mights be AS. It might be extreme introversion. Or it might be that having an "Aspie-like personality" in and of itself can cause anxiety (particularly SAD) issues. Modern society/living is not very favourable to severe introverts and people with ASD. It's way too "noisy" (socially and otherwise).

"Aspie talent": This group contains intellectually related Aspie traits. Typical traits are related to interests (e.g. having strong interests; hyper focusing; having periods of contemplation; collecting information; good long term memory related to interests; figuring out how things work; making connections between things; strong-willed; stubborn). Other traits are related to information processing (e.g. noticing details; finding patterns; unusual imagination; solving problems in unusual ways; unique ideas). Some people have special talents (e.g. numbers; language;computers; music).

"Neurotypical talent": This group contains neurotypical intellectual talents. Often these are defined in terms of Aspie disabilities. Typical traits seem to be adaptations to cooperative living (e.g. giving and remembering verbal instructions; learning from others; describing events; summarizing events; taking notes; keeping track of several conversations; learning things on demand; learning by imitation). Other traits include multitasking and attention (e.g. doing several things at the same time; rapidly shifting focus; getting back to things quickly), getting a quick picture of one’s environment (e.g. generalizing; getting the overall picture), remembering where things are, grasping abstract concepts and organizing daily life.

"Aspie Compulsion": This group contains obsessive and compulsive Aspie traits. Typical of this group is a preference for sameness (e.g. routines; lists; schedules; sitting on the same seat; going to the same shop; wearing the same clothes; eating the same food; always doing things in the same way). Related traits include getting frustrated when interrupted and a need to prepare oneself before doing new things. Some people have strong attachments to objects and like to collect and organize things and may need precision or symmetry.

"Neurotypical compulsion": This group contains socially related compulsive traits. Key traits are to enjoy social interaction (e.g. meeting people; involving others; games; crowds; large social networks; hosting events; being a leader; gossip; cheering). Other traits are related to social conformity (e.g. having views typical of peer group; preferring to socialize with others of the same age and gender; interest for fashions; wearing jewellery; wearing makeup; taking pride in ones appearance, style, image and identity; status seeking; climbing hierarchies).

"Aspie social": This group contain Aspie social traits. Important traits are a highly variable activity level with higher than normal motivation threshold. Other traits include atypical relationship & courtship preferences (partner obsessions; not giving up on relationships; preference for friends of the opposite gender) and sexual preferences. Unusual eating and sleeping patterns as well as having a hard time with authorities and social hierarchy are other traits.

"Neurotypical social": This group contains neurotypical social traits. The absence of the traits is often described as a dysfunction. Key traits are adaptations for living in changing social groups (e.g. small talk; social chitchat; shaking hands; saying ‘hi’, ‘thank you’ and ‘sorry’). Related traits are adaptations for socializing with strangers (e.g. being comfortable with strangers; enjoying talking
face-to-face with strangers; maintaining large social networks; easy to get to know; talking in public; enjoying uninvited guests). Other traits are related to friendships and relationships and expressing feelings in typical ways (e.g. making and maintaining friendships and relationships; looking at people you talk to; enjoying hugs and touch; being emotionally close to others; describing and talking about feelings) and cooperative activities (e.g. team-sports; group endeavours; teamwork; using others expertise; working while being observed).

"Aspie communication": This group contains communication related Aspie traits. Key traits in this group are related to atypical nonverbal communication (e.g. odd facial expressions; odd posture; odd prosody; smiling at the wrong occasion; being accused of staring; using unusual sounds in conversations; blinking or rolling eyes; clenching fists; grinding teeth; thrusting tongue; blushing). Related
traits are stims (e.g. wringing hands; rubbing hands; twirling fingers; rocking; tapping eyes; pressing eyes; fiddling with things; pacing; flapping hands; biting self or others; chewing on things; picking scabs; peeling skin flakes; examining hair of others; singing). Tics are also here and are often confused with stims (e.g. stuttering; sniffing; snorting; coughing; echolalia; echopraxia). Other traits include general communication differences (e.g. not verbalizing thoughts; talking softly or loudly; turning words around; talking to oneself; odd pronunciation; not separating ‘I’, ‘we’ and ‘you’). Some people also prefer to look a lot at people they like and not at all at people they dislike.

"Neurotypical communication": This group contains typical nonverbal communication traits. A key trait is the ability to interpret and show typical nonverbal communication (e.g. facial expressions; body language; courtship; timing; reciprocity; turn-taking; prosody). The absence of these abilities lead to secondary problems (e.g. unaware of how to behave; unaware of boundaries; being misunderstood;
missing hidden agendas; being unaware of others intentions; misinterpreting figures of speech, idioms and allegories; literal interpretation; unable to return social gestures and courtesies: not knowing when to apologize; saying inappropriate things; seemingly poor empathy).

"Aspie hunting": This group contains passive hunting traits. One part of the traits is related to preferred habitats (e.g. slowly flowing water; caves; woods; liking mist or fog). Another part seems to be close-contact hunting traits (e.g. jumping over things; climbing; chasing animals; biting; enjoying spinning in circles; strong grip; strong hands; physical endurance; enjoying rodeo riders). Some other traits are related to sneaking (e.g. sneaking through the woods; sneaking up on animals; walking on toes) and general hunting tactics (e.g. mimicking animal sounds; digging; throwing small things; building traps; fascination for fire; sniffing)

"Neurotypical hunting": The traits in this group are related to cooperative hunting. These traits are often described in terms of dysfunctions. Typical traits are recollections of environmental information (e.g. positions of things; scores in games; order of words, letters and digits; map reading) and passing on information to others (e.g. passing on messages; knowing left from right; dates and times
of events; remembering appointments and events; reading clocks and calendars; carrying over information between contexts). Other traits are related to trading and exchange with others (e.g. calculating change from a purchase; knowing what to bring to appointments; remembering sequences of past events; remembering formulas; filling out forms).

"Aspie perception": This group contains perception-related Aspie traits. These traits commonly become disabilities, but their core seems to be more sensitive senses (e.g. touch; sound; tactile; smell; taste; light and glare; humidity; changes in air pressure; wind; heat; electromagnetic fields) or less sensitive senses (e.g. pain). Related to this are instinctual reactions to sensory information (e.g. being
distracted by sounds; being afraid of motor-bikes; being afraid of floods or fast running streams; disliking stomping). Other traits are difficulty filtering out speech from background noise and using peripheral vision.

"Neurotypical perception": This group contains neurotypical motor abilities and perception traits. The absence of these traits is often referred to as clumsiness. A key trait is the ability to interpret spatial information (e.g. judging distance, speed and acceleration; keeping track of positions of objects; predicting motion; concept of time; optimal pressure to apply). The absence of these skills leads to
secondary problems (e.g. poor fine and gross motor skills; poor body awareness; poor body control; problems with ball sports; poor hand-eye coordination; poor balance; poor handwriting; dropping things).

I am officially diagnosed with aspergers, I was never officially diagnosed with social anxiety but Im 99% sure I have it. And Ive mentioned it to every single psych I've seen and no one has yet to disagree with me but no one has officially diagnosed me with it. The SA explains a hell lot of things. I notice something small socially and I completely blow it up in my head and obsess over it(where the aspergers comes in). Being social and throughly evaluating every single social interaction is one of my interests. This is where the aspergers and social anxiety meet.