ASDs and intelligence & IQ

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I am interested in this topic, and here are some relevant threads on WP I just looked over:
http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt166695.html
http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt52856.html
http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt134829.html
http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt99549.html

Quick notes about IQ:
* The average of IQ is set by default at 100.
* The standard deviation is set at 15 (16 on the Stanford–Binet IS), so the "average range" where most people (68% of the population) lie is between 85 and 115.
* Mental impairment is an IQ of below 70.

Some people said that the minimum IQ requirement for Asperger's is an IQ over 70. This requirement seems to be the interpretation of this line from the Asperger's diagnosis criteria of the DSM-IV:
"E. There is no clinically significant delay in cognitive development or in the development of age-appropriate self-help skills, adaptive behavior (other than in social interaction), and curiosity about the environment in childhood."

But others said that the minimum IQ requirement for Asperger's is actually higher: that you must have an IQ score that is within the average range (85-115), or one that is exactly average (100), or one that is even higher at 110 or 115.

They said that if you have an IQ below one of those, then you don't have Asperger's, you actually have high-functioning autism (HFA) or PDD-NOS.

What do you think?

One quote from another thread:

A note about HFA by Tony Attwood:

Before anyone gets a word in: IQ tests don't work on autistics, period.

Can you tell me whay, phonic?
That would help me understand why I was considered dumb after IQ tests when I was a child.

Interesting question, Lyll. As far as I know, people with Asperger Syndrome are generally known to have either a normal or high IQ. IQ tests, however, are always tricky. Firstly, they want a test taker to produce only certain information generated by certain parts of the brain and functioning. While you might be extremely gifted musically or linguistically (in foreign languages), a standard IQ test might not filter that out and 'consider you dumb' as you said. Secondly, the tests generally ask to produce answers to questions people might already know. For instance, if you know of the Fibonacci sequence, you will have quite an easy time answering questions such as "Fill in the blank: 0 1 1 2 3 5 8 13 21 34 [...] 89 144". These things distort the view you - or the 'test' - might have of your intelligence.

Lyll, I think it's good to always look at the factual strengths that you have, and not only an IQ score. Either way - high or low IQ - it will keep you from getting the full potential out of yourself .

An IQ test is a snapshot of your brain at any given time, and the outcome can of course change over time (especially if you take the same test multiple times, which is usually discouraged). Nervousness, uncertainty (often problematic for people with Asperger's) can heavily influence the outcome.

I, of course, can't be sure why Phonic said the tests don't work on autistics, but maybe he/she thought it has something to do with the fact that we often have very narrow interests and thus no interest in producing correct answers to questions that we can't be bothered with?

But, yes, Phonic, why did you say that? I am curious!

Intelligence and IQ are not the same thing. Intelligence is a complex, multi-faceted and ill-defined concept, whereas IQ is an imperfect attempt to measure a single interpretation of what intelligence is. An IQ attempts to measure intelligence, but what it really measures is how good you are at taking IQ tests.

Person who invented the IQ test, told people not to use it for measuring.

That a good enough answer?

There are a lot of reasons why IQ tests may not work as well on autistics, or why IQ tests are not good measures of intelligence after all.

Motivation. Someone who's too much in one's world can't be expected to co-operate well with the test administrator. Attention deficit. Problems with basic verbal comprehension. Some autistics, those who have weaker verbal ability simply can not understand instructions as well, let alone the test at hand. In other words, there's a minimum requirement or verbal communication ability, and if someone fails to meet it, it'd skew the results, whatever strengths they might have.

On the other hand, the more you are forced to use your brain in academic / work settings, the more you'll be able to score high on IQ test, since IQ tests are primarily designed to measure the ability to achieve academic success. There are better tools to measure academic success though, like WIAT-II, but basically IQ tests are not far from them (they correlate well). This means, if you've developed your mind in such a way as to better understand verbal instructions, learned some tricks how to improve on your weak short-time memory, read lots of books, done lots of puzzles, etc. etc., you'll score higher.

I only want input on how IQ or other intelligence tests relate to people on the spectrum and their diagnoses. Please take general criticisms of IQ and psychometrics to another thread.

I score in the 170s and my diagnosis is PDD-NOS.
So at least one of your assumptions is wrong. (Of course your post only said that aspies can't have low IQ, not that all PDD-NOS have low IQ, so maybe my assumption was wrong)
I agree that IQ tests show little else than your skills at solving IQ tests.

A IQ test was not put infront of me colddryplace. when getting a diagnoses. I would repeat the same thing I said before to them.



Well maybe you did not meet the criteria for As, or maybe the person was wrong.

Going on what he put, he said if you hav e high IQ you should of been As, if not the other ones. But ye have to wait for him to clear it up a bit.

I don't even know my IQ. I think mine is just average.

Not really. He said that low IQ excludes Aspies, not that high IQ excludes PDD-NOS.
Agree on the waiting.

I only collected these pieces of information from other threads, I didn't say that these are official. I just posted this thread to maybe get some info into of how IQ can relate to the different diagnoses, from people more knowledgable than I.

I wanted to know if these people from the other threads are correct:

Almost, but not quite.

That line refers to (assuming you have read all important parts of the DSM, not just the summary of symptoms for quickview):



It's not common but kids (and adults) like these are not exactly super rare either. The IQ range defined to be a mild intellectual disability (mild mental retardation) goes from 69 to either 49 or 50 if I recall that correctly. So, what that means is, below 70 is not impossible.

Honestly, this is quite a confusion. I don't blame anybody, since even professionals can't agree on the differential diagnosis of Asperger's / Austism / (PDD-NOS). Differentiating by IQ scores is only a part of this confusion.

Also, average IQ score means a score anywhere between 85 and 115, by definition. An IQ of 100 is at the 50th percentile.

Your notes about IQ section are correct.

Asperger's does not have an IQ component, per se. Sometimes IQ will be used however, to satisfy the "no clinically significant delay in cognitive development or in the development of age-appropriate self-help skills, adaptive behavior (other than in social interaction), and curiosity about the environment in childhood" but not exclusively, as this can be determined through observation often times. So, if you have average or above IQ, you could argue you satisfy that requirement to some degree. This is usually were subjective opinion comes in on the part of the professional making a diagnosis, though. I'm sure what can be agreed upon, is that medical professionals don’t always agree on how to diagnose!

Autism proper tends to have developmental delays. While this suggests a low IQ, that is not always true. There are different labels tied to -autism that get slung around sometimes. High/low function, severe/moderate/mild. IQ can be used to determine between high/low functioning, although I personally find that slightly distasteful, again, observation by the diagnosing professional should be primary to IQ score consideration. The score should just be one of many tools used.

PDD-NOS is a free for all. IQ is rarely used to make determinism of this condition, in so far as PDD-NOS doesn't have a requirement. However, if your IQ score suggests you do not fall into Autism/Aspergers, but you still fall into spectrum behavior, then you will find this to be the diagnosis.

That help?



I personally disagree with that interpretation, as I had developmental delays, and have a very high IQ. They are not exclusive to each other, per se. IQ is only a tool, not a criteria.