Was she right?

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Yesterday I got told that maybe it isn't the right time for me to study. That I might not make it (due to my problems focusing and my other problems). That perhaps it would be better if I got help and then studied (queueing at the moment). That I might not be able to study what I really want to study (Biomedicine) and that I might have to settle for my second choice of education (Chemistry). That's what the woman who's "in charge of" the support I get at uni said to me yesterday. She's not mean and she didn't tell me to stop trying or to give up but it really hurt to hear all of that. It hurt even more since I have been afraid that I won't be able to handle going to uni lately. Was she right? What do you reckon? I reckon it would be nice not having to be completely stressed out and anxious about my studies all the time (since I'm pretty much failing) but that I'd get even more depressed if I failed and dropped out.

Got another question as well. Do you have trouble letting things go? In general. Example:

Yesterday, while in a Chemistry lecture, the lecturer said something which didn't make sense to me. It wasn't logical to me so I didn't get it. Since no one explained the whole thing to me and I didn't get answers to my questions I wasn't able to let it go. So instead of listening to the rest of the lecture I kept thinking about that one little thing which didn't make sense to me. I couldn't figure it out so then I lost focus completely and spent the rest of the lecture looking out at the snow while thinking about other things. I'm a bit inflexible like that. Can anyone relate? Does anyone know why that happens? Not all people seem to have that problem.

I have this exact same problem
it caused me to drop out of cc

No, you should not listen to the woman. It takes much trial and error to figure out some ways of studying that work for you. Regardless of diagnosis in future, these may be things that you have to eggsperiment with and figure out yourself. Can you take a lighter course load to help with this?

For other question, yes, I get obsessed whenever there is one little point I don't get.

That part was always called OCD. We get stuck on something and can't move on.

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Last edited by Underscore on 01 Dec 2012, 2:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I can't answer your first question, and I really don't think anyone else can either. That's something I think you need to take time to ponder and decide for yourself.

It's interesting though, that both your questions, IMO, are about very similar problems.

You're stuck on the first one the same way you got stuck on the second issue, except the first one is on a larger scale.

I've had them both.

The only way I've found to deal with stuff like this is to "take note" put it aside, and move on. Go back to the problem later. Don't "let it go" as you put it, but put it aside for future reference and ask about it. Dig until you do understand it.

Sometimes what seem like logical fallacies are just a matter of semantics and misunderstandings.

The problem with your first question though, isn't that it's a logical fallacy. It's that it's being suggested that you get off the track you are on, and get on a different one.

It wouldn't be the end of the world to take a time out, as your counselor suggested, and contemplate doing something differently. Many of us don't like doing that because it means screwing up our schedules and plans. Aspies don't like doing that, but it is a part of life we need to learn to adapt to.

Take the time to think about your options. Because that's pretty much what she suggested you do. She's offered you more options (another thing we tend to hate), and even considering them means opening doors to possibilities you hadn't considered, that aren't part of your plan as you see it right now.

Plans change though. People change. You'll change over time. Changing plans is NOT quitting.

Just keep in mind that the first thing you ought to think of is, "Do I even like the subject she's suggesting I change to?" If you don't, forget it, but consider other things you do like, and think about whether some of those might make good options. Don't let other people decide for you.

For both problems, take notes, put the problem aside as you go on with daily life, but schedule time to revisit each of them.

That might be true. I get stuck on a lot of things.



I'm sorry, I don't really get it. I don't know how to do this.



I don't know if I'm an aspie yet but I sure don't like when my plans change. In fact, I hate it and it makes me confused and/or angry and/or depressed. To study Biomedicine has been a plan of mine for about five years now. I can't just change that. I don't really see how changing my plans and drop out isn't quitting. I would definitely see that as a failure. A big one. I would be so disappointed in myself. Very much so. Also, since my parents don't believe there's anything wrong with me (and they won't believe it until I have some sort of diagnosis) they would become angry/disappointed with me too. They'd probably force me to work as well. Which I can't. Believe me, I've tried and it and I couldn't even work 20 hours a week without having to call in sick due to anxiety and exhaustion et cetera. I'm starting to feel like a failure.

Only you can figure out what answer is right for you on this one. But even if she is not mean, you should think about this - she has to oversee more than one student, so she has to limit the amount of effort she puts into solving any one set of problems. Can you think of ways to overcome the problems she's pointed out to you? Can you get help elsewhere in figuring out how to overcome them? In other words, only you can decide what the "final answer" is, but just because this woman is doing what she can to help you does not automatically mean you've exhausted every option.



I do this. All the time. And I've learned a technique that sometimes helps, depending on how much the particular point matters to me. What I'll do is jot down a quick note - in whatever way will work for me in the context - to remind me to follow up on the question. That lets me know that I will - sooner or later - track down the answer I need, which, sometimes, makes it easier for me to temporarily let go of it and allows me to go back to concentrating on whatever I'm trying to. I think it will take you a little practice - and actually following up on the notes you make, to reassure yourself that itch will get scratched - before you see many results, if you do at all, but it can't hurt to try.

This is from someone who was in a Chemistry PhD program.

The days of toiling away by yourself in the science field are pretty much gone. Yes, I had to do my dissertation by myself, but everything else lived and died by the group.

Not flexible? Can't deal with quick changes of ideas on the fly? Having a pet idea shot down by the group for no good reason makes you stabby? Doing never ending poster sessions in front of the other chemistry department heads and other grad students, then quickly tore to shreds if it wasn't fab AND entertaining.

Can't smooze? Can't network? Who do you think will pimp your work for a post doc gig? If you don't do all that horrendous NT social BS with your advisor and other department Mucky Mucks, you get the generic crap recommendation letter, the advisors grind out for students they aren't that thrilled with.

If you last that long. My advisor systematically weeded out any Aspies in his group, and punted them into the MS program. I knew the three guys (who probably had Asperger, looking back on it), that he marginalized and then failed to okay their thesis. I never realized an advisor could do that. "Let them pack distillation columns, and spiral out of control worrying about details that don't matter." Three years of their lives pissed away.

I see nothing wrong with taking a break and figuring out what the degree will get you in the end. There is no point accumulating a ton of debt you will immediately have to start paying on, if you can not find a job.

The problem with life is it is always changing. You can't stop the waves, but you can learn to surf. You need to see how your "weaknesses-lack of a better word" will hamper the degree you want. I like the other posters suggestings about managing nagging thoughts, because you will get eaten live in upper level classes. Either by missing most of the lecture or having the professor call you out. Many of my professors would randomly call on people they thought were "day dreaming". A big lecture hall, probably not, but upper level classes may only have 50 or less people. My professors called on the folks "not paying attention", all the time.

Better to tackle this problem NOW, before you are in debt and have a degree where you can't get a job, or have to quit because live has become unmanageable.

That isn't failure, but a whole lotta of courage.

PS. Screw your family. Parents are usually never happy with what their kids do for a living, date or marry. It's seems their job is to piss and moan saying how you could do better. Tune them out like a bad song on the radio.

stupid droid phone. double post

Tawaki

Last edited by Tawaki on 01 Dec 2012, 6:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

stop studying until when???

You need to press on. Try your best to write down the things you don't understand.
that way you can continue to focus on the rest of the class without that question jingling around in your head.
Many things in this world are so unlogical, it is very hard to understand why people do unlogical things and they are still correct.
we don't think that way. Ilya Prigogine "nobel chemist of the chemical clock" told me that life is a long lonely ride for us do not let your self get discouraged, they have no idea what they are talking about. Just nod like they are correct and keep studying.

He basically connected chemistry with atomic theory

If it is not logical too you it is possible completely wrong and one day you can point that out.
as long as you can prove a thousand cases of it

Courage? Why?



Yeah but I mean, the fact that I'm not really able to let things go isn't the only reason for me having a really hard time with my studies. I can't focus. I get distracted by my own thoughts, by sounds and movement etc. I have a really hard time starting things which means I hardly ever study which means I get far behind in my courses. That has resulted in me dropping one course already. So maybe the woman I talked to yesterday was right. I don't know. I know I would see it as a huge failure if I dropped out though.

You asked why I thought it wasn't failure but a whole lotta of courage.

(My Aspie husband doesn't understand this, and would have a hard time in a recovery program, but here it goes)

Humans HATE change. Not just Aspies, but anyone. I hate change. I had two major study changes through no
fault of my own. First one is I had to leave art school because of health reasons, and the second was leaving chemistry
grad school because of the same health issues. A double kick in the head. I was furious. I felt like a failure.
I went into a suicidal depression. It is so easier to spiral into a hole, beat up yourself, and some drink and
drug their issues away.

Or

Face the stuff head on, and be truly honest with yourself. It is hard. It takes courage to do that. It is not easy at all.
You love biomedicine. Maybe A---->B, the direct route might not be possible with whatever challenges you are dealing with.
Maybe you can get to your biomedicine degree going A---->B----->C. It is not the way you want to do it at the moment, and the women was discouraging you to switch. I personally do not think you need to give up on your dream.

So, in my book, it took a lot of courage to have the discussion with the woman, and figure out what might be the problem. It is so much easier to just keep doing the same thing, and get unsatisfactory results.

Good luck on your journey.

Tawaki

I was talking to someone with ADHD yesterday, not diagnosed until a college student. She said that she had to figure out all studying and testing techniques for herself, like come up with her own organizational systems and ways of learning that worked for her.

There are web sites that offer help with various issues related to ADD and ADHD. Just as with the autism spectrum, your mileage will vary in terms of how much help they are. And you may need to ask for help in even understanding what they're trying to say if it makes too little sense to you.

But I can give you a piece of advice that will - I hope - help you get more out of them. Try to understand the process, and why they're recommending it. Then, you can adjust the details of that process to suit your own personality and working style. If you just try to rigidly follow the advice, a lot of it won't work. The important part is learning what they're trying to accomplish, how, and why. Then you can adapt those ideas.

Okay, but even if it takes "a whole lotta courage" it would still be a failure, right? I mean, I decided to start studying. I wanted to start studying. I was motivated and I had a goal (Biomedicine). But then I realised it was like high school all over again (trouble focusing etc) but a lot worse this time (everything's, not only my problems concentrating, gotten worse with time). Dropping out now, due to my problems, would be a massive failure and I would be so indescribably disappointed with myself. IF I'd drop out I'd be afraid that:

1. I'd get awfully depressed.
2. I'd never be able to go back to university.
3. my parents would be angry/disappointed/confused and that they'd force me to work (not to be mean but to not let me "waste away" at home). That would be quite likely.
4. it, for some weird reason, would turn out nothing's "wrong" with me and that I've then made a huge mistake.

I know I'm repeating myself by saying these things. I just don't see how dropping out now isn't a failure (I think I'm afraid of failure).

Also, you said everyone hates change. That's probably true but then why do people make such a big deal about aspies really hating change? I mean, what's the difference between someone with AS hating change and someone who's NT hating change?

EDIT: My parents don't even know I get support at university. I don't dare to tell them. They wouldn't understand.