Those pesky NT's & their 'teaching moments'

Post Reply New Topic

Had an epiphany at about 2am this morning....a "friend" of mine was trying to modify my behavior (over a MONTH ago). Took me that long to figure it out. Tell me what you think about this:

About 6 weeks ago (just after the 2nd sinkhole killed someone here in the U.S.-the first was relatively close to where I live in Florida & the second was a different kind of sinkhole somewhere in the Mid-West of the U.S.A.)
I had the opportunity to do some volunteer work. Another gal from my church (who I consider my friend) and her husband were also there volunteering-let me call them Mo & Larry.
We had some "down time" and the coordinator (I'll just call her Curly) was making small talk about the coincidences of the 2 sinkholes.
Curly mused that she didn't even know what causes sinkholes.
Now, being an Aspie (& I don't care what the APA/DSM-5 says--I have decided that I *like* that nickname for my malady!) one of my "interests" is the news. I read & re-read my favorite news websites MULTIPLE TIMES during the day.
Inbetween reading the news stories, I Google EVERYTHING I've read. So I had looked into that particular phenomena very recently.
I told Curly that I wasn't certain about the one in the Mid-West (that I do know they are caused by a different mechanism than the Florida ones) & I had just studied Florida sinkholes & I found out that because Florida is basically a big sandbar (we have NO bedrock) the hardest thing under our feet besides clay is something called coquina (a kind of shell/rock very heavy in limestone) and as the rain water filters through it all, the limestone gets leached away and empty pockets form below the sand/clay & BOOM ya' get a sinkhole.
So then my friend Mo turns to her husband and says "Now honey, please tell the lady what causes sinkholes"
WTH? I ******know****** my answer was correct. I was very surprised & hid myself with trying to teach myself how to get on to facebook with my new smartphone.
Larry went on for about 10 min. & said pretty much the EXACT SAME THING I did (only more like a politician or lawyer--why use 1 word when 1,000 will do?)
Curly gave me at least one sidelong glance edited to add in: I mean SIDEWAYS glance(that I noticed; I was fiddling with my cell phone & telling myself during Larry's dissertation that Mo must have had a good reason to act like that; I just didn't see why right then)
If I weren't an Aspie, I woulda picked up THEN that there was some tension in the air. I was OBLIVIOUS to what Mo was doing through Larry. I did feel a bit of anger (why did Mo feel the need to to have her honey repeat what I just said?) but like I said before, I was trying to be polite & not point out that Larry just repeated what I'd said.
Fast forward to yesterday. I finally figured out that Mo set me up to fail in a project at church. Long story I don't really want to get into except to say that my confirmation of that FACT yesterday came from the Pastor-he had NO idea I was 'given that complete project'---not that he was against me doing it at all--it is actually something I would have excelled in but for the fact I was given the task w/NO money, NO promised budget, NO access to required space & that Mo & her contingent already knew that no-one else in the church was the least bit interested in participating....so if I were going to excell in it I would be doing it all by myself. WTH?
I did tell my Pastor that Christian Women are women. Christian Women do love everyone but they don't like everyone. He accused me of playing word games. I agreed that the term sure does flow like a word game but it really is just human nature.
So after my long talk with the Pastor I disected my most recent social-situations with the ladies from church (& Mo in particular) & I realized she might have been trying to show me what it feels like to be snubbed by a know-it-all.

My analogy: Do you have a friend with the flu? Did they just puke? So will you now puke to show them how unpleasant it is for everyone else? I don't think so!

I wouldn't have been able to keep quiet while what I had just said was being repeated as if I hadn't even spoken

I'd say 'Isn't that what I just said?'

Your 'friend' Mo sounds a complete b***h to be quite honest - she completely undermined you in that scenario

I'm lucky really as I never get on with people like her from the outset - we suss each other out immediately

This is the appearance of friendship while in reality hardcore competition is occurring all the time underneath and I don't buy into it
- I've got too much respect for my own intellect and you should too!

I might have got into a conversation with her husband about anything different he had said in his explanation and I'd want to know where he was getting his information from and what qualified him to talk as some kind of 'expert'

I wouldn't tolerate being treated like this for two seconds though - probably why I don't have a group of friends - I see the price as too high to pay!

I can't stand being behavior-modded like this. While I do understand it's not always appropriate to go on about your perseverations in a smalltalk conversation, there are different ways of making that clear that are much more appropriate. If I were Mo, I'd tell you straight out that this was not the time and place to go on and on about this topic. What she did to you through Larry, is belittling you.

I don't see how it's a behaviour modification attempt, more like a way of saying she doesn't want you to be given the airspace to hold forth on the subject. She was evidently happy for her partner to go on about the subject but not you, so it's not the talking about the subject in a knowlegeable manner per se that's the problem, it's who is 'allowed' to do it; who gets to impress the other person and thus gain status.

I'd avoid this woman like the plague if it were me as she evidently sees everything as a big competition. If your'e forced to interact with her, just tell her about an occasion when you've achieved success in something or had a good time somewhere and watch her face drop! I hate this type of person.

It sounds as if "Mo" is patronizing you.

I agree with you about "church ladies" and also that like and love are not the same thing.

It sounds like you are more intelligent than the people around you - and more polite.

THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU!! !! !

I can't tell y'all how much you've HELPED me!

I was thinking each & every one of y'alls thoughts.

And YES I have confronted "friends" like that before. Sometimes I'd win the confrontation (& loose the "friend"///but with friends like THAT, who needs enemies?///) sometimes I'd loose. No matter the case I ****ALWAYS**** felt like the .

This $#!+ has been piling up since last Fall. In the past if I tried to talk to my DH he acted as if I was blowing things out of proportion. This time I waited. I behaved in the "Politically Correct" manner (NO confrontation, no discussions) but filed them away in the first drawer for further study. Further study is the conversation DH & I had last night & then at 2am I had the epiphany. DH is home sick today so I was able to share with him my 'theory' and I came here, posted it and asked for other Aspie views.

THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU!! !! !

A bit of an end-note: I only just started going to that church a year ago in March.

When I started, my first visit was to a ladies evening Bible Study. I asked permission to take some of the time that night to introduce myself. It was awkward....they ALL bobble-headed me "oh, yeah, we know what Aspergers is!" but that's NOT the way they've acted since.

I did give them permission in that first meeting to tell me whenever I was acting socially inappropriate. NOT ONE OF THOSE COWARDS EVER DID. Instead they'd wait for me to (eventually) figure it out, go to them to ask forgiveness & then they'd claim to "forgive & forget". Well, forgiveness is Christian but forgetting AIN'T human.

This tiny church has a WONDERFUL Pastor who preaches the Bible but the majority of the women there make up a click that would rival the harridans from my tortured High School days! (And that's my most Christian thought about it!)


edited to add: the call I had with the Pastor last night was to tell him that I'm not going to be attending anymore & WHY. He was completley FLABBERGASTED & taken by surprise. He really did have no idea the women were doing that (& he said more than once that he wished I had brought it to him earlier). He was VERY surprised about the project as he had been mislead by his own wife! (I was not surprised but very saddened all the same!)

I'm a Christian and I can only say that whenever I've interacted with people in a church environment I've come across some very unpleasant types

I practice my religion outside of anything organised as I don't think you need to be a part of a church community to be a good person

Amen to that, Sister! (Unless your a Brother, that is )

I'm a Sister

A fascinating message. I agree with everything everyone wrote to you ---excellent feedback...Here is some more...sometimes it is a little difficult for some to process what I write, but my intent is good....

First, it sounds like this women is hostile to you, and her husband was an innocent pawn, but where you may be going off is in trying to figure out the reason. Let's say she has a dysfunction which your behavior somehow plays into in her mind---she may not think a Christian woman should be giving all this information when a man is there, that it is not feminine and/or is over assertive, or she just may be jealous or whatever, and re talking to the pastor---he is a guy (problem solver)--and probably is not going to want to get lost in the complexity of this, and I don't know if that is his job---isn't his job more to do with steering the focus of the congregation toward God and kind of away from intellectual analysis fueled by negative emotions?...

Here is the thing....you are in a Christian church which means the main aim isto focus your mind on (what Christians call) God, so the solution is to do that. I think focusing on the defects and foibles of other people will not strengthen your relationship with God but if you turn to God and pray to God then he will help you solve this problem, which is probably what your pastor should have told you, and, yes, stay away from this woman. If the situation still gets worse after you turn your mind and your heart to God and let him help you solve your problems, then I suggest to go to another church, as God will be there, wherever you go. The point is not to get too deep into situations or patterns of thinking that take you away from your focus, and when your focus on God is deep enough then this will begin to improve your relationships...

You are very welcome, MsMarginalized.

It sounds to me like you have very good instincts about people. I am glad you are not letting them drag you down. I think you should trust your instincts about them (what type of person they are.)

It bothers me that they feel you must ask for 'forgiveness' just for being yourself or for making an honest 'mistake.' Especially a social blunder, I mean, we have all done those before, whether AS or NT. It sounds like they just want you to always be apologizing. Always on edge and off center. I don't mean that they are consciously setting out to be mean, just that they sound thoughtless and, as said before, patronizing. Who are they to constantly be judging you?

I too have had some bad experiences with the people in the church. One lady was just vicious to me for no apparent reason, and a man 'yelled' (not loudly, but vehemently) at me right in the church. All we had done was take up the communion wafers when no one else seemed to be ready to do it. At church it was always just who was sitting closest, but he felt he should've done it that day I guess.

I have noticed the pastor or priest rarely seems to know about any of this, because of course, they don't act that way around them.

It's very sad, and I don't know why people must behave that way. Most don't, but the few who do, really can ruin things for others. Joyce Meyer has some good sermons about what church was like for her sometimes. She has books and a Tv show, if you aren't familiar with her (I'm not sure how far she's known, or where you are.)

It's really a shame when stuff like this happens. I guess people are going to act like people wherever they are.

Ok, Sister it is! Here's one view of you in Heaven....crown and all.

Mans devices for worshipping God have so go out of kilter from what He originally designed (at least I believe that to be the case).

This Aspergers really has me thinking in so many directions (I was only just diagnosed about 5 yrs ago). Was at a different church when I got the diagnosis & no one there could wrap their head around the fact that I'm an extremely intelligent woman who has Autism?

Don't think I'm going to find a edited to say: LOOK for a replacement church anytime soon.

Thanks

The last time I went to church was about 2 years ago, to a memorial service for people who had lost someone close to them.
This was near Christmas and we went to have coffee and a mince pie after the service. I said I wanted to start attending church again but even though people were friendly I still felt I probably wouldn't end up doing it as I just didn't feel the same as these people. It's like you have to restrict yourself to fit in with people in these communities and I just didn't want to do it. It wasn't like when I used to attend Sunday School and Church as a child, when I felt I was the same as everyone else and didn't know any better. My difference was now clearly demarcated in my mind and I could tell these people were aware of it, however much they tried to hide it or not make it apparent, and I just don't like being reminded of it or expected to make the effort to be more like them.

I wasn't real clear in that....what I meant to convey was that the women of that church treated me cooly until I did figure out my mistake & then go & ask for forgiveness from whomever it was I had offended...I never really agreed that it was the correct thing--I mean if you have the flu & puke do you apologize for being sick? I don't and I don't ever want to apologize for my Aspieness again. But I'm afraid that living in a fallen world it WILL happen again. I can say that it won't happen in that group again!

Yes, Joyce M. is on tv here. I might just tune in to her this week.

One of the replies above was about how church is to focus on God. I personally believe that WORSHIP is when I am totally focused on God. The FELLOWSHIP of other believers is supposed to be an edifying, sattisfying relationship of like-believers. It wasn't satisfying to me (that one place) so I won't be fellowshipping there anymore.

Good point, thanks....however I do believe that the spiritual relationship is not just about worship but also transformation, and ultimately comprehensive in that it does need to extend into ones personal life and transform ones relationships, and this requires some kind of focus...so some of it does come down to what one is preoccupied with. I am not saying your concern is not legitimate or that writing and talking about it is not legitimate, but probably wrote that and this in some way for myself as I have these kind of problems, too, and they tend to take me over..