when you point out nt flaws

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I hated this.NT folks point out my flaws,that's ok.
Yet,if I point out one of their flaws,they get mad at me.
My mother is like that,she can tell me what I do
wrong,but if tell her,what she does wrong,she
gets mad,not fair.

My younger brother is like that. This morning he got pissed at me for using the thermos. He had to go get it out of my room and the lid was not with it (because he didn't put the lid with it the last time he used it) so he called me a dumbass. But really he's the dumbass. It still kind of ruined my day.

they not only get mad, but often disregard the criticism, even if it is completely legitimate

We probably don't hear or use the standard delivery mechanism. I understand the theory of the criticism sandwich, and I have sort of pulled it off in group projects, but I mostly employ irony as a method to deliver criticism to NTs. Maybe they'll realize what I meant eventually...

Most people don't tend to take criticism very well, I've noticed. Always interpreting criticism as a personal attack. Gotta protect that ego at all costs.

I don't believe in hurting others by pointing out their flaws. I've been hurt many times by people who did that to me. I don't wish to hurt others by doing the same.

It annoys me too. It seems that the higher you are in the social hierarchy, the more nastiness you can get away with.

Seems like that. I have also come across people that criticise others in a nasty way and then say "i am just being honest" when they get called out on it.

Possibly aspies get less cross in response to criticism because we're used to looking at other people for course correction. When criticizing an NT you need to be careful how you phrase it. This typically means waiting for a time when the person is not busy, then saying something nice, followed by the criticism, and followed by something nice again.

Hey Bill this may be less of an 'NT' thing than a mom/son thing.

My ASD husband is intensely critical of me. Not an interaction passes when I'm not criticised. But when I say the least little thing to him, he explodes. I gotta get out of this mess.

Not only does it seem that way, it really is that way.

Pointing out the flaws in others (bullying) is the technique humans (similar to dogs and wolves and other pack animals) use to establish a pecking order in their pack. This way, they compete about who is more alpha in the pack - and hence who is going to be dominant, and who is going to have to be submissive to remain a part of the pack (group).

All this comes natural to (most) NT people because of their innate pack mentality. The pack (group) means so much to them that they would rather put up with being bullied than excluded from the group.

You could put it this way: Generally, being excluded from the group feels just as bad for an NT as being bullied in a group does for a person with AS.

It feels bad for the NT person to be excluded from the group because they (unconsciously) believe their survival is dependent on their membership/acceptance of the group.

It feels bad for the person with AS to be bullied in a group because they (unconsciously) believe their survival is dependent on their independence. When you are bullied, you are forced into a submissive position, and in a submissive position you are no longer independent because the actions you are "allowed" to take dependent on the commands given by your leader/the alpha.

Losing independence is one of the worst thing you can expose an AS individual to. This is also why cats won't obey, unless they see no other way out, even if you kept punishing them for not obeying. They would rather flee, if possible.

So true. But I call it integrity/logic instead of independence. Though independence is a necessary stage to be able to live by logic and consistently with one's beliefs (aka integrity). I think we aspies abhor the most having to follow a leader who is wrong (mistaken logic). NTs abhor the most having no leader and group to follow, even if they know they're being led astray. This is masterfully portrayed in the movie of the sinking of the Titanic (the first movie), where a big group of survivors follow someone and they're told that they're going the wrong way and they know it but still continue.

It depends on how you say it. If you say it in a joking or lighthearted way it's usually ok.

True.

But no matter how joking or lighthearted you say things, there is always a point of dominance to it, with the "victim" being the submissive at the other end. It is only funny if you value the group enough (or perhaps isn't made fun of yourself)!

No, there isn't always some sort of dominance to it. Sometimes you point something out to someone because it either annoys you or it's annoying to others and you want to let the person know about it. It can be completely equal, especially if both parties are free to point things out to each other. I recently told one of my NT friends that she drinks entirely too much and gets in batshit crazy situations because of it and she's going to end up f*****g up her life if she doesn't quit it. She told me a couple days afterwards that I am the absolute worst passenger she's ever driven anywhere and if I didn't shut up about her driving she would leave me on the side of the road (we were about 100 miles from the house at the time). Neither of us got offended and neither of us felt dominant or submissive.

Why is it that on this forum nothing can be discussed without someone posting to point out how aspies are just the victim of society in every possible context? Can't a cigar just sometimes be a cigar??

Agreed, integrity is a great word for it - we both know so well what that is

All you need to become the top-alpha/leader is to be the socially strongest and most dominant - you don't (always) need a sensible and good plan Goes to show how strong pack mentality is. People stare themselves blind on their leaders.