Interesting little video I found about autism on YouTube

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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rFGPe81Yibw&list=PLBGOtQjTMyteL6c0fJHrpOSnd9TAp9GOv&index=52.com[/youtube]

What do you guys think?

First of all it is really sad he got ALS. but i can relate to what is being said. i have made my doctors look like liars in the progress that i have made. of course they would talk about me to my parents with me in the room like i wasn't there and could not understand what they were saying. "he can't do this or that" "he will never this and that" Wrong! And i too had to teach myself how to read. i would say acceptance is a big part of me. i do not understand most judgmental attitudes of people. I hate feeling anything negative towards anyone

Brilliant video. I loved it.

Jeni, thanks for giving the opportunity to see this video..Now you understand that different people are going to have different opinions about different things, I am sure, and this is why you asked---because your mind is enquiring and you want to explore different points of view, not just get a consensus.

I think it is wonderful that this boy was discovered to have more capacity than other people realized..

However, imo the poem about autistics having more compassion than other people and so saving the world, though delightfully creative, is just a pipe dream:-- understandable that he might have this kind of pipe dream but also problematic. I think it is a form of playing the autism card, though rather subtle. Sadly he probably learned this from other autistic people..This may have built up his self esteem, but ultimately perhaps to his own detriment, and obviously underneath it is a grudge toward people he thinks do not have as much compassion as autistic people do.

There is no evidence I know that being treated cruelly makes a person more compassionate, though in a rare instance with other factors in place, such as having experienced the contrast of great kindness and being encouraged to be kind, it could maybe have that result, but probably in general circumstances it is more to the contrary,and I see no evidence from being on WP and reading thousands of messages here that autistic people are more compassionate than any other kind of person I meet on the street or on the bus or at work, and I meet many many people, most of whom are pretty kind, though some are not, and some autistic people I have met in person actually stand out to me as being really quite cruel... ..

Hi Jen, that was a nice video in a some ways (if a little heavy on the syrup factor). I guess they are real people and were telling their own story though, and they have a right to their voice as much as anybody else.

The video did effectively make some really solid points for the general public (that might not be aware of these things):

That we have feelings even if it looks like we don't;

That we are cognizant of our surroundings, even if it looks like we aren't;

That parents sometimes know their kids way better than doctors yet doctors treat can treat everybody involved like they are all too stupid to know anything;

That Autistic people have as much value as every other person on the planet;

And not that Autistic people are more compassionate than anybody else as a group per se, but that when people get to know each other and understand each other nice things can happen.

I think there are probably a lot of people with Autism that have similar stories as him so it's valid, but I'm not sure the video would be so effective in helping people understand those of us who get socially confused, say the wrong things, appear to them to be scary loners, etc. etc.

On the whole I liked it though.

The W person wrote:

Of course they are real people, and why wouldn't they have a right to their voice as much an anybody else? I cannot figure out this comment except to some even disaproval of someone else idea content much cause too much pain to be able to bear. It is okay to have different opinions.

I looks to you like he doesn't have feelings? To me it is clear that he has feelings. Or maybe you are thinking people do not know you have feelings. I am keenly aware that you do.

You are like him? You look to others like you are not cognizant of your surroundings? I did not know this. If I had I would would have used even more of a kid glove in our communications, though I have always tried to be nice to you. Please share more in the future. You never know what a person is going through. A point I have made many times myself but sometimes forget to be cognizant of..

This is surely true, and psychologists, too. But sometimes people can see things that other people cannot. The thing I did not like is that I somehow got the idea they were implying something I cannot quite put my finger on. I have already thought quite a bit about this video which I saw a few days ago. I am still processing it. Again, the main thing that stands out to me is the playing of the autism card, though it is obvious these people are not aware they are doing that.

I do not think people learn this kind of thing from watching a video, plus the autistic card angle can create a subtle backlash--I do not know how much in this particular case, but there seems to be some kind of under the surface guilt trip.. People are pretty smart.and keenly sensitive to that kind of thing.

Agreed about the nice things can happen, but behind the message of thid video is a kind of exclusive about being autistic. The gist is that autistic people are more compassionate that other people. Bull-sh*t.

I do not get this comment..In the sense that if it is even one person's story it is valid in terms of giving his story as he perceives it--there does not have to be a clump of people with a similar story. .Also it is not even exactly his story---it seems kind of his parent's story-- .there's a sadness there. I really feel for these parents and wish I knew more about them and their son. I will try to google them.

I liked it in the sense that it can be used as a learning tool, though I do not see it the way they intended it. I am very interested in this playing the autism card thing as I believe it is harmful to humanity, and this video seems to me to be a good illustration of this, though others may not see it this way.So because of this I do not like it, but in the sense that it can be used as a learning tool I like it. I keep thinking he picked this up view about autistics being more compassionate from somewhere....someone fed it to him....maybe on wrong planet. It is a trend and tendency among many, though fortunately not all, to think this way and to feed this nonsense to other people, especially young people. The good part is that he was imagining himself and others being compassionate...I would like to write more but have to go to the laundromat right now....

(Be sure to quote this in your message if you care to reply to it, as when I read it again later today or tomorrow I will be editing for typos. xoxoxo)

p.s. I just came back from the laundry, reread this and edited some content in order to amplify what I am trying to say.

I can't respond to this, I made a New Year's resolution not to get into dumb arguments. Besides, this is Jen's thread, she's trying to have a real discussion not a b*****fest between two ding dongs.

When you tell a doctor something that you were there to see, and the doctor, who wasn't there, says it never happened, it's obvious what's going on.

THAT particular doctor is a moron and should likely be sweeping floors and cleaning windows somewhere. (Or doing any type of job where he can't negatively affect another human being personally.)

Like the goon who told me autistics view other people more like objects, as having no feelings, and that since I wasn't like that it wasn't possible that I was on the spectrum.

I liked the imagery used in the quote at the end. Charging forward like bubbles coming out of a glass of soda pop, assimilating any NT encountered.

"RESISTANCE IS FUTILE!"

Yes, many doctors are like this, and many other kinds of people can be like this, too, especially people in power and with authority, and also parents, discounting other people's experience as if it doesn't exist. Personally doctors are not my favorite people, nor are the police, especially in my city where many of them are really quite corrupt, but if there is serious trouble, such as a crime, who is the first person that people call? The POlice.

Therefore one could look at the functional value of their message from the perspective of exactly what they were trying to say. I would venture it is that people do not really understand this kind of low functioning autistic...that there is a potential there. Nothing wrong with illustrating this. However it gives a message that figures inot a trend and tendency that imo is destructive to society---that all people except autistics (and also their parents, at least these parents:-) are basically like that doctor. That is not comprehensive thinking, though, again, the intention was obviously good, but the way that video was designed illustrates skipping many relevant steps to make a framework, so a form of encapsulation. All people do it. It is how the brain works, but the way they do it significant, as many wrong ideas can be factored into doing this, so it is in many way like what the doctor did. They were describing one doctor. How about all the people who helped him and gave him communication equipment? How about all the kind people they met along the way?

Also it seems fairly clear from this video, though I am not 100% sure, that she kept on seeing that same doctor after what he said. I would never have gone back if someone did that with me and my child. That would have been it.

One big question for me is why would Wally think/feel that autistics are more compasisonate than other people? That concept makes no sense. How did he get this idea in his head? I am thinking it was planted their. That is sad.

It's not sad because what you say is not true.
Wally can think for himself based on his own observations.
I think the gist of this video is that autistics can have brilliant minds and think for themselves even if other people may not perceive them that way.

How do your ideas get into your head?
Edit:
Perhaps planted there by an alien species from a far away galaxy who are intent on confusing and harming humanity?

Fascinating message. It is obvious Wally can think, is smart and a very creative writer, and I am sure that in many if not even most ways he can and does think for himself; however ideas can be and are planted in people's minds all the time--- even good ones/ the point I am writing from as a social scientist is roup think can affect people. Yeah, he may have had experiences of compassion from many autistic people and so come to this conclusion which makes sense to him from his own experience.. And also, what he wrote could be considered a form of literary device. That is acceptable. Anyway, from the angle I am looking at it, it is sad to me, and I acknowledge I have no real evidence his thinking was influenced by other autistic people.. It just seems to me it probably was. And the ideas that autistic people have more compassion than the average jJoe or so-called nt is to me ridiculous.

Personally I am a big poetry lover, but tend to look at the value of a poem more from its idea content than creative imagery alone. so to me from that poem alone, his thinking is kind of skewed, though it is understandable how it could be, as his experience is probably kind of limited..

I am not sure if you standing up for all of these autistic people in the way I have seen you doing, and I know it is heart felt and well meant, it is really helping them. To me it is a subtle form of enabling. After all, these people can think for themselves, according to the argument you seem to be making for Wally. The one thing I did get out of your message is the idea that he could have come to this understanding from his own (probably limited) world experience. I suppose that is possible, but again, I doubt it, and I think the basic concept of autistics being more compassionate should be refuted, even though it may not be popular to do so..

His father said "His world is a lot larger than what ours is.".
Disabled people aren't limited in world experience and have the added experience of being disabled.

Littlebee, Your words can sting. Be careful where you point your stinger.

Yes, I mentioned this in my original message but edited it out before I posted it, as it was too complex to talk about, so would just convolute things, but note this was his father's subjective opinion, and very real to him, just as your opinion is very real to you and my opinion is very real to me, and his world may very well be larger than the world of his parents.I personally define scope (world largeness) as a person's understanding about the nature of physical reality as it relates to having the mind of compassion and how greatly that compassion is amplified by the understanding he has..

This is contextual and would depend on various factors, wouldn't it? For instance a person home alone with a caretaker most of the time might have less life experience than a person working with the general public all day long. Or if his caretakers were mean he might extrapolate that most other people were like that, and if his caretakers were compassionate he might extrapolate about other people from that angle. So if he met a bunch of autistic people who were nice to him, that being their sole aim, to be nice, as he represented to them a part of themselves that was not accepted by others, then he might extrapolate that autistic people are nicer than other people.(Not intending to discount the value of people trying to be nice to him). This is what I mean by limited experience. And I used the word probably.

This I definitely agree with. Good point. Yes, being disabled could amplify his world view.

Marybird, I am a honey maker. Yes, bees can sting, but I have literally no idea of what you are talking about in regard to the above message. You seem to be making a veiled threat to me, and I have no idea why. And no, it is not because I am an autistic (or as you called me, an alien from another planet) that I don't understand why. It is because you are not telling me why and expect me to just know. Sometimes people understand things differently, and the best way to communicate is to explain to them. This is what I am trying to do when I communicate with you. I am thinking that maybe you are considering me to be stinging this person Wally and/or his parents, but imo they are almost surely not reading this, and even so, I don't see that I said anything that would sting them, so it must be what I wrote about enabling. .But what I wrote there is to me a profoundly important point. I have been writing on the internet on this subject for many years and am passionate about it.

Or could it be what I said that I said the idea that autistics are more compassionate (meaning more compassionate than the general population) should be refuted? Are you saying I should be careful not to point my stinger at autistics? I really have no idea what you are talking about. This is enquiry. People are supposed to give their ideas. Communication is supposed to change people---not just other people, but me, too, and it is changing me. You already misread my words on another thread and it created a big two page drama and ate up a lot of energy, for me, at least. It was very upsetting and I had to go back and reread a lot of material in order to be able to wort it all out, and then when you realized you read it wrong you acknowledged.that, and I read things wrong, too, but I am wondering if you are reading something different here than what is intended. I am not on WP to sting people, but to make honey. I have a great love for people.And if I have some wrong idea I am here to learn about that and change the way I am thinking, but people have to present some kind of intellectual evidence in the form of logic. I cannot just go on feeling alone. Sometimes people think they are protecting their brother and really feel passionate about it, and the cause could be genuine, but sometimes the way logic about reality works is false and people who consider themselves to be authority are wrong and there is killing lots of killing, mass killing because of this. And no, I am not calling anyone here a killer, but just saying that going on emotion alone is not enough and that skipping steps in thinking does not make something true. (However, when a person has real understanding, then it is possible to skip lots of steps, but people think they have complete understanding when they do not.)

I do think it helps for people to share their feelings. I know you care about Wally. That is obvious. Well, so do I. It comes back to the idea of enabling. I do not need to protect his feeling because I consider him my equal. If he has (what I consider to be) a wrong idea about reality, I believe I can express that to him. I do not believe every person on WP who is in entrenched in this imo ridiculous autistic versus nt dichotomy picked it up on his own because he can think for himself. I believe a lot of it is a product of immature thinking and wrong ideas about reality often fueled by group think. I do not really know if Wally picked it up from other autistics, but I suspect that is a factor. I have seen quite a few comment and even threads in the short time I have been on WP on this theme that if autistics ruled the world it would be a better place.. A silly but understandable fantasy for people who have been bullied or feel inferior to have. However it should be looked at. This is how people grow.


(I have coirrected three typos in your quote, one of them being I had left the g off the word group. but will leave them in the original message)..

Where did Jen go, I was wondering what she thought of the video - she never told us.

Regarding Wally and the "only Autistics are compassionate," thing -- I think his fantasy should maybe not be taken so literally. Sometimes when we want to think of the future, to comfort ourselves we dream on those grand scales. I don't think he really meant every individual person with Autism is more compassionate than every individual "NT." I think what he meant was more like the Civil Rights movement where the African Americans did band to together to teach compassion and understanding, but not in such a segregated way. It was an African American Movement to be sure, but it included people of many races (well of course in their case they were trying to end segregation). For instance, his parents are not Autistic and he probably doesn't think they need to be taught compassion.

Anyway, having said that, I do agree that some Autistic people have an "NT's are not as good people as we are" attitude, and I find it baffling. I'm guessing in most cases they also don't really mean all people without Autism, but you never know.

And I do think that because of our Autism some of us see a side of society that others don't see or won't see which is hurtful. So in once sense when people say "NTs" aren't as compassionate, they might very well just mean the people that have been cruel to them. I'm just guessing though. Society does often accept cruelty to its members that are at least perceived as being weaker, but not all individuals go along with that. I think that's Wally's point - that society needs to be more understanding, not that each and every person without Autism does. And that because he has experienced the problem first hand (along with many other Autistics), he and they can help people understand and resolve the problem.