People That 'Don't' Work?

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There's something related to intelligence stuck on my mind right now. My whole life I've come across individuals that claim to 'have done no work', and their comments are often proceeded by with fantastic results in whatever it is they were talking about. From what I've noticed, these people tend to be the ones that downplay their achievements as well, i.e. 'my drawing is so bad' when in reality they know it's good.

I can't get a grasp on this. At times it really makes me feel inadequate because I know that if I'm going to learn something, for example maths related, then I have to at least read, and more often than not complete an example based on each formula.. I can't just know how to do something without having seen it before. In year 12 last year this was commonplace. I went to a select entry school (there's 4 in my state) and I literally did almost nothing. I'd essentially teach myself the material for very limited hours in the night before each major assessment and the only class I completed homework for was psychology. I expected that in the majority of cases others would receive better marks than I did, and that was mostly true, but so many claimed that they 'did no work' and it REALLY annoyed me. Remembering it all now is greatly bothering me.

How could anyone have possibly worked less than I did ('no work'), receiving a far better mark? How could they somehow magically know all the material? How can you be aware of something without learning it? These people aren't savants, but it is actually possible that someone can just somehow know everything without working in the slightest?

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In terms of intelligence I haven't ever taken an authentic IQ test but on a career report that I took (which resembled an IQ test to an extent, measured me up against private and selective school students) my reasoning/verbal/numerical/perceptual skills were in the highest category (in the top 1-10% or so, not counting below 1%). My visual and mechanical skills are relatively atrocious though and in this case were the top 30% or so. I could have potentially gotten better, and I excluded some other result fields (such as manual speed) as I wasn't taking it seriously. I'm looking through it right now and these are the approximate results:

+ Reasoning - ~Top 1-5%
+ Verbal - ~Top 5-10%
+ Numerical - ~Top 1-5%
+ Perceptual - ~Top 1-5%
+ Spatial - ~Top 30%
+ Mechanical - ~Top 10-20%

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EDIT - Removed the bottom part of this post. Adding this: Could that learning profile possibly be representative of anything, or is it standard?

Last edited by Norny on 05 Feb 2014, 12:13 am, edited 3 times in total.

It could be that they either know how to make their work look good with minimal effort, or split most of the work across a group depending on the assignment.

It could also have to do with certain skills - I for one have terrible organization skills, so I had a hard time keeping up with assignments in the classes, despite the fact that I could very well demonstrate that I knew the material in a clear and effective manner.

Could be the way they are interpreting the word work. I got A grades (mostly...I did get a C as well) at University and don't consider myself as having done much work for the following reasons:

1 I love studying and learning new things. When I am not studying formally, I study for my own pleasure at home so its not really work to me. It's fun. I'm not working I am having fun. I especially enjoy research and can even enjoy note taking. It's not that I didn't do anything to learn the material, on the contrary, I can spend hours reading, doing exercises, exploring and reflecting on the material..it is just that I don't consider it to be working. It is only work to learn something when I am not interested in what I am learning.

2 I spent so much time thinking about what I was learning out of the enjoyment of doing so and I had such a good memory I never had to revise for exams. I still got A grades. I don't even know how to go about exam revision as I have never done it.

3 I don't have to keep going over and over something to learn it, I can learn it pretty quickly, ergo it takes me less work to learn something than someone who has to repeatedly keeping going over and over the same thing. I only repeatedly go over things to make sure I didn't miss anything.

4 My grades were an accident. I never actually tried to get A grades or be brainy. I just loved learning and the grades kind of happened by themselves. I couldn't help it. They used to hand out sheets telling you techniques to improve your grade but I never used to read them. I just did what I felt fitted or what felt was relevant or significant or right at the time. So in that way I didn't really work either.

These days I don't really care what my intelligence level is in that way and it;s why i won't take an updated intelligence test. As I said to someone once 'I am as intelligent as I am intelligent, and that is fine by me'.

I am really more interested in being happy in life and in being able to spend some of my time learning about things I am passionate about as well as having a few adventures and gettting to experience all the things I'd like to have a go at.

For example, I want:

To learn to tap dance, to play piano (which I am presently learning), to go kayaking, to go horse riding again, to go ice skating, to have a night at the theater, to tour all the theme parks in Europe, to visit as much of the UK coastline can (in person not just via a documentary on TV), to learn to paint, to learn to draw...to find love and someone special to share laughter and everything I have learned with.

I want to own a decent telescope so I can take up astronomy

I want to learn to play the trumpet and flute

I want to learn pottery

I want to finish my Archaeology degree

I want study environmental studies and get involved in conservation

I want to make my own musical or star in one

I want to make my own 40's retro clothing and learn to sew so I can do that

I also want to learn to knit and crochet.

I want to not be lonely, right now my loneliness has left me frozen and is impairing my ability to function (wanted to go swimming this morning but the thought of another day alone made it difficult to bother getting out of bed. I don't need a lot of company but I don't like never having any social interaction either. Or more specifically I am lonely without any bonds in my life as chit chat in passing with strangers on the street does not seem to satisfy me. Something is missing from those kinds of interaction, meaning I think).

I want a partner to talk to and cuddle

I want to not be sexually frustrated

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How intelligent I am doesn't really matter to me all that much in the grand scheme of things. I didn't ask for the academic ability I got I am not really all that concerned with matters of the ego. I seem to be more driven by matters of the heart instead.

Whatever intelligence I got it was accidental and beyond my control anyway.

I can learn things somewhat faster because I tend to process information more densely than other people. Image that learning is like picking berries. Some people just pick them quickly and move onto the next bush without thinking much. Those people are the "hard workers". There is also people that berries, but check every nook and cranny before moving onto the next bush. Those people often appear to be lazy or slow compared to other people in the short term, but they often get more berries with less bushes. That is why I often struggle with getting assignments done, but can get Bs on tests I haven't studied for. I also learn a bit slower than average in a half an hour period, but learn faster than average in a one or two month period.

Your example is about learning knowledge. You described how you worked to receive certain knowledge you needed for passing a test. From your description, if you were free to choose, you would have done something else in that time, so forcing yourself instead to sit down and learn certain passages from your schoolbook was work to you.

But someone that is interested in an certain knowledge, would never refer to work as that, because of him being startled to receive that knowledge. He is spending his time for something he wants to do, just like an "Simpson" series fan would not refer as work to read about the backgroundinfos of certain simpson episodes, or an Star Wars would not refer reading Star Wars background books as work.

As well that its depends much on how complicated acchieving a certain knowledge is for you. If I need to learn something 3-4 times, until I am practically able to handle a certain knowledge, then I spend much time on memorizing only one certain kind of infomation. Which will suck far more, then someone reading it once, understanding it, maybe read it a second time in fast mode to memorize certain new words, and is done with it.

I dont think you are "stupid" about your general intelligence, I simply think that, whyever, you decided to learn something, that you were not truly interested in, so the time and effort that you needed for learning, seems in a negative way as work to you.

I do not think it is always like this

for instance, I am just naturally good at math, I don't need to put forth effort, it comes easy

however in other subject I still get very good grades because I do make an extreme effort to study

How does math come to you so easily? Has it been like this forever for you, or is it that you learned things you apply them to other more advanced things? I'm not exactly sure how it would work.

I'm really intrigued.

I think it was a defense actually, I have thought long and hard about this, I remember being virtually non-functional in math in the second grade, bottom of my class actually then my mother forced me to memorize my times tables over the summer (4 hours a day rather than play outside, she demanded scholastic perfection from me often) after that math was trivial. The year I graduated I received an award from Bank of America as the best math student in the entire Bay Area for that year.

I'm not sure if I have natural skills. I do remember getting a B on a science test even though I didn't study or even do science that term. I also could answer "difficult science questions" correctly when I was at the observatory. It seems like I'm naturally good at science even though I don't really care about science.

Well, firstly, you said you're going to a 'select entry school'. So I'm guessing the average IQ of students in your school is very high. You certainly aren't stupid, judging from your test results, but it's possible your classmates might be even smarter. Do you have scaled scores, or just percentiles? Percentiles don't distinguish well at the extreme ends.

As for whether you can know something without learning it, that depends on the subject. Schools seem to teach two kinds of knowledge:

* objective facts about reality; and
* ideas that follow logically from each other

A subject that mainly involves ideas that logically follow from each other, such as math, doesn't necessarily require learning. If you have the right kind of mind, you can think up all of known math on your own without being taught. (There was an uneducated Indian kid I heard of who did this.) Math just requires that you can think mathematically - if you can, you don't need to learn any theorems or anything because you can just prove them yourself.

Another subject like this is creative writing. Obviously, you need to know how to read and write (unless you tell stories verbally, like some cultures do/did), but once you do, it is possible to just figure out how to write good-quality creative stories without any education. Being taught helps, but it's not necessary.

Other subjects, such as sciences or history, require you to learn objective facts about the world. There's no way you can figure out from basic principles that William the Conqueror invaded in 1066 or that octopi have their brain wrapped around their esophagous. You need some sort of outside information to tell you those things. However, if you're the kind of person who easily remembers facts the first time you hear them, it's not really 'work' to learn those things. Or if you're fascinated by octopi, you may feel that learning about their neurology is play rather than work, so even though you put a lot of effort into it you don't notice the effort. (That's how I feel.)

When I say that I did no work, I mean that I did my homework, and it was easy, so it was no work for me.

I think that this is what the students at your school were saying and meaning instead of doing nothing for the class.

Maths skills were easy for me to learn once algebra started making sense. Seeing a quadratic formula as a system and being able to visualize the curve of 'y' versus 'x' is also a useful skill. Since mathematics is the language of science, my career choice was engineering, which is the creative expression of science (imo).

(Know the difference between an engineer and a technician? A technician solves problems; an engineer prevents problems from happening.)

Learning engineering was the easy part. Holding down two (or more) jobs to put myself through university was work -- grants only go so far, and full-ride scholarships don't usually get offered to someone who is not a basketball or football player.

When I say that I barely did any work for a subject such as maths, that means that I literally spent 4-5 years of school not looking at the textbook or working much in class until the day before each test.

Looking on some responses, others might not consider something such as maths to be work if they find it fun etc. In this case it's my personal misinterpretation of the word 'work', where I assume the literal definition that any physical/mental effort is work. Reading through and completing material, I always refer to as work. I see studying as work, regardless of the topic, even if someone finds it enjoyable - they are still working, hence why when others claim that they 'do no work' what comes to my mind is no studying, no reading, no writing. Impossible. You can't be born knowing what something like anti-differentiation is, surely. You had to have worked at it, or at least found out what it was by looking through the textbook and relating it to other functions. Perhaps you were experimenting one day because you enjoyed math and figured it out after working selectively. Fantastic, but from my point of view that is still work.

When I read through this thread and write this post I'm working. I enjoy doing it, but I'm still putting in a modicum of effort and developing a better understanding that involves integration of other's (you guys) thoughts.

EDIT - I'll use an analogy that helps me explain how I feel about this. A game developer really enjoys creating a game, but whilst doing so they are working. They may have struggles either small or large along the way, or perhaps they are doing something that they breeze through. They may get recognized for their efforts, or possibly be paid, it doesn't really matter. It is fun work.. but that's exactly what it is, work.

There are some people who are whole part learners. They read the material and they've got it, no need to study. There are people that rely on rote memorization. I'm in the latter for most verbal studies.

When it comes to drawing I can advance pretty fast after just a few brief lessons. I will stream ahead the class and not need any help from the teacher.

We've all got different skills and passions. I find math boring and I need to be on ADHD medication to do it. I used to think the same was true with learning music but because I was passionate slowly I learned how to do it.

I was good at few subjects in school but some just came easy to me because I had more of an interest in them. I was exceptional in languages and art. There were few math modules that I would be really good in but overall my math ability is below average.

I usually have to go the extra mile to get good at something not related to art. I still think of learning how to draw something new as work because of my ADHD issues. Everything to me feels like I have to put so much effort in to just concentrate and process the information.

I know someone with ADHD who said that eberrything was work for her, because she had motivation problems caused by ADHD.

I have intense motivation, organisation and apparently 'self-confidence' problems, and my mum has always pointed it out. You're a wise person. ;o