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crystalc1973
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16 Oct 2014, 3:55 pm

Have you found that when you try to copy the behavior of NTs in terms of caring about others and what goes on in their lives, when maybe you really don't care but are simply trying to be "normal" or a better person, that it just doesn't land with the people you direct it at like it does when NTs do it? That has been my experience. Accused on multiple occasions by multiple people of being a "b***h" I have tried on several occasions to show care, concern etc. for people I would consider friends. However, it seems that when I do these things, it gets ignored by the person, but when someone else says basically the same thing to them, they respond with so much gratitude. This leads me to believe that I simply suck at being nice, and maybe being a b***h just works for me and I should stick with it. I must say I am feeling disappointed in the small group of people I considered my friends and am seriously considering not renewing my friendships with them when I move back there next year. They seem like they have evolved into a shallow, selfish bunch of jerks and I wish I could find new friends, but that is simply not an easy feat for me because I mesh with so few people and am so introverted. I really wish I could just be normal sometimes, life seems so much easier that way.


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olympiadis
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16 Oct 2014, 4:19 pm

crystalc1973 wrote:
I must say I am feeling disappointed in the small group of people I considered my friends and am seriously considering not renewing my friendships with them when I move back there next year. They seem like they have evolved into a shallow, selfish bunch of jerks



You are probably correct.

I think that "nice" is a level of expertise in acting, or more accurately deception.
It is a tool of deception that is used in the maintenance of identities and hierarchies.

To me the alternative is: caring, responsible, reasonable, and just.



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16 Oct 2014, 4:48 pm

Humans are highly self-critical. Or worried/paranoid.

In my experience, if you say something they don't expect they are likely to think you're insulting them or mocking them.
Then they get mad.

In my experience, we (ASDers) are over critical of our own role in a conversation. NTs usually assume the other person is weird/wrong/bad, we don't.


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dianthus
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16 Oct 2014, 5:19 pm

crystalc1973 wrote:
...when maybe you really don't care...


People can tell when it's not genuine.



auntblabby
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16 Oct 2014, 8:44 pm

people notice, but it should also be said that most people ain't that bright and can't tell that the person putting on the act is at least trying to be civil.



hollowmoon
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16 Oct 2014, 8:56 pm

crystalc1973 wrote:
Have you found that when you try to copy the behavior of NTs in terms of caring about others and what goes on in their lives, when maybe you really don't care but are simply trying to be "normal" or a better person, that it just doesn't land with the people you direct it at like it does when NTs do it? That has been my experience. Accused on multiple occasions by multiple people of being a "b***h" I have tried on several occasions to show care, concern etc. for people I would consider friends. However, it seems that when I do these things, it gets ignored by the person, but when someone else says basically the same thing to them, they respond with so much gratitude. This leads me to believe that I simply suck at being nice, and maybe being a b***h just works for me and I should stick with it. I must say I am feeling disappointed in the small group of people I considered my friends and am seriously considering not renewing my friendships with them when I move back there next year. They seem like they have evolved into a shallow, selfish bunch of jerks and I wish I could find new friends, but that is simply not an easy feat for me because I mesh with so few people and am so introverted. I really wish I could just be normal sometimes, life seems so much easier that way.


i have the same problem.. its probably your non verbals



auntblabby
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16 Oct 2014, 8:57 pm

ah, the infamous "uncanney valley" syndrome. :alien:



olympiadis
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16 Oct 2014, 9:03 pm

dianthus wrote:
crystalc1973 wrote:
...when maybe you really don't care...


People can tell when it's not genuine.


But they make as many mistakes in reading us as we make in reading them.

"Genuine" should not be a label assigned for great acting, but the result of logical deduction of things that can be proven, - not the person's stated intent.



crystalc1973
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16 Oct 2014, 9:06 pm

The thing is, that much of this kind of thing happens on facebook, where the only communication is written. I don't have much other contact with people besides my husband in the real world because I work online and stay home day after day. So it's just weird that people I thought were my friends appreciate when someone else wishes them a happy birthday for instance, but when I do, it's like "meh"....which makes me wonder why I even bother.


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auntblabby
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16 Oct 2014, 9:09 pm

^^^
then again, a lot of people simply lack good manners. the people who don't gracefully handle a compliment/salutation are one example.



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17 Oct 2014, 9:59 am

Quote:
This leads me to believe that I simply suck at being nice


The word "nice" is interesting. The etymology is from the Latin I believe for having no thoughts. In a way it is similar to how people view those who are ret*d. If you are viewed as safe and non-threatening, you might be considered "nice".

There are many people who need a social cocoon of BS so that they can function. If you fail to provide the BS or provide it inadequately, you can be perceived of as a disruptor of the peace.

Aspies frequently function best with little or no BS.

Consider Hollywood. If you ever actually say what you think about someone, you will be shunned and never work again. As a result, you get the phony "air kiss" greetings, the gushing obsequious drivel, and life as non-stop performance.

Alcoholics have a code phrase to identify each other in social situations because they often need to offer each other support. Maybe Aspies should have a code so that we could recognize each other such as, "Are you a friend of NOBS?"



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17 Oct 2014, 11:08 am

timf wrote:
Quote:
This leads me to believe that I simply suck at being nice


The word "nice" is interesting. The etymology is from the Latin I believe for having no thoughts. In a way it is similar to how people view those who are ret*d. If you are viewed as safe and non-threatening, you might be considered "nice".


Yes, the word "nice" originally meant being foolish or stupid. Empty headed. Silly.

The word has gone through many different variations of meaning through the centuries, but it almost always has a connotation of emptiness, lacking substance.



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17 Oct 2014, 12:03 pm

When I was little I noticed that NTs joked & teased when they were expressing concern or trying to be nice. At least that's what I was told when I told the teacher they were bullying me. Yet when I tried to copy that to fit in & be nice I got accused of bullying because the way I did it didn't come out rite.


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17 Oct 2014, 1:35 pm

I have gotten people mad at me online and in real life for trying to be nice and being told to mind my own business. But I never turned anyone away when they would show concern for me or ask what is wrong. I just cut back being nice and rather I am a nice person or not is up for the person to decide. Once they know me, they might think of me as a nice person.


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olympiadis
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17 Oct 2014, 1:36 pm

timf wrote:
There are many people who need a social cocoon of BS so that they can function. If you fail to provide the BS or provide it inadequately, you can be perceived of as a disruptor of the peace.

Aspies frequently function best with little or no BS.


YES

A failure to serve identity and/or hierarchy brings out the punisher.



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17 Oct 2014, 3:08 pm

I've had people react that way to me, but I always assume it's just that they didn't like me much to begin with - like, they're hanging out with me out of pity or to make it look like they have more friends, but they have so little respect for me my "niceness" means nothing or even is an insult to them. Like, say I complement them: if they think I'm an idiot, a complement from me might make them question themselves. Or interest in their lives might just annoy them.