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ASPartOfMe
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04 May 2015, 9:42 pm

http://www2.forbes.com/leadership/10-worst-body-language-mistakes/

I have done/do them them all on a regular basis. Most commentators were critical of the article for being USA centric. Problem is I live in USA.


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05 May 2015, 3:48 am

So I shouldn't have stuck my middle finger up at my manager's boss?

FUUUUUCCKKKK.


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GiantHockeyFan
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05 May 2015, 7:27 am

10 for 10! 11 for 10 if you count the handshake one twice. Live in Canada but that's close enough. Ugh.



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05 May 2015, 7:53 am

Ridiculous. Anyone who believes the motivations for behaviour are this simplistic whether NT or otherwise should definitely not be working in human resources. Take eye contact, since we're on wrong planet - obviously, avoiding eye contact does not mean you're deceitful or disrespectful if you are autistic. Or from an Indian or Middle Eastern background where direct eye contact may be disrespectful between age or gender groups, maybe you're a child from an abusive upbringing where direct eye contact was considered "cheek" and punished, or countless other complicated reasons.


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Jacoby
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05 May 2015, 8:25 am

Well other than the handshake and invading other people's space, it seems my body language is pretty terrible. I don't think I could change even if I tried at this point.



ASPartOfMe
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05 May 2015, 10:02 am

C2V wrote:
Ridiculous. Anyone who believes the motivations for behaviour are this simplistic whether NT or otherwise should definitely not be working in human resources. Take eye contact, since we're on wrong planet - obviously, avoiding eye contact does not mean you're deceitful or disrespectful if you are autistic. Or from an Indian or Middle Eastern background where direct eye contact may be disrespectful between age or gender groups, maybe you're a child from an abusive upbringing where direct eye contact was considered "cheek" and punished, or countless other complicated reasons.


Problem is they do think that way and that is why so many autistics are un and underemployed and ABA practitioners are employed.


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05 May 2015, 11:21 am

Who_Am_I wrote:
So I shouldn't have stuck my middle finger up at my manager's boss?

FUUUUUCCKKKK.


Clearly the culturally-appropriate thing to do was s**t on their desk.



GiantHockeyFan
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05 May 2015, 11:29 am

C2V wrote:
Ridiculous. Anyone who believes the motivations for behaviour are this simplistic whether NT or otherwise should definitely not be working in human resources.

But they do and that's the problem! The sad fact is that I have had a few job offers rescinded once I met the HR person, one even saying it was clear I was "not interested" despite how I practically hounded them for an interview. I have this theory after seeing what happened to a colleague that HR intentionally hires morons to justify their existence.

Same reason why in my experience airport security is FAR easier now since they are so much better trained than in the past and don't believe silliness like no eye contact means you might be a terrorist. Nothing worse than an untrained, inexperienced gatekeeper!



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05 May 2015, 5:02 pm

I think the only reason these might be called "body language mistakes" is because the people who interpret things this way are making a mistake.

All this instructional stuff should be oriented towards getting people to loosen up their weird interpretations of body language, rather than telling people how to conform to the most common interpretations.



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05 May 2015, 5:46 pm

HR people and managers are trained to look for these "mistakes" even though a lot of people do these things for various reasons. They're fallacies, but it's good to know what interviewers are looking for.



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05 May 2015, 6:11 pm

Can see a real opening for a badge maker here -

Picture of face looking to the side
"Eye contact is not my thing
Your understanding is appreciated"



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06 May 2015, 1:29 am

This is what really gets to me about living in a world full of "normal" people.

Apparently committing any of these body language mistakes, which may be a simple as holding one's frame at a slightly diagonal angle, is commonly regarded as a cardinal sin because the "normals" are more intolerant of any deviation from their social code than they will readily admit, yet walking around mindlessly regurgitating whatever fallacies years of childhood social-programming have attempted to ingrain in us without ever daring to question them is generally regarded as a sign of a good upbringing.

Sometimes I like to imagine families of aliens on other planets laughing as they huddle around their holo-devices watching documentaries of this amusing species called "humans".



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06 May 2015, 2:23 am

Wow I am guilty of so many of those...lol. I do like how it has the visual representations though. But yeah some of those are things people have pointed out to me. The eye contact thing may be hard to solve, it just makes me so uncomfortable to look people in the eye when I don't know them well and seems to make it hard to focus on what they say. And I have had low energy lately can't help walking around dazed....so much insomnia.


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06 May 2015, 10:42 am

It's a wonder why so many aspies are misunderstood so we must remember to not do these things, think of it as a rule. I thought looking at your watch was a sign that you are anxious to get going because you need to be somewhere at a certain time.


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06 May 2015, 1:45 pm

Wow, they have no idea what they are talking about...

Not making eye contact is not a sign of deception. A better signal for deception is eye contact with periodic glances away towards the preferred hand accompanied by a sudden increase in blinking.
Despite that, such signalling is not universal. Some people have even mastered the art of exploiting nonverbal signalling - some to the point that they can cheat a polygraph by controlling their physiological changes. Many life events, cultural norms, and whatnot, all changes the potential signalling. People who grew up in families that moved a lot between areas of different cultures tend to have more "trouble" with eye contact. Autism and Schizoid PD also influence eye contact - I'm sure other things do as well.


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elysian1969
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06 May 2015, 2:19 pm

Jacoby wrote:
Well other than the handshake and invading other people's space, it seems my body language is pretty terrible. I don't think I could change even if I tried at this point.


Agreed. If anything I avoid other people's space as a courtesy. I absolutely loathe those who think they're being "friendly" when they get in my face, sneak right up close behind me, or worse, touch me without warning. I like a distance of three feet or more (out of reach...) if I am dealing with someone other than a close friend or blood relative. I find having my space invaded by non-intimates to be disarming and intimidating, and not at all "friendly."

I know there are huggy-kissy people out there who think that fingering strangers and getting in people's faces is perfectly acceptable- (I grew up in a big, loud family of them, and all that group groping still drives me quite apeshit) and maybe for some it is, but NOT for me. Too much of that business makes me physically ill. A simple handshake is fine, but if I don't know you very well, please do not try to hug, touch or otherwise make physical contact with me. It's just plain unnerving.

As far as eye contact goes, I do avoid it. I'm not lying or hiding anything, it just freaks me out. It actually helped me when in my late 30s I went back to wearing glasses from wearing contacts for years. Glasses offer a little something to hide behind, as they help mask deficiencies with the use of eye contact.

I think most of us on the spectrum have difficulty with body language precisely because we are travelers in a world that isn't made for us. I know I am probably much more guarded out in public and in dealing with others than most NTs, because I have to be. I miss a lot of cues that others just internalize, so I have to be more vigilant, hence the guarded postures. :heart: :skull:


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