Asperger's & IQ Test

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My son is in third grade and we'd like him to get an IQ test. Does anyone have any experience on what type of IQ test works the best for someone with Asperger's?

You sure there wasn't an IQ test done when he was diagnosed? That was just part of the battery of tests they gave me to come to the diagnosis. Of course, I was DXd as an adult, so no doubt the procedure is different, but the document I have that covers the diagnosis also references IQ. You might check with the professional who did the original DX. They may already have that information on file.

i am an adult and don't have kids but maybe this article will give you some pointers:
http://autism.about.com/od/whatisautism/a/IQTesting.htm
good luck

Keep the score away from his school if you can. If he scores high, they will say he is "too smart" for services he needs; if he scores low, they'll underestimate him and overlook his skills. Seriously, people put way too much stock by IQ, especially considering that when you measure an autistic person's IQ, it doesn't connect with their actual abilities even half as well as it does for a typical person (which isn't a very strong connection to begin with). But do insist on the full report, and if necessary, have the different subskills that were being tested explained to you. Most likely your son's subtests will show strengths and weaknesses (if there wasn't an input/output, concentration, or communication issue blocking accuracy), and that profile can be useful in a way that the overall number generally isn't.

I had the WISC administered to me as a child of about ten years old. I had no problems with communication during testing, since the instructions were straightforward and there was no expectation to engage in a back-and-forth conversation beyond answering questions. I remember finding some of the tasks very difficult and others childishly easy--most likely the test came out as a scattered skill profile. With a more recent adult test, I got to look at the results and found a similar scatter, with the gaps between the percentiles as large as fifty points.

Willard, ASgirl and Callista, thanks for your responses.

He did not have an IQ test as part of his eval. We are looking to get one done as part of us setting up a 504 program for him at his school. He is currently receiving some assistance but we want more. He is bright (as his teachers have pointed out) but he has a hard time keeping focus on doing his work (he also has ADHD). It is our hope that if he tests with a high IQ, yet is getting Cs, that will help our argument. The Ravens Matrices test is the only one I've found mentioned for Aspergers and it's gotten mixed reviews. Didn't know if there were any other types out there that worked well.

You may want to call a neurophysiology type Dr's office. The one I was assessed at had a Dr on staff that did nothing but administer a score IQ tests.

Is there an option to get him tested through the school? When I was in 2nd grade, the school paid for an IQ test when I was being evaluated for learning disabilities (long before AS was in the books).

They gave me the WEICHS after the Dx for Asperger's. The results are given as percentiles as to "spatial" and "verbal." My spatial scores were below average and my verbal scores were high.

That was the first explanation I ever saw as to why I'm such a clever person for words and completely useless with gadgets or other daily things that 'normal' people find easy.

First off, definitely heed Callista's advice about getting the full report and an explanation from the psychiatrist about the meaning of the different subscores. Also, Callista had a good point about not letting anyone put too much stock in the test.

Autistics tend on average to do better on the Raven's Matrices test than on, say, the Stanford-Binet or the Wechsler, probably because the latter two lean extremely heavily on verbal communication which is often a problem for those on the specturm. A pretty solid body of evidence suggests that the Raven test is, in general, a better and more reliable measure than the other tests, but it also measures only one area, which gives you a less complete view. The new edition of the Wechsler includes a section that's more or less plagiarized from Raven's, so you can get an idea of what he would score on the Raven's test while still getting other subscores. For instance, I did well on the matrix reasoning (the part copied from Raven) as well as analogies, vocabulary, and general knowledge, but I scored abysmally on block design, symbol search, and processing speed. Because of this, it was recognized that I have problems with sensory processing, which has resulted in my being able to take exams separately from the rest of the class in a quiet room. It would not have been possible to conclude that this was necessary only on the basis of Raven's matrices.

tl;dr version: Have him take the Wechsler test, look at the matrix reasoning subscore if you personally want a reasonable estimate of what his overall score "should" be.

Is the Raven is reliable for asperger, or is it some kind of "overscored" as it said that on it autists use extra area of the brain?

Just wanted to point out that the Matrix Reasoning subtest on the current Wechsler really isn't THAT new. The second WAIS I took was in 1997 and the Matrix Reasoning subtest was included on that. With two exceptions (one being low average and the other being superior...go figure) my scores on both Matrix Reasoning and Raven's have always been squarely within the average range. I also score very high on analogies (I THINK you are referring to the "Similarities" subtest on the Verbal portion of WAIS) vocabulary, general knowledge ("Information" subtest) and reading comprehension. My worst scores are ALWAYS in block design and object assembly which is very common for people with NVLD. I score in the low average range in block design and often in the impaired range on object assembly.


While we are on the subject....the results of my Raven's matrices test were placed in the Executive functioning section of one of my neuropsych evals. Does anyone know why this is exactly? I was under the impression that Raven's was a test of non-verbal reasoning very much akin to block design on WAIS. What does it have to do with executive functioning?

Furthermore....I scored VERY low on the Category test (<1st percentile or "impaired" range) which is definitely considered a measure of executive functioning. What does a score this low suggest about my cognitive abilities? I've read that people with low scores on the Category test often complain of "memory problems". Memory problems would be one of my primary life-long complaints in regards to my cognitive deficits. I have read hundreds, if not thousands of books in my life. But I remember little or nothing about the subject material in any of them. This seems to be the case no matter how well I comprehend the material and no matter how many times i've read the same thing. It's as though everything falls out of my brain like a sieve. My interest in the subject material doesn't matter either. I feel like i've literally learned nothing even if I fully comprehend a subject while actually reading it. All this and I can manage to beat most people at "Jeopardy"....even ones with far more formal education than myself. All I have is an AA in Liberal Arts and I had to opt for course substitutions in math even to get that unspeakably ridiculous scrap of paper. Nevertheless...aside from below average scores for visual memory (which is common among NLD-ers) my scores on all the memory tests (like Weschler memory scale) are average or better. But how well do these tests REALLY measure LONG TERM memory? My scores on the Information subtest on WAIS have always been in the 90-something %. This subtest is supposedly a good indicator of one's Long-Term memory. I feel like the world's greatest neurological mystery. Nothing makes sense.....everything is incongruous when it comes to my brain. I don't have anything in common even with people whose neuropsych evals are a damn-near mirror image of my own. It just seems like I have profound and very specific impairments in semantic, procedural and episodic memory. Developmental amnesia (Hypoxia is often, if not always, the cause of DA. Memory is very much dependent on the Hippocampus and that part of the brain is very sensitive to oxygen deprivation) is often the cause of impairments in episodic memory but semantic memory is usually, though not always, left intact. I see no evidence to suggest I suffered from Hypoxia as an infant though and hypoxic episodes are usually easy to detect. ( I THINK???)

Well.....I have yet another neuropsych evaluation coming up soon. This will be the sixth one i've had in my life. I recently re-applied for services through OVR. My last eval was over 3 years ago and OVR needs a more recent one. I hardly believe another on-paper neuropsych eval will tell me anything I don't already know. According to all the other evals i've had...my overall cogntive abilities are anywhere from the high average to very superior range depending on the particular evaluation. I already know my neuropsychological profile fits the pattern of *classic* NVLD and I share this profile (with some insignificant differences of course) with MILLIONS who have been infinitely more successful in life than I have. In just about every area of life, I literally function at a level you would expect from a mildly mentally ret*d person. That said... solely based on these test results....what I already know (as well as what the professionals who've tested me THINK they know) seems to be of no importance whatsoever. Rather....it's what I don't know about my brain and this uncharted territory within my skull is a source of inexpressible torment. There is nothing pleasant about having "occult" neurological deficits. My brain is like the iceberg the Titanic struck. The bulk of the problem lies below the surface, defying my own understanding and that of every psychologist i've ever seen. I spend hours online everyday trying to learn about every possible thing that could go wrong with the human brain and I STILL have no answers. I ought to be on Discovery health's "mystery diagnosis". I really feel like one of these people who returns from the amazon with some rare malady which baffles every doctor they see. The story always seems to be the same with such people. Left with no answers from the professionals, they spend eons on the internet and FINALLY discover one case which sounds exactly like their own. Then they find out they suffer from some brain-eating fungus endemic to a few acres of Brazil's green hell and they locate the one Dr. in the world who knows anything about it.

What an absurd universe this is. In the face of all it, i'll never understand how billions of people still maintain a belief in an all-loving god.


"And you fill their souls...with all oppressions of this world. And all the glory you receive"?!?!?!?!?!?

Morbid Angel

Anyway... adolescent existential angst aside.....my case worker at OVR told me they MAY be able cover the expenses of neurological testing (which may include a SPECT scan and/or an fMRI) IF the psychologist i'll be seeing deems it necessary. I don't care if I have to offer this psychologist my eternal soul, i'm going to do everything in my power to convince them that it is necessary. If I must live with mysterious neuropsychological deficits which have stolen every dream, hope, aspiration, chance at omniscience, etc.....I ever had, then at least i'd like an answer to the mystery if I can do nothing about the deficits themselves. I feel alien to every other human i've ever encountered on this earth...personally or otherwise. The only thing I seem to have in common (psychologically speaking of course) with other humans is my burning desire to know the answer to every "why". Especially "whys" which have a major personal impact on us.


But alas.....knowing my luck....even an answer to this most important of all whys will be too much to ask.

*sighs*

I would expect a better score seen your post.

Strictly in comparison to all my other abilities (or more accurately.... lack thereof) I can write well and I come off as articulate when I talk.

These two abilities often create an "illusion of competence" in the eyes of people who read my writings and/or speak to me.

If there is such a thing as general intelligence, then I believe i'm generally intellectually disabled in spite of the aforementioned.


Raven's and tests like it are said to be heavily "G-loaded". That is.....they're supposedly good indicators of one's general intelligence.

But the *rules* can break down when you're talking about people with autistic spectrum disorders (i'm including NLD here) who often display alot of "scatter" on IQ tests.

Regardless of which test we're talking about (Raven's, WAIS, etc....) I don't think any IQ test is a 100% trustworthy measure of one's overall cognitive abilities. Again....this is especially true when it comes to those on the spectrum. Most autistics seem to perform much better on Raven's (and similar tests) then they do on the WAIS. The operative term here though is "most". I would imagine the opposite is true when it comes to many with Nonverbal learning disabilities and that would include many people with Asperger's. My scores are ALWAYS in the superior-very superior range on the verbal section of WAIS. My VIQ was 155 on the most recent WAIS I took (PIQ was 111...still in the high average range) but I think this is a gross overestimate of my overall intelligence.

I say this only because most psychologists consider the Verbal Comprehension Index to be the best indicator of general intelligence ON THE WESCHLER TESTS. The VCI generally conforms to one's scores on the verbal subtests of WAIS.

VCI/VIQ is also supposed to the best predicator of one's academic potential.


In my personal case however....my life-long experiences IN THE REAL WORLD seem to totally contradict all of this.


How "intelligent/academically-gifted" can a person TRULY be if they were HOPELESS at anything having to do mathematics?

Well...maybe very intelligent/gifted IF they were good at several other things... but I wasn't. I was equally horrible in art, computers, formal logic, industrial arts, music and science.

That being the case....at what point can we define someone as unintelligent? How many things do they have to suck at before it's legitimate to call them stupid?

My only island of ability (academically and otherwise) seems to be in areas which are strictly verbal/language-based (like philosophy, sociology, english and history) in nature. And I even crap out at the higher levels of those subjects.

In short......my IQ scores (especially VIQ/VCI) are the ONLY thing which suggest my overall intelligence is at least in the average range. How meaningful are a few numbers on a piece of paper in comparison with my experiences in school, the jobs i've held, my nonexistent talents, skills, etc...?

And if you haven't guessed by now....these circumstances aren't exactly conducive to the slightest degree of happiness in my case.

I may not be intelligent.....but I value intelligence far more than any other human quality. That said.....it would be a bit obnoxious for anyone to expect me to be happy. Sure many intellectually disabled people are happy in spite of their limitations....I just don't happen to be among them.

perhaps you are just depressed. if you have such low self esteem than i wonder how you view those of us you are only in the average or high average range. here is a piece of info that will make you feel better, there was a 97 percentile split between my highest and lowest score on the wisc, due to sensory stuff.

back to the topic that the first speaker brought up, since this thread is really supposed to be answering his question, i would not worry about your son's iq scores, since by definition those with a.s. have to have average intelligence, then he most likely will not get a low score even if his subscores may be uneven. if they are, try to figure out why, and consider the effect of sensory things. also expect the verbal iq to be slightly higher since most people with a.s./adhd have higher viq's than piq's due to the processing speed index on the performance scale.

Last edited by petitesouris on 27 Mar 2010, 10:14 am, edited 2 times in total.

It's not only your verbal facility, it's also the way you thinking and and analysing. If you were intellectually retarted you wouldn't be able to think like that.

I know someone on another forum who got very high scores on verbal section, but he's low on perfomance sections.

He's VERY SMART, wise beyond his years and definitelly intellectualy gifted. He's bad in art and in math too. (But not in music, computer, formal logic and science though.)

You shouldn't sell your intelligence short because you have difficulty functionning either.

The main problem it's difficult to get true result of IQ test with asperger's because you can try test twice and get 85 and 115. It's more than standart deviation and no one know why. Also you can train your brain in logic or another task's to get better results. For example play it: https://itunes.apple.com/app/apple-stor ... _link&mt=8

I took 2 IQ tests 20 years apart and got the exact same number!

IQ results are not a straight line. Or maybe they are for NTs, I don't know. But mine wobbles above and below Average, sort of like a wave, and when we get to Verbal it spikes right off the top of the page, and then goes back to wobbling around Average again.

When I saw that I finally understood why I'm so good at some things and so hopeless at others. I call myself an egghead who can't boil an egg. (Really - I can't boil an egg - it drove Mom crazy.)