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Deinonychus
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19 May 2023, 4:43 am

Does anyone else have problems with LED lights? I particularly can't stand these new LED street lights that My city has been installing since summer of 2020. The new street lights have a blindingly bright white light that is emitted from them as apposed to the old style that had a warm darkish orange glow to them. It has taken me 3 years to get use to it and I still hate them. If you cannot drive at night without what is in essence stadium lights lighting the road you should not be driving a car at night period.



Fnord
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19 May 2023, 5:56 am

A significant portion of the energy that went into those old-style street lights came out as heat.

A much greater portion of the energy that goes into LED street lights comes out as visible light.

LED lighting is more efficient, thus more cost-effective.  It also lasts longer between replacements.



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19 May 2023, 5:59 am

LED lights can be made in a range of temperatures (blue vs. yellow tint). The problem isn't inherent to LEDs, it's really a matter of the choice of LEDs.


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19 May 2023, 6:54 am

Is a problem and a safety issue. The rural crossroads where the occasional street light was placed were often in areas of poor visibility so seeing other cars coming was crucial. The orange light helped with this as one had good view of the area and could tell if a car was coming or not before one pulled out.
Now it is guesswork as the bright white streetlights hide a cars lights even if they are at full beam, so with these poorly visible junctions and crossroads it is only a matter of time before a major accident takes place.
Also they have fitted Led type bulbs in traffic lights at pedestrian crossings and at night, as one passes these bright green lights, no way can one see if a pedestrian is waiting on the pavement at the crossing... So if someone goes to run across when the lights are green there is no way one will see them. With the old crossing lights one could see if someone was on the crossing as one was not being blinded by the green light. (On red one is stopping anyway so it does not matter).

These white streetlights should not be placed at rural junctions at all, and to prevent accidents it is urgent that the green and yellow on traffic lights should be dulled so that motorists are not blinded by them.
The new white streetlights are a bit pointless in some places as if one passes at night in some areas the light in front is turned off so the cameras inside the light fixture can see you, so the area one is is dark, and this happens a light at a time which is absolutely pointless! Why don't they have external cameras instead? (Can tell the ones with cameras inside them as they have little arials on top of the light itself.



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Deinonychus
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19 May 2023, 6:41 pm

Fnord wrote:
A significant portion of the energy that went into those old-style street lights came out as heat.

A much greater portion of the energy that goes into LED street lights comes out as visible light.

LED lighting is more efficient, thus more cost-effective.  It also lasts longer between replacements.


I have heard all those points before and I understand that they use less energy. It is just for esthetic reasons that I like the old ones and that I have sensitivity to whatever light range is emitted out of LED street lights. I have the same issue with headlights, the low beams on many modern cars are brighter than the high beams on my 2000 Silverado. I owned a Oldsmobile Cutlass from the 80's the had old style sealed beam headlights that worked nearly as good as modern LED headlights, they were very bright and lit up the street with yellow light instead of white. Needless to say I just cannot stand white and blue light.



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19 May 2023, 7:00 pm

Mountain Goat wrote:
Is a problem and a safety issue. The rural crossroads where the occasional street light was placed were often in areas of poor visibility so seeing other cars coming was crucial. The orange light helped with this as one had good view of the area and could tell if a car was coming or not before one pulled out.
Now it is guesswork as the bright white streetlights hide a cars lights even if they are at full beam, so with these poorly visible junctions and crossroads it is only a matter of time before a major accident takes place.
Also they have fitted Led type bulbs in traffic lights at pedestrian crossings and at night, as one passes these bright green lights, no way can one see if a pedestrian is waiting on the pavement at the crossing... So if someone goes to run across when the lights are green there is no way one will see them. With the old crossing lights one could see if someone was on the crossing as one was not being blinded by the green light. (On red one is stopping anyway so it does not matter).

These white streetlights should not be placed at rural junctions at all, and to prevent accidents it is urgent that the green and yellow on traffic lights should be dulled so that motorists are not blinded by them.
The new white streetlights are a bit pointless in some places as if one passes at night in some areas the light in front is turned off so the cameras inside the light fixture can see you, so the area one is is dark, and this happens a light at a time which is absolutely pointless! Why don't they have external cameras instead? (Can tell the ones with cameras inside them as they have little arials on top of the light itself.


Thanks for your input Mountain Goat, I have also noticed that the ability of my eyes to adjust from light to dark as been greatly diminished. I feel that whatever rage of light being used to eluminate roads should not affect one's night vision. One good example of lights that are used that do not affect night vision is red interior lights in police cars. Red lights do not effect night vision to the extent that yellow or white do. Police officers need to be able to go from writing notes in their logbooks to chasing a criminal down a dark alley or road. Now I am not avicating for red street lights because that is just silly but I do think a happy medium should be the goal.



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19 May 2023, 7:01 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
LED lights can be made in a range of temperatures (blue vs. yellow tint). The problem isn't inherent to LEDs, it's really a matter of the choice of LEDs.


I agree.



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19 May 2023, 7:07 pm

Think the issue maybe eye sensativity versus power sabings ,which is what makes these cheaper operating LEDs
more attractive to the area government bean counters , More money for them somehow . Saving that money on electricity. But It is a fact that , I have worked with many hues and spectrum colours of white and other variety of colours . In some of my variety of artsy craft and hobby projects . 8O :mrgreen:
Am thinking the people whom did these new installs ,City , county whatever? Perhaps did not Research this stuff , or perhaps the options where not made available to them ? :nerdy:


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19 May 2023, 10:11 pm

Here there's a bunch of freak-assed homeowners who install the god-forsaken things into the actual structure of their home as outdoor lighting. They put them in like pot-lights under the roofline, on soffits, or sometimes on the vertical stone walls so they shine laterally instead of pointing down. They're installed about 18" apart all the way around these homes. There's one house I see when I walk my dog at night which is lit up all the way around like a nuclear reactor or UFO, with that blaringly insipid white LED light which shines straight into the neighbour's windows when they're trying to sleep.

I don't know what the municipal bi-laws are but there's no way my neighbour would be doing that to me. The streetlights aren't an issue where I am, but the houses and car headlights are bright enough to fry bacon in the snow.


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19 May 2023, 10:47 pm

I have read and re-read the OP's posts.  Then it dawned on me that this may not be as much a problem of intensity as it is one of contrast.

Older streetlamps have a warm, orange-yellow glow that gently illuminates the surroundings.  Then, when a vehicle comes around, its headlamps throw out a bright, white beam that washes out the light from the streetlamps -- the contrasting colors and intensities making it obvious to observers that a vehicle is coming near.

Modern LED streetlamps and most vehicle headlamps produce almost the same spectrum of light -- bright and white.  When a vehicle is approaching from a blind curve or hill, there is little or no observable contrast in color or intensity of the light.  Thus, it is difficult to determine that a vehicle is coming.

I now believe that the OP has a point.



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19 May 2023, 11:23 pm

I like the old streetlights better as well. I find the yellowish orange glow warm and comforting.


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Deinonychus
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20 May 2023, 12:23 am

Jakki wrote:
Think the issue maybe eye sensativity versus power sabings ,which is what makes these cheaper operating LEDs
more attractive to the area government bean counters , More money for them somehow . Saving that money on electricity. But It is a fact that , I have worked with many hues and spectrum colours of white and other variety of colours . In some of my variety of artsy craft and hobby projects . 8O :mrgreen:
Am thinking the people whom did these new installs ,City , county whatever? Perhaps did not Research this stuff , or perhaps the options where not made available to them ? :nerdy:


I think you are right Jakki, I think it is all about saving money and to hell with such unimportant things like road safety and overall esthetics.



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Deinonychus
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20 May 2023, 12:31 am

IsabellaLinton wrote:
Here there's a bunch of freak-assed homeowners who install the god-forsaken things into the actual structure of their home as outdoor lighting. They put them in like pot-lights under the roofline, on soffits, or sometimes on the vertical stone walls so they shine laterally instead of pointing down. They're installed about 18" apart all the way around these homes. There's one house I see when I walk my dog at night which is lit up all the way around like a nuclear reactor or UFO, with that blaringly insipid white LED light which shines straight into the neighbour's windows when they're trying to sleep.

I don't know what the municipal bi-laws are but there's no way my neighbour would be doing that to me. The streetlights aren't an issue where I am, but the houses and car headlights are bright enough to fry bacon in the snow.


Your comment about headlighs cracked me up but it is so true. I have been hearing about people complaining about these LED street lights shining into their bedroom window and affecting their sleep at night. Municipalities have gone as far as attaching shields on the side of the light facing the house. But this is far from universal I think the city will only do it if you complain and who knows how long it would take to actually get the work done.



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20 May 2023, 12:32 am

CockneyRebel wrote:
I like the old streetlights better as well. I find the yellowish orange glow warm and comforting.


Agreed



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20 May 2023, 12:35 am

Personally, I would rather see what I am about to run over than enjoy a warm and comforting glow.



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20 May 2023, 12:36 am

Fnord wrote:
I have read and re-read the OP's posts.  Then it dawned on me that this may not be as much a problem of intensity as it is one of contrast.

Older streetlamps have a warm, orange-yellow glow that gently illuminates the surroundings.  Then, when a vehicle comes around, its headlamps throw out a bright, white beam that washes out the light from the streetlamps -- the contrasting colors and intensities making it obvious to observers that a vehicle is coming near.

Modern LED streetlamps and most vehicle headlamps produce almost the same spectrum of light -- bright and white.  When a vehicle is approaching from a blind curve or hill, there is little or no observable contrast in color or intensity of the light.  Thus, it is difficult to determine that a vehicle is coming.

I now believe that the OP has a point.


The problem for me is both intensity and contrast for me but I agree with your overall concussion.