"Diagnosing" celebrities and historical figures

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ASPartOfMe
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04 Jun 2018, 12:24 pm

This is a topic that comes up on and off regularly here. For a while the number of posts doing this was small but now it seems to be an in thing here and outside of WP. Lately, I noticed that often I am reading a blog, agreeing with it saying to myself "right on" when the inventible list of supposed autistic people comes up and ruins the experience for me. I am not talking about threads where people say they think someone is autistic based on so and so. I am talking about when it is stated that these people are autistic as fact, no caveats.

The idea is a good intentioned one and somewhat a natural reaction. Most autistics have been bullied, gaslighted, discriminated against for their autism and autistic traits. This was started by baby boomer/Gen X autistics during the 2000's who found out they were autistic very late in life. Using the example of other civil rights organizations they thought it was a good idea to highlight autistics with large accomplishments to debunk the notion among NT's and many autistics that being autistic makes one a ret*d loser destined to be a lifelong failure. It was and is a good idea. My problem is the way this tactic is often being lazily executed.

Right after I was first diagnosed I was seeing autistics everywhere. Others have reported the same thing.

To know whether a person is autistic one has be an autism expert and have a good idea of what the person was like as a child and their inner thoughts. That can only be done if it can be done at all on very limited bases for historical figures and celebrities. The problem with historical figures is that testimony from contemporaries may be misinterpreted because of words having a different context in their times. With celebrities, you have to be mindful that they often say things just to gain publicity for their latest project.

One can not be 100 percent sure about somebody's claim of Autism unless a diagnostic report is produced and vetted that it is real which is very unlikely to happen. So some unwanted compromising of standards and some degree of trust is necessary. That should not mean no standards and absolute trust. Because the person was or is a rebel or has little social filter, or seems quirky means the person might a rebel, has little social filter, and is quirky. It does not necessarily mean that person is autistic.

The first thing one should do is not believe the tons of internet lists of supposed autistic people out there. One should definitely not say so and so is autistic based on "I read it somewhere". At minimal the person should be quoted in a reputable source as saying they are autistic. Then the context of the person's claim should be looked at. A prime example is Dan Ackroyd who is often put on these lists of Autistic people. He is a quirky guy who did say he was diagnosed with Aspergers. But he said he was diagnosed in the early 80's and then he later said he was self-diagnosed. His "diagnosis" occurred at a time when Aspergers was barely known and then he changed his story. Autism claims for this guy have a large credibility problem.

IMHO the lazy diagnosing of celebrities and historical figures are often deluding autistics, propagating stereotypes, and giving those who think "mild" autism is fake or that we just need to try harder ammunition for their spurious claims. Autistics should not live our lives for the approval of NT's but that does not mean we should stupidly validate their bad thoughts or create bad thoughts about us.

This phenomenon seems unautistic to me, it is not "attention to detail" for sure.


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kraftiekortie
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04 Jun 2018, 12:38 pm

One really can't retroactively "diagnose" somebody with autism.

Speculation is okay, though. As in----it "seems like" so and so was autistic, based on so and so....



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04 Jun 2018, 12:44 pm

There are a lot of overlaps. The socially awkward will share autistic traits and gifted people and NVLD, and autistic traits are higher in computer programmers and engineers. I used to see aspies everywhere too. Anyone shy or a loner or an outcast or anyone who was weird or strange or had strange interests or strong interests. I think we do it to make ourselves feel better because deep down we want to be normal.


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random23
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05 Jun 2018, 7:17 am

I'm not a fan of "diagnosing" celebrities and historical figures either. I made a thread about this a few weeks ago, so I'll just copy-paste my opinion:

random23 wrote:
I don't know how you feel about this, but in the past I've gotten pretty annoyed by several people who keep claiming that famous people like Einstein, Mozart etc. had autism. The way I see it, you can't simply put a label on someone just like that. You need experts and a close examination for a proper diagnosis, which especially makes postmortal diagnoses nearly impossible, imo. Some may see it as a way to promote autism by shedding a positive light on it, but this just irritates me since it is based on pure speculation and, on top of that, quite ignorant (isn't it?). In the worst case, it might even nourish the stereotype that autism either means being "low functioning" and having zero mental capacity or being a genius who will come up with the next big scientific discovery or invention, leaving out the majority of autistic people who are a lot more ordinary than some people might believe.



Biscuitman
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05 Jun 2018, 9:06 am

diagnosing mental health conditions in others doesn't sit right with me, especially people I have never met.

I wouldn't want anyone doing that to me



Fnord
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05 Jun 2018, 9:14 am

Diagnosing mental conditions at all should be left to appropriately-trained and licensed mental-health professionals, whether in celebrities, historical figures, or one's own self.


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kraftiekortie
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05 Jun 2018, 9:45 am

You used to always say that LOL



Fnord
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05 Jun 2018, 9:46 am

The truth is always the truth.


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kraftiekortie
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05 Jun 2018, 9:51 am

The truth----shall set you free!

Isaac Newton MIGHT have been an Aspie or whatever. But we'll never know for sure.



EzraS
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05 Jun 2018, 10:10 am

My favorite is when cartoon characters get diagnosed. and I wish I was making that up.



Fnord
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05 Jun 2018, 10:23 am

EzraS wrote:
My favorite is when cartoon characters get diagnosed. and I wish I was making that up.
Fictional characters on TV shows -- are they autistic or is it just bad acting?

:roll:


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Trogluddite
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05 Jun 2018, 11:41 am

Fnord wrote:
Fictional characters on TV shows -- are they autistic or is it just bad acting?

Coincidentally, Cracked had this Photoplasty article yesterday - 22 Fictional Characters You Suspect Have Medical Conditions
I was very shocked that autistic conditions don't even get a mention. Even I've heard (ad nauseum) of Sheldon from Big Bang Theory despite not having had a TV for 20 years! :wink:


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