Daughter's resistance to help

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Hello everyone! At 16 and with one year left of high school, my daughter has just been diagnosed with Asperger's. While I expect no time is a good time to find out you're on the spectrum, this is a particularly challenging time, at least for us. She is on the cusp of adulthood, yet is nowhere near ready to go out into the world. She had a part-time job she was let go from (which was the last straw that spurred me on to getting this diagnosis). She lives in her little bubble and is perfectly happy there. She seemingly has zero motivation to get out of it.

Now, I will probably have MANY questions over the coming weeks, but here is the one I have for today. DS is VERY resistant to getting any outside help. She has always been like this, or at least over the past few years. Whether it is coping with school, finding out how to improve her grade in a class, or anything else, she absolutely refuses to go get help from teachers or anyone other than me (if that). She thinks she can handle it all on her own, despite years of evidence to the contrary.

Now that she has been diagnosed, she is as resistant as ever. She has next to no social skills. She is polite and can say hi and possibly how are you. )I know she has a great deal of empathy, but no real ability to show it.) Past that, unless the conversation is within her narrow zone of interests, she has no ability to talk with people. As a teen, getting a part-time job will be extremely difficult. And she has no motivation to change any of this. Zero. She says she knows she needs to develop these skills, but she thinks she can do it on her own, or just with my help.

So, I am thinking the next few weeks and months will be tough. I would welcome any advice you have to give. How much should I push or force her into getting professional help? I foresee holding back (temporarily) her phone and access to the other things she loves as motivation to get the help she needs, but I also know these function as a release for her, a place of solace and comfort. She'll be 17 this November, nearly an adult, but in many ways, not even close to adulthood.

How do I handle this?

Thanks!
Karen

Honestly, I feel that as long as she's not disrespectful to you, and as long as she's not a discipline problem in school, that you shouldn't take her phone away.

If she is disrespectful, and her grades are affected, then I might think about ways to offset this.

But as long as she's doing well in school, and is not disrespectful to people, that I wouldn't rock the boat so drastically.

I would give her time to accept her diagnosis.

With one year of school to go I doubt there is much that can be done to help her in terms of something to help her ASD with a school program or resources. Getting help is a double edged sword. Yes, it can be helpful. But it can also be very stressful. Which is what folks with autism need to avoid.

So, she may as well concentrate on graduating and dealing with her diagnosis.

To clarify, I did not mean taking her phone away as a sort of punishment or for an extended period of time. More as a motivation, to get focused and get something done, then get the phone back. In small doses at first. This is what the diagnosing psychiatrist suggested, since she has very few things that would motivate her to focus on the things that don't motivate her (if that makes any sense). In other words, she needs to learn to step away from her narrow interests and take care of herself, do the other things that life demands of all of us.

As for school, it is true she only has one more year left and it might seem like there isn't much to be done at this point, but she has been planning to apply to an animal care program at a collage that is in a different city (there is no such program where we live). The idea of her going away, even if she is in residence, and coping with living away from home, college life, and her studies is daunting even for me, let alone her. Should she take a year off in between? How quickly should, or even can we move with things?

I guess I am in a place where I want to help her move forward at a comfortable pace for her. It's finding a balance between moving forward and standing still, something she would be more than happy to do.

It might benefit her to take a year off from her studies, get a job, try to keep the job, then go to school the next year.

But then.....would this interruption in her studies deter her from pursuing those studies? Continuity is good for people with autism.

I'm thinking: perhaps you could have rules about the use of the phone. But not totally ban it. Because it's a guarantee that SHE will see it as a punishment. For kids of her generation, her phone is her lifeline, really. The phone has more of a function in a person's life than when we were kids.

I'm sure there will be other people who will have a different opinion. I would listen to those, too.

I don't think taking stuff away is motivational. It's more of a punishment.

Why would she do something you want her to if she sees no logical reason to do it?

I know that you know what the reason is, but to her this "you need to grow up and be an adult" is vague. I mean, do any if us ever achieve peak "adult"?

I own an apartment, do I win at "adulting"? I'm not in a relationship, never have been, do I lose?

Most kids these days, and 16 is a kid, not an adult, don't have part time jobs. It's not unusual. I'm not minimising her issues, but you might even be expecting too much from a regular 16 year old.

Maybe explain the practical things you want her to achieve. What steps she can take to get there.

What are her dreams for the future? Does she just expect to live at home forever, really?

I got my first job at 19 and burned out after 6 months. I got a morning cleaning job for an hour a day which I did for a year. My parents were patient with me. I think they probably didn't expect much from me.

I now have a really good job, I've got my own apartment, i actually have some friends.

I don't think my parents expected 16 year old me to achieve that.

Some NT teenagers aren't ready for the adult world. She might change when she gets a bit older. For now, give her some time to grow up a bit, as 16-17 years old is still young. Perhaps encourage her to go to college, if that is convenient (I don't know if there are local colleges available near you). Some teenagers to go college because they don't feel ready to go out into the big wide world quite yet. I think there should be a legal obligation where all kids leave school at 18 and no earlier. A lot of kids aren't 100% ready to start work until they are about 20 or 21. If college isn't really an option then I don't quite have any other suggestions unfortunately. But your daughter is a teenager and some teenagers can be stubborn and think they're more independent than they're capable of.

I wrote my post whilst you were writing yours.

Maybe she can't do the animal course straight away. It might be better to do some intermediary course in the meantime to prepare her.

I went to college in 1998 in the UK and tuition was free and I had a bursary, so it's probably more difficult to do that now financially. It helped me get an office job with the local council.

I did the course I really wanted to do at 25 when I was ready. Granted actually working in my field burned me out and I've had a career break, I just went back to admin for a bit, but I'm now in a really good job and coping ok so far.

I still don't agree with the psychologist about taking the phone away. She's not a dog that you train with treats.

Logic always worked best for me. I'm still that way, i don't like doing anything if there isn't a clear point to it. I'm not doing something just because someone else thinks I have to, never will.

I've responded in your other thread in the parents forum.

Sometimes the best way to grow is to just get out there and do things, and make mistakes and learn from them. If the animal care program is something she really wants (and is financially feasible), it might be a good way to get her to be more independent. If she can't handle part time work yet, perhaps try some volunteer work.

I'm autistic and can relate to the part about being very resistant to getting outside help. In fact it's been an issue my entire life and for me it stems from being misunderstood and having suggestions made that are common-sense and work for most people but are non-starters for me. A lot of it stems from those attempting to help not understanding the nature or intensity of sensory or social overwhelm and the reality of my inability to read social signals and give social signals. For an example, a person making what to them is the simple suggestion 'if you like her, just ask her on a date' often will think I'm shy or afraid of rejection when in reality I'm quite blind to subtle or non-verbal cues, which can lead to misunderstandings and conflict. And that can affect a work situation as well as social interactions. I had a great opportunity working as an intern in a microbiology lab doing fascinating part-time work the last two years of high-school, but that ended unpleasantly and abruptly when I thought the chief scientist there was taking a joking tone in reading a letter honoring his achievements to me and I laughed good-naturedly instead of taking it in solemnly, and his face turned beet red. That may be why your daughter thinks she can handle things better on her own, like I sometimes do - because I know my unusual strengths and weaknesses which others either don't understand or don't take seriously. I was fortunate and got pulled by events into college and the world of work and marriage, otherwise I might have ended up quite isolated. It can be helpful for understanding the dynamics of the situation to have the autism/Aspergers diagnosis. Does your daughter have access to a counselor who works with autistics? That could lead to increased trust and openness on her part to suggestions and help. During my 40-year career I regularly ran into situations where people thought I was eccentric or stand-offish because of my limitations that were invisible to them and over time that led to significant feelings of alienation. I hope that with your and her awareness that doesn't happen with your daughter.

Hello from Music City: very kind of you to want to help your daughter.

This one might sound a little harsh. I don't mean to be mean...unless you really do mean to modify your daughter.


I'm autistic/Asperger's too and there's nothing wrong with that. Here are a few ideas:

1. Could you try leaving your daughter alone, about the social stuff & "empathy" display? You know, it's a cruelty to force people to fake it. And this is not something that I would wish on anybody else--because people tried doing those stunts with me & I ended up losing ALL expression of empathy temporarily, and becoming worse with social stuff in general the more people forced me. Only time helped, and (this might seem painful) getting away from my family a little. That actually helped me to get better relationships with them.

2. About the "bubble." All of us autistic people have that. Please don't destroy that. We can't experience stability the same way that Neurotypical people do, so please don't trash her world. My room as a teenager was my pirate's island, my cove, my den and hideaway. It was where I went to listen to music (I had a wind-up Victor Victrola from 1914 that was literally like a dear friend to me), where I went to practice writing on the old typewriter that sat on the desk, where I laughed & cried and prayed and slept and read books and retreated from the brightly lighted, overwhelming world outside.

Now I'm just fifteen or twenty days away from finishing my debut novel, and people are saying it is quite good. I live in Nashville now and am making good.

About the autism?

I don't just "have autism" any more. I AM autism.

AUTISM is ME. All the aspects of my personality are so tied in with it that there is no way to tear it away. About your daughter? Love her. She is who she is. You are awesome for trying to do nice for her, for trying to help her.

It gets better.

Hang in there. It's good of you to want the best for your daughter.

Love,

Borromeo

Based on what I have read about the situation , without hearing the daughters take on things , I will say that the best thing that parents of a young adult / older teen on the spectrum can do to foster self reliance is to work with her in developing a planned set of life goals , and to make it clear to her that she will not be permitted to mooch off of her parents indefinitely . Without knowing what her mind's focus is though , I cannot be more specific . For instance , in my case , my " narrow interest" has been related to social studies in general , and I have been able to use this to motivate me to pursue and attain a degree in paralegal studies , plus a side degree in medical transcription . Since the daughter is interested in reptiles , in a way that is comparable to my interest in humans , perhaps she could go on to pursue a career path in herpetology . I actually know of two people whom have put such an interest to good use . http://realmofthereptile.com , https://www.cleveland.com/community/2019/07/jungle-terry-brings-live-animal-show-to-strongsville-library.html. And at least she's not like this one autistic second cousin I have who's preoccupied with manga , and anime . Eventhough she is a reasonably talented cartoonist , with a dream of someday becoming a voice actress , so far she just seems to be living with , and depending on her parents , without any career prospects in sight , same as when she was a girl . I think that for some autistic persons the world can seem like a big scary place , so their might be a temptation to withdraw into one's own world of make believe fantasy . But I think that what is needed most is room to develop , and mature as a person . At this stage of her life though , like any teenager , her purpose may primarily be to have fun .

So what is it specifically that you want her to develop? In what ways is she not prepared for adulthood? What is it about her social skills that are lacking? It's hard to tackle a problem without getting into specifics.

As for taking her phone away from her to "help her focus", really bad idea. Doing that will guarantee that you'll encounter resistance from her, and she'll be resentful. It'd be like if I took something of yours away from you for no good reason and told you that you need to work hard to get it back. You'd be pissed off, not motivated. You can't use something she already owns and is accustomed to using as a reward.

In saying that, you could make a deal with her wherein if she does certain things towards achieving the skills she's lacking, you'll buy something for her as a reward

As far as asking for help goes, I didn't like asking for help when I was in school/uni because it necessitated a social situation that I found undesirable (having to ask the teacher for help). This is especially true if asking for help in front of classmates.

I preferred to get my answers from the internet when I could, to avoid the undesirable social situation.

There's not a great deal of motivation to study and do schoolwork well when you don't have an end goal, or when it doesn't contribute to your end goal. I think another good idea would be to try to emphasise to your daughter how the skills and things you want her to learn will benefit her. Because if they won't, she won't be too motivated to work on them.

LivingPower,
Welcome to WP. We are very happy to have you and to help you.

I agree with EyeDash that it could be possible that she is reluctant to get help because the "help" that people may have offered her in the past is not the kind of help that makes any sense to her. This is a pretty common experience for us because we process information differently. She might be more willing to accept help if people can help her in a way that she is able to actually receive it.

The other thing that I am wondering is what her emotional and social ages are. If she is like many of us, she will be much younger socially and emotionally than her chronological age and at 16/17 she might not even realize that that is the case. But if that is true for her, it will greatly affect her ability to relate to other people and it will also greatly affect her ability to trust other people. That could be a reason why she only trusts you in certain areas.

These are definitely important factors to consider and can make a very big difference for her. It is possible that her reluctance to accept help could even be a defense mechanism because she does not feel safe. She might feel that she cannot trust anyone because of the reasons mentioned above. I do not accept "help" from people that I cannot trust. It is not safe for me to do so. They are a threat to me. If they do not understand that even though I am chronologically 52 but socially 10-12 and emotionally 4, they cannot help me in a way that I can receive the help because the "help" they try to give me will be inappropriate and often hurtful to me because depending on what it is, if it is not delivered in a way that is appropriate to the age at which my brain is functioning, or in a way that I can actually understand and process it, it is very threatening.

People also expect us to be helped when they offer help. But if we don't respond the way that they want or expect us to respond, they "punish" or make us feel bad for not responding the way they expected us to. And they expect us to understand all of the social innuendos and unwritten or unspoken parts of the help they are giving us and they expect us to respond accordingly. We do not have the ability to do that and often times we are reprimanded for our inability to respond accordingly so it can make receiving "help" from people who do not understand us very difficult and very threatening. So these might be a possibilities that you might want to explore.