"could you", "would you", "will you" and "can you"

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Until high school, I thought that the only grammatically correct way to make a request was "could you".

However in high school, some students said "can you"

K-12 schoolteachers and people with advanced degrees tend to say "would you".

For a long time I thought that "could you" was for difficult requests and "would you " for when the speaker knows the recipient is able to do it but is politely asking for courtesy's sake.

"Can you" is not clear if it means:
Are you allowed to
Do you know how
Request

But now that I have been working at home Depot for over four years, almost every request is "can you", no matter how hard it is.

Maybe the uneducated say "can you" because their precision of language is not that great. The educated say "would you" or "could you".

Hearing "can you" makes me want to puke because "can you please go commit suicide? You CAN do anything you set your mind to". "Can you" implies that just because you "can" do something, it means you "have to".

Semantics and pragmatics and linguistics

This is an element, but not the entirety. It's unreasonable to assume someone is uneducated because they use more vernacular speech vs. more formal speech. Lack of education and/or lack of concern over precision might have been the initial reasons for why can you came to widely be used in place of could/would you, but once it became common enough people elect to use it because it's how the people around them speak.




Most people don't want to be like Linguo the grammar robot, if everyone else uses and understands the phrasing they's throwing robots, they's throwing robots is perfectly acceptable to use, rather than they're throwing robots.

If everyone around a person phrases requests as can you... than one really needs to make peace with can you... being the way they will hear requests phrased. Being pedantic and judgmental over vernacular speech never comes off positively for the person engaging in it, it tends to be perceived as condescending and elitist. As much as you might be disgusted with regular people talking like regular people, do you think they're not disgusted to deal with that sort of condescending attitude from someone who isn't any better than them?

This is definitely an issue where learning to be more accepting of difference will improve your life because you're not going to change how regular people speak and they're not obliged to code-switch for the occasional pedant who over-reacts to hearing how regular people speak. You're under no obligation to be more accepting, but what benefit does it provide to you to have any negative emotional response over how something was said, so long as you understand what was meant? Especially when (unlike shouting or excessive swearing or other issues related to tone) it's not being done intentionally to provoke you, it's just how they'd talk to anyone.

I used to be pedantic about grammar, but then I realized that the point of language is to communicate, so as long as you're understood, you've used language correctly. I still tend to use very "good" grammar myself because I grew up in a very grammar-obsessed environment, but I have my limits. As of right now I always spell things "correctly", but I've considered (at least in informal contexts) switching to spelling everything phonetically, the way spelling is f**king supposed to work.

As a side note:

When I was a kid at school, you had to say "May I" if you were asking permission to do something. The teacher said it was impolite to say "Can I". But who actually does that anymore? We're lucky if people don't rudely do something without asking first because they don't think about others.

Let's ignore the strict interpretation of tense and speak colloquially.
Whereas they are all interchangeable in general intent, each can be used to convey nuances.

Could you? = Are you theoretically capable of?
Would you? = Are/will you be inclined to, given appropriate circumstances?
Will you? = When the time comes, are you going to?
Can you? = Are you practically capable of?

The word that converts them all into a request (and possibly change when) is "Please"
Thanks mum!

Wh we need I was in 4th grade, I remember that we weren't allowed to use the bathroom if we asked "Can I use the bathroom?" If we did the response was always "I don't know, can you? Are you physically able to?" We learned quickly the correct way to ask which was "May I...?" I know the OP seems like he's being picky, but he never stated he was openly being condescending towards his customers. He was simply asking us to give our input as to the proper way to ask these questions. Also, the answer to the OP's question about being physically able to commit suicide is purely dependent upon whatever higher entity you believe in. I once tried to OD on pills 2 years ago and the lord saved me. So in this case if you asked me if I can commit suicide right now, my answer would be probably not based on the last attempt. BTW, I do have counseling and am doing much better now.

utterly absurd

yes, grammar is part of it.

however, implications are also part of it. "can you" implies that just b/c you are physically capable of doing something ("can") you "have to" do it. which i find way too manipulative. on the other hand, i am officially diagnosed with autism, and, characteristic of autism, i tend to take statements at their literal interpretation instead of "you know what i meant".

besides, esp with manual labor, just b/c i "can" do something, doesn't mean i "should" do something. if/when i lift a heavy rock, i might get long term back pain, but of course, the coworker/customer doesn't know/care about that.

(misunderstanding)

I'd just leave for the bathroom if teachers tried to play that game with me. They understood what I meant and what I meant is I am leaving to use the bathroom. If they wanted to be pedantic over can vs. may I'd remind them it's only phrased as a question out of deference to authority and ultimately it's not a request, it's a statement of intention.

I'm entitled to use the bathroom as needed, their permission isn't required and informing them is a courtesy that I'm not obliged to follow if they insist on making a game of it.

In those cases it might be easier to merely reply I can if someone asks can you do whatever without making it clear that they're asking you to do whatever, rather than allowing their phrasing to bother you. Let them figure out that you need/want the question to be asked more clearly.

I was a bit pedantic about stuff like this until I took a linguistics class in college. As long as people are able to convey meaning, I don’t usually care about the grammar, word choices, spelling, or punctuation they use. If I don’t understand something, I ask for clarification. It’s not a problem.

twilight

granted. however i find it (*manipulative*) to say "can you" do something, b/c it implies that just b/c you "know how" to do it, you "have to" do it. (maybe annoying lil dipshits don't mean it that way. they have "freedom of speech").

It can only be as manipulative as one allows it to be. If you just treat as a question about your abilities it won't manipulate you, instead you'll gradually train those people to ask their question more precisely.

P1: Can you do x?
P2: I can.

Slowly they'll figure out that 'can you' doesn't imply 'will you'.

But dont forget your bag of treats

I've had English teachers like this & I grew up in the deep south & graduated high-school in 2001. High-school English teachers still teach Shakespeare despite the fact no one in the US ever talks that way outside of Shakespearean actors & sometimes English teachers. English teachers are failing their students by focusing on obsolete proper English instead of current popular English. I bet no corporate mangers ever talk like Shakespeare at work or when hiring people.

Last edited by nick007 on 10 Jan 2025, 4:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I guess most of those are just polite ways of issuing commands, for use when it might come across as too blunt to just tell somebody to do a thing. What annoyed me the most was when a supervisor used to say "would you like to......" Usually followed by some boring task that I doubt many people would like to do. OTOH I don't suppose I'd have liked it any better if I'd been bluntly ordered to do whatever it was.

You're correct that those phrases have proper grammatical meanings that are somewhat abused in everyday life. But being polite or diplomatic makes the world go round, and diplomacy is full of understatements and blows that are softened by the use of inaccuracies. If you call a spade a spade, it might not go down very well. It's all pretty illogical of course, but then humans aren't particularly logical animals.

One thing I hate is when the media, gov, or business leaders talk about "asking" people to pay more or to do this or that, when what they're actually doing is forcing them. We're "asked" to pay more tax, higher prices, work longer hours, but they don't give us any choice.