Why we are so obsess with representing ASD as angels?

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AsaboveAsbelow
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27 Jan 2025, 3:57 pm

I hate this thing about disability, if a person got it you need to take granted this person is a good one... which is unsensical.
That's why I love that an i*d*ot as Elon Musk said he is, at least people understand that we are humans like everybody.
But is like every other disability, you are a human.
I mean even Dan Aykroyd is ASD and he is absolutely an amazing person, simple being autism =/= being good or bad.
A person got inner values, some are good some are bad... whatever is the disability, disability isn't linked with personal values.
That's why I think should be exist a coming out for disabilities such as ASD too.
A disable person can be an a**hole as be the best person in this world... there's no link.

Representing disabled people as angels is abilism too.


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SocOfAutism
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Yesterday, 2:09 pm

I completely agree with this.

It's easy to fall into the mindset that we're each a hero in our own minds, and others who seem similar to us are on our side...the "good guys."



AsaboveAsbelow
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Yesterday, 6:16 pm

SocOfAutism wrote:
I completely agree with this.

It's easy to fall into the mindset that we're each a hero in our own minds, and others who seem similar to us are on our side...the "good guys."


Exactly, and it is abilism too


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Nibiruninki88
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Yesterday, 8:38 pm

It’s a good question. Maybe the picture the media shows of autism also contributes to that? I know that people on the spectrum can be toxic and manipulative just like anyone else. The way it works may be different from neurotypical though.


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Yesterday, 10:36 pm

I agree. For some time there has been this idea that a person with a disability must be a good person, and some spectrum people have been quick to talk about how kind, understaning and empathic they are. It's like the world needs to portray disabled people as good, and (some) disabled need to appear good.

We're all just people, and like everyone else we all have good and bad sides. I'd be more worried if it wasn't the case.

I also think being an a**hole or a good person has little to do with reality. Sure you'll find some extremes, but most people are both, and will act differently in different settings, based on many different factors like situation, mood, the people involved, contemporary views, consequences, age and more.


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Yesterday, 11:23 pm

I thought NTs usually believed that we're all demons and not angels. I know at least one Bible-Thumper claimed that we are.

Or is it just the high-support autistic children who have meltdowns constantly and spit and scratch and bite and aren't potty-trained by the time they're 5?

No, that can't be true. Before, during and after my diagnoses with Asperger's, "angel" is the last thing anyone would have called me. :evil:



lostonearth35
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Yesterday, 11:33 pm

People think Asperger's and Autism are two different things and that Asperger's makes you a nasty, antisocial jerk.

I don't mean antisocial as in "asocial", which simply means not wanting to socialize, but antisocial as in being rude or nasty and not caring if it upsets people.

I even once saw a sketch on Robot Chicken where there's a character called B*ch Pudding, and when she is nasty to Baby Needs-A-Name by giving her a name with a swear word in it, Strawberry Shortcake says afterwards, "I'm so sorry, I think she's got Asperger's or something". It felt like they just threw that part in randomly, though.



Stargazer99
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Today, 12:41 am

Hmm. I haven’t ever heard of anyone on the autism spectrum referred to as an angel. Can you give an example?

Usually I hear society describe us as a stereotype, like Sheldon Cooper, which really isn’t accurate either. The Big Bang Theory often infantilizes the spectrum characters as well, which is offensive. (The girlfriends on the show behave like controlling mothers towards their boyfriends.)

People are more likely to gaslight us because we sometimes miss social cues.



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Today, 1:41 am

I wasn't aware that Aspies are particularly popular in the world. In fact I thought it was the reverse, if anything, with NTs tending to read bad motives into our behaviour. Find the As Partners forum for NTs if you don't believe me. Maybe there are some who overreact against the bad press and won't see any wrong in us, but I don't think it's especially common. There's good and harm in everybody, obviously. Angels and demons are just oversimplified fairy tales and I think most people appreciate that unless they're somewhat "paranoid." You might get a bit of whitewashed hype from advocates, just like you'll get whitewashed hype from marketers in general.



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Today, 2:06 am

This idea of representing disabled people as angels makes me think of how PARENTS of disabled people are made out to be the angels or the perfect parents. Well dang, that is so untrue. Just because someone has a disabled child doesn't mean they're a good parent or are smart about protecting that child and keeping them safe, or that they've done nearly everything possible to ensure that child's safety. That is bull.

This is why when I read about an autistic child eloping and being found dead in a pond, my first and only thought is to place blame on the parents, NOT the autism.

In these kinds of cases I don't believe for a second that the parents "did everything possible."

For example, none of these kids ever had a single swim lesson. There was one case where the door alarm had been OFF. One autistic teen was outside in the cold in only a diaper. How does this happen without neglect on the part of the parents?

So just because someone has a disabled kid doesn't mean they can't be incompetent as parents.



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Today, 10:32 am

I am not sure that Dan Akroyd is Autistic. I think he eventually said he was not. I am not sure.


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Today, 1:02 pm

skibum wrote:
I am not sure that Dan Akroyd is Autistic. I think he eventually said he was not. I am not sure.


I read he got tested in the 1980s and that's how he got diagnosed. He claims a lifelong special interest in ghosts.



AsaboveAsbelow
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Today, 2:37 pm

Nibiruninki88 wrote:
It’s a good question. Maybe the picture the media shows of autism also contributes to that? I know that people on the spectrum can be toxic and manipulative just like anyone else. The way it works may be different from neurotypical though.

Oh, absolutely... they came out with "Steve Jobs is ASD" which is stupid.

Redpaws wrote:
agree. For some time there has been this idea that a person with a disability must be a good person, and some spectrum people have been quick to talk about how kind, understaning and empathic they are. It's like the world needs to portray disabled people as good, and (some) disabled need to appear good.

We're all just people, and like everyone else we all have good and bad sides. I'd be more worried if it wasn't the case.

I also think being an a**hole or a good person has little to do with reality. Sure you'll find some extremes, but most people are both, and will act differently in different settings, based on many different factors like situation, mood, the people involved, contemporary views, consequences, age and more.

I love THIS representation because she isn't bad or good, she is a woman. In general American Horror Story is a good show.


lostonearth35 wrote:
I thought NTs usually believed that we're all demons and not angels. I know at least one Bible-Thumper claimed that we are.

Or is it just the high-support autistic children who have meltdowns constantly and spit and scratch and bite and aren't potty-trained by the time they're 5?

No, that can't be true. Before, during and after my diagnoses with Asperger's, "angel" is the last thing anyone would have called me. :evil:
-----
People think Asperger's and Autism are two different things and that Asperger's makes you a nasty, antisocial jerk.

I don't mean antisocial as in "asocial", which simply means not wanting to socialize, but antisocial as in being rude or nasty and not caring if it upsets people.

I even once saw a sketch on Robot Chicken where there's a character called B*ch Pudding, and when she is nasty to Baby Needs-A-Name by giving her a name with a swear word in it, Strawberry Shortcake says afterwards, "I'm so sorry, I think she's got Asperger's or something". It felt like they just threw that part in randomly, though.


Me tooooo... but you know. Eh. They are stupid.

Stargazer99 wrote:
Hmm. I haven’t ever heard of anyone on the autism spectrum referred to as an angel. Can you give an example?

Usually I hear society describe us as a stereotype, like Sheldon Cooper, which really isn’t accurate either. The Big Bang Theory often infantilizes the spectrum characters as well, which is offensive. (The girlfriends on the show behave like controlling mothers towards their boyfriends.)

People are more likely to gaslight us because we sometimes miss social cues.

You are the lucky one!
I mean.


ToughDiamond wrote:
I wasn't aware that Aspies are particularly popular in the world. In fact I thought it was the reverse, if anything, with NTs tending to read bad motives into our behaviour. Find the As Partners forum for NTs if you don't believe me. Maybe there are some who overreact against the bad press and won't see any wrong in us, but I don't think it's especially common. There's good and harm in everybody, obviously. Angels and demons are just oversimplified fairy tales and I think most people appreciate that unless they're somewhat "paranoid." You might get a bit of whitewashed hype from advocates, just like you'll get whitewashed hype from marketers in general.

People cannot understand that nothing is black and white, and I say it that I see world black and white.
Elgee wrote:
This idea of representing disabled people as angels makes me think of how PARENTS of disabled people are made out to be the angels or the perfect parents. Well dang, that is so untrue. Just because someone has a disabled child doesn't mean they're a good parent or are smart about protecting that child and keeping them safe, or that they've done nearly everything possible to ensure that child's safety. That is bull.

This is why when I read about an autistic child eloping and being found dead in a pond, my first and only thought is to place blame on the parents, NOT the autism.

In these kinds of cases I don't believe for a second that the parents "did everything possible."

For example, none of these kids ever had a single swim lesson. There was one case where the door alarm had been OFF. One autistic teen was outside in the cold in only a diaper. How does this happen without neglect on the part of the parents?

So just because someone has a disabled kid doesn't mean they can't be incompetent as parents.


EXACTLY, we are humans.
skibum wrote:
I am not sure that Dan Akroyd is Autistic. I think he eventually said he was not. I am not sure.

Elgee wrote:
I read he got tested in the 1980s and that's how he got diagnosed. He claims a lifelong special interest in ghosts.


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"Before selling his soul to the painting, he didn’t see it was a caricature He doesn’t seek a pact with the devil if it’s an eternal pain And he lives on the edge between a flying castle and a world inland Now a shadow moves in Italy, stealing while pretending to be a parody Do you know a road, perhaps a secondary one? Gondolier, take him away"
Rancore - Arlecchino