Very intersting theory

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Continuing on from the discussion about Aspergers occuring with greater frequency in people of Celtic descent, I suggested this may be linked to the supposed interbreeding between Homo Sapiens and Homo Neanderthalis around 100,000 years ago. A quick google showed I wasn't the first person thinking on these lines:

http://www.rdos.net/eng/asperger.htm

Weren't not on the wrong planet. We are just the wrong species

This would show that Eurpoeans would have a greater perchance for Asperger's, not really the Celts. The Celts are relative late comers to the European scene, so with the idea of Asperger's being a Neanderthal trait you would expect more prevalence among Scandanavians and the people of the British Isles who ruled before the Celts came in and killed them off than among Celts. (Many Druid ceremonies are traced back to those people, and not really the Celts. The Celts just adapted some of the practices of those people) The Celts were originally from Eastern Europe, and were pushed around until they found the British Isles an easy conquest and settled it until the other people decided to move into there, too.

Paleoanthropologists don't know what happened to Neandertals. Some have proposed they were dissolved into Cro-Magnon by interbreeding. Opponents to this use the evidence that both species' Mitochondrial DNA holds firm that we never interbred. But then again, that doesn't make it impossible for male Neandertals to have bred with female Cro-Magnons.

With the whole Celtic Neanderetal Aspergian thingy, Neandertals have mostly been found around Central Europe and if there were interbreeding and Neandertals are actually old Aspergers, I would think far more people would be Aspies.

I know that this is heretical around here, but I've always believed that Asperger's is not genetic. Like cancer, I think that there is a genetic predisposition that can be passed on, but I do not think that Asperger's itself is inherited. That's why it shows up in families, but skips many generations sometimes. I think that ultimately it is conditions in the womb that determine if a person has Asperger's or not. If Asperger's were truly genetic, then couplings of two people with Asperger's would end up with Asperger's children because of the recessive genetics. But many times the coupling comes up with NT children, which should not be the case. Just something to think about.

I have sometimes wondered if we don't have some kind of predisposition to certain infections in utero or a tendency to be difficult births, etc, which inevitably cause a certain amount of brain dammage or alter the developing brain in some way.

It's seems there is a conspicuous amount of Aspies who have prenatal, perinatal, or early postnatal problems/abnormalities.

Coincidence???

Given the (predominantly negative and quite possibly untrue) stereotyped casting of 'Neanderthal Man' and its conflation with the behaviour contemporary urban males, I would think that this would be entirely de rigeur.

How 'early' is early when it comes to post-natal complications? Would the mother's diet, state of mind, behaviour, use of alcohol, etc have any bearing on this catalogue of subtractive factors that could be held to precipitate AS/ASD-like behaviour, if not the condition itself?

The article mentioned in a previous posting certainly contains some controversial propositions - I wonder whether this would get in the way of it being taken seriously?

I was kinda thinking within the first two years of life.

I had read a study which included AS individuals who had Fetal Alcohol Syndrome so I assume they must be out there.

Also, for myself I often wonder if the milk allergy which became apparent after my birth didn't have effect in utero since milk was just about all my mother drank and if I wasn't having some sort of infectious reactions in the womb.

We're the missing link!! !

Have you heard of Cheddar man? He was a skeleton from the ice age (before the celts arrived in britain) who was genetically linked to a man which lived nearby. This shows that the British people are genetically mostly the same as they were when the ice age hunters first arrived there. All that has changed was the culture, language, etc. But in this case it's the genes that matter.

That would be something interesting to do a survey on... see if there is any possible connection between early childhood life and AS. A little bit random, but Sophist, are you lactose intollerant or allergic to milk? Most people who are lactose intollerant can take a special pill that prevents them from becoming sick, but people who are allergic to milk cannot. Many times, however, the terms are used fairly interchangeably and without much discretion. I was just wondering...

OK, for this theory to be true, there would have to be a higher incidence of AS in people of European decent. Anyone have information on that?

Well Hans Asperger discovered it in Europe....I think their are more Europeans than Americans that have AS with what i have been reading and hearing around.

I wish so much that AS could be figured out........I have heard that autistic children or children with AS after they are born have accelerated brain growth in mass. Our brains are suppose to grow and be much larger earlier between 1-6 years old and this fast growth is what makes usthe way we are. By the time we are the age 12-15 NT's are the same as us in brain mass and weight its just that we have faster growth from birth to 4 or 5 years of age. As NT's have gradual growth.

What do you think?

This is mostly a cultural thing, though. In the early 20th Century, I do not believe that psychological research was very big in Africa, or Southeast Asia. Using this logic it can be concluded that Asperger's Syndrome wasn't prevalent until the 1940's. If this is the case, then it definitely has nothing to do with Neanderthal genes.

Don't forget that in Europe it is far more likely for what the US labels HFA to all be classified under Aspergers since more professionals over there seem to want it all called such instead of dividing the two. Therefore you can have Aspies and HFAers all under the umbrella term of "Aspie".

Also for this to be true, there should be zero incidence of Asperger's in those of Asian, or Austrailian Aboriginal decent.

Using the mitocondrial DNA evidence used before, someone stated that it is possible that only male Neanderthals mated with Female Cro-Magnons. Actually, there are four posibilities:

1) There was no mating between the species. (Acepted theory)
2) Only Males of one species mated with females of the other. (Possible, but unlikely)
3) Interspecies mating did not produces offspring. (Possible, but unlikely)
4) Interspecies mating produced offspring that were sterile. (Actually most likely scenario)

I don't know why we are all so big into trying to prove that we are not human. Maybe it would comfort some of us, and lead others to select a mate based on species survival. But that smacks of eugenics and fascism. Unfortunately I am seeing more and more fascist aspies out there. I'm trying to make a difference, trying to teach people tolerance in both directions. But these younger people don't want to tolerate. They just want to differentiate. It makes me sad to see that this is our future. These kids always say "but they treat us this way, so we treat them the same way." A life for a life and a truth for a truth. Nothing but hatred comes about from this.

We're Aspies. We should be good at thinking logically. Yet you still keep using this same faulty logic, even though you should know better. I feel like I'm banging my head against a brick wall. You keep saying that you want tolerance from NTs. That's not going to happen if you don't show tolerance toward them. Yet you keep expecting them to make the first move. They are the dominate ones in the situation, they don't have to make the first move.

One thing that really drove this home to me was PhoenixKitten's new avatar. The one that basically says "There is no cure for autism, so if you want to be cured go kill yourself." I think that this spirit is just as bad as those who try to sell the bogus cures, or the rabid mothers who want to use these cures. Nobody wants to listen to reason. And this is just sad, because we of all people should love to listen to reason.

I came here for help. And I did find some help. But now we are no longer about helping each other and more about protesting finding a cure (protest all you want, they're not going to find one). All we care about is the division between AS and NT. All we care about is Us versus Them, Celtic/European versus the rest of the world, aren't we so much better than the NTs, aren't our European ancestors so much better than the Africans. This hate-filled atmosphere is the polar opposite of anything that is conducive to helping or healing.

I am sure that many of you will celebrate this post. This is my last post here. Goodbye.

More likely that it passes the time.

PS- I know an Aspie who is Chinese and lives in Hong Kong.